Honkai Cosmology Rework

[FriendOfTheTeaParty]

Sorry if this sounds stupid. But can insignificant higher extra dimensions can do like this??

You're again missing the whole point.

 

[SuperNova55555]

You're again missing the whole point.

He has to be doing it on purpose atp

 

[Weaver261]

I am simply asking a question for a subject I am not familiar with. If u think I am doing it on purpose, be my guest lol

 

[AyOgUyS]

chill y'all remember at the end of the day this is just a video game

 

[Mbpoops]

not sure if this helps either points but heres more blantant r>f statements from nagamitsu and tesla. (yes the is the entire scan i dont want to be disingenuine and leave out context)

 

[Mbpoops]

chill y'all remember at the end of the day this is just a video game

at the end of the days its all for fun right

 

[SuperNova55555]

not sure if this helps either points but heres more blantant r>f statements from nagamitsu and tesla. (yes the is the entire scan i dont want to be disingenuine and leave out context)

This is just explaining ITs shitty MWI. Nothing with R>F here

 

[Mbpoops]

This is just explaining ITs shitty MWI. Nothing with R>F here

would it not be R>F since they are talking about beings outside their world that can alter the time of their world like a video game? the places mentioned are the SoQ and the imaginary tree which everyone agreed upon are higher dimensions and view the lower ones as fiction via the welt scan

 

[Mbpoops]

would it not be R>F since they are talking about beings outside their world that can alter the time of their world like a video game? the places mentioned are the SoQ and the imaginary tree which everyone agreed upon are higher dimensions and view the lower ones as fiction via the welt scan

even the anaology says to view it as a game and the people playing the game (the observers) can select save points from the game and alter it (which techically otto does at the end of thus spoke apocolypse)

 

[PedjaTarzan]

would it not be R>F since they are talking about beings outside their world that can alter the time of their world like a video game? the places mentioned are the SoQ and the imaginary tree which everyone agreed upon are higher dimensions and view the lower ones as fiction via the welt scan

It is accepted as +1D r>f not 1-A one

 

[Bahaha]

you should stop assuming that every higher dimensional realm in honkai must be inside imaginary space.

maybe if imaginary space got affected but scans literally say otherwise

Pedja, I have an inquiry. You agree that Real Space and SoQ are in the same dimensionality, so Imaginary Space is a higher dimension because you argue it doesn't get affected by the "lower dimension" SoQ, yet you contradict yourself later on?

What do you genuinely believe? Where do you think Alien Space is, what level of dimension do you think IT, SoQ, Real Space, Imaginary Space, etc have? If the only valid dimensional superiority feat doesn't exist in Real Space or Imaginary Space then why would IT be dimensionally superior to SoQ in your opinion?

 

[Mbpoops]

I am quite sure "IT > SoQ" Are never been in the case, like they always have narrtive where as being equal and endless rivalry.

IT > SoQ is can be funny enough cause IT region sometimes can get outweight by SoQ influence

ive always been pretty iffy on the tree > soq thing (kinda just accepted it) but i mean this kinda outright confirms they are on the same dimensionality. the whole unrivaled thing could literally just mean the tree > soq but they exist on the same dimensionality

 

[Mbpoops]

has anyone actually played part 2 and can debunk that because its pretty blantant to me

 

[Mbpoops]

Theather of domination is in limbo now

wouldnt it also not qualify for scaling since its considered an extra dimension?

edit: updated the linlk

 

[PedjaTarzan]

wouldnt it also not qualify for scaling since its considered an extra dimension?

edit: updated the linlk

doesnt mention theather but power of herrscher of dominance

Pedja, I have an inquiry. You agree that Real Space and SoQ are in the same dimensionality, so Imaginary Space is a higher dimension because you argue it doesn't get affected by the "lower dimension" SoQ, yet you contradict yourself later on?

What do you genuinely believe? Where do you think Alien Space is, what level of dimension do you think IT, SoQ, Real Space, Imaginary Space, etc have? If the only valid dimensional superiority feat doesn't exist in Real Space or Imaginary Space then why would IT be dimensionally superior to SoQ in your opinion?

wheres the contradiction here? no scan ever mentioned IMG space being affected
Alien space is like either 4D via Ryusuke>Welt or 5D because its above Real Space thats so simple
Imaginary Space SHOULD be beyond dimensional because of welt scans and SoQ would be 5D, i am literally using whats accepted in super nova latest thread except for imaginary space which doesnt get affected by gravity and weapons capable of affecting all dimensions

 

[PedjaTarzan]

has anyone actually played part 2 and can debunk that because its pretty blantant to me

if you read the scans properly coralie only said “thats assuming if sea overweighs the tree” but the explanation is literally that only mars has the propery where sea is more dominant than the tree and whats worse is that its just affecting PLANET which means it affects only real space but only on a planetary scale

 

[Mbpoops]

Oh, so we goes with the path of IT > SoQ, interesting, if that is the case, then IT will be Low Complex Multiverse while SoQ goes down to Low 2-C, which perfectly fit the VN statement about it only have 4 infinite dimensions and IT being higher-dimensional compare to 4D space-time

its never stated the SoQ only has infinite 4 dimensions only the universe "they were familiar with"

 

[Mbpoops]

if you read the scans properly coralie only said “thats assuming if sea overweighs the tree” but the explanation is literally that only mars has the propery where sea is more dominant than the tree and whats worse is that its just affecting PLANET which means it affects only real space but only on a planetary scale

so mars is just in a bad spot where the SoQ can influence it more than the tree

 

[Mbpoops]

doesnt mention theather but power of herrscher of dominance

fair enough. i couldnt really remember when the HoD used her powers outside of the theatre domain but otto did use the HoD power in the real world so that makes sense seeing as they state he tampered with it

edit: HoD did use it's powers to raid hyperion and capture kiana

 

[PedjaTarzan]

so mars is just in a bad spot where the SoQ can influence it more than the tree

yea thats the only thing it doesnt serve as an anti feat for img space whatsoever, real space is fodder anyway Zephyro can solo it

 

[SuperNova55555]

would it not be R>F since they are talking about beings outside their world that can alter the time of their world like a video game? the places mentioned are the SoQ and the imaginary tree which everyone agreed upon are higher dimensions and view the lower ones as fiction via the welt scan

It's an allegory bro. It's obviously an allegory.

The "video game" is just the various branching choices in the Imaginary Tree. And beings "outside" can affect the branches or time itself like Otto and Nous.

 

[Vesxpura]

This is so bad, i dont think OP has ever read the tiering system page. It explicitly states something needs to be BEYOND the cardinality of real coordinate space(aleph 2+) to qualify as h1-B.

in any case i disagree heavily

 

[SuperNova55555]

This is so bad, i dont think OP has ever read the tiering system page. It explicitly states something needs to be BEYOND the cardinality of real coordinate space(aleph 2+) to qualify as h1-B.

in any case i disagree heavily

First decent vespura take?

 

[Mbpoops]

It's an allegory bro. It's obviously an allegory.

The "video game" is just the various branching choices in the Imaginary Tree. And beings "outside" can affect the branches or time itself like Otto and Nous.

so why wouldnt the beings outside the branch qualify for r>f?

 

[SuperNova55555]

so why wouldnt the beings outside the branch qualify for r>f?

And they scale to the temporal dimension. That's still 4D or 5D if you count Sugar Space

 

[Voidnether]

Oh, so we goes with the path of IT > SoQ, interesting, if that is the case, then IT will be Low Complex Multiverse while SoQ goes down to Low 2-C, which perfectly fit the VN statement about it only have 4 infinite dimensions and IT being higher-dimensional compare to 4D space-time


1. Nothing here stated Aeons have to descend to physical plane, the text simply say the arbiter had descend onto physical plane,

2. The projection scan is fine, but the physical plane is only 4D, so it just help the 5D argument


This scan?. Oke so what is the "reality" in this context? Is it referring to the Sea or just the World Durandal is standing within at that moment?


Yeah, it can't be described in a 3 or 4-dimensional mathematical framework, because it is a 11D structure with 4 dimensions extend infinitely and 7 extra compactified dimensions

Also, the funny part is later we have this

Yeah, not 4, just 3 dimensions, it is like the devs keep debunking themselves


No either you goes with IT > SoQ which make SoQ go down to Low 2-C, or IT = SoQ, with both of them being Low 1-C


1. This scans i guess, there are two problems

• The first is that the statement exists in a vacuum, and we don't know what it applies to, and probably I remember this wrong but back in the day of the VN, Imaginary Tree wasn't a thing. and if it point toward SoQ, then the 11D statement just contradict the infinite dimensions statement
• The second is how the statement was phrased; they all stated "can" which implies abstract potentiality, not physical actuality. So the meaning of Einstein's statement is that spatial dimension can potentially have infinite amount, not that there are infinite spatial dimensions already existing

2. I think I already went over the Transfinite argument back in Low 1-A thread, and Super Nova already argued about this. There is no High 1-B+ here. I remember a thread also discuss this; you can have cardinality with 0-dimension, and uncountable infinitely multiplying it still result in 0-dimension since stacking up 0-dimensional points does not mean you are adding another direction. So Einstein's transfinite statement is a non-factor statement that affect almost nothing,

So i disagree with this thread, or, downgrade SoQ to Low 2-C if you want to argue IT > SoQ

The problem is that Sea of Quanta naturally contains 4-D Bubble Worlds in an infinite amount, so it's impossible for it to be 4-D given there's literal statement it cannot be described in a 4 dimensional framework either.

 

[Mbpoops]

The problem is that Sea of Quanta naturally contains 4-D Bubble Worlds in an infinite amount, so it's impossible for it to be 4-D given there's literal statement it cannot be described in a 4 dimensional framework either.

which isnt even bringing up ether anchors that should be at least 5D for transcending the bubble world

 

[Voidnether]

This is so bad, i dont think OP has ever read the tiering system page. It explicitly states something needs to be BEYOND the cardinality of real coordinate space(aleph 2+) to qualify as h1-B.

in any case i disagree heavily

Characters or objects who can significantly affect, create and/or destroy infinite-dimensional space. Characters who can meddle with spaces with uncountably infinite or above dimensions should have a "+" modifier in their Attack Potency section (High Hyperverse level+).

Uncountably infinite is aleph-1 dimensions.

 

[SuperNova55555]

Uncountably infinite is aleph-1 dimensions.

You are conflating cardinality for cardinality of dimensions. Aleph-1 dimensions is High 1-B because Aleph-1^Aleph-1 is Aleph-2 through Continuum Hypothesis.

Aleph-2 is "too big" for any standard coordinate space, which includes infinite spatial dimensions and the like.

I'm not sure how you keep misunderstanding this fact, even after it's been explained to you a dozen times.

 

[Mbpoops]

You are conflating cardinality for cardinality of dimensions. Aleph-1 dimensions is High 1-B because Aleph-1^Aleph-1 is Aleph-2 through Continuum Hypothesis.

Aleph-2 is "too big" for any standard coordinate space, which includes infinite spatial dimensions and the like.

I'm not sure how you keep misunderstanding this fact, even after it's been explained to you a dozen times.

could you just link the page regarding alephs atp so we can all read it

 

[Voidnether]

You are conflating cardinality for cardinality of dimensions. Aleph-1 dimensions is High 1-B because Aleph-1^Aleph-1 is Aleph-2 through Continuum Hypothesis.

Aleph-2 is "too big" for any standard coordinate space, which includes infinite spatial dimensions and the like.

I'm not sure how you keep misunderstanding this fact, even after it's been explained to you a dozen times.

Yeah but uncountably infinite amount of dimensions is still Aleph-1 since it's naturally Aleph-0^Aleph-0 which is infinite exponented by infinite, Aleph-2 is just transcending conventional dimensions (which includes Aleph-1, albeit its uncountably infinite) that's why it's 1-A back in the old tiering system before Ultima

 

[SuperNova55555]

could you just link the page regarding alephs atp so we can all read it

Tiering System FAQ

A: Whether higher-dimensional entities qualify for such high tiers or not depends on several different factors, which may take root both in and out-of-verse. To explain this situation, we must first clarify what exactly being higher-dimensional entails. In a way, yes, though not how most would...

vsbattles.fandom.com

 

[Voidnether]

Tiering System FAQ

A: Whether higher-dimensional entities qualify for such high tiers or not depends on several different factors, which may take root both in and out-of-verse. To explain this situation, we must first clarify what exactly being higher-dimensional entails. In a way, yes, though not how most would...

vsbattles.fandom.com

Just so you know I always brought up the cardinality of dimensions btw, it was never about the regular Aleph-0 stuff which is 0-D because I kept mentioning "dimensions" after the Aleph stuff, even for CoF to be 0-D is impossible since it lacks dimensions anyway

 

[AyOgUyS]

at the end of the days its all for fun right

exactly

 

[SuperNova55555]

Yeah, throughout the entire HI3rd it was always the case

Yo big bro, if you had any doubts, it turns out the infinite dimension thing actually has no cosmological implications lelel. It's him stating a theory js like the hilbert stuff

 

[Vesxpura]

Just so you know I always brought up the cardinality of dimensions btw, it was never about the regular Aleph-0 stuff which is 0-D because I kept mentioning "dimensions" after the Aleph stuff, even for CoF to be 0-D is impossible since it lacks dimensions anyway

The problem with this is, ive yet to seen anything on the likes aleph-1 of dimensionality, and fyi dont appeal to hilbert spaces, they are fundamentally different in dimensionality and arent even physically real to begin with, so even if the verse treats it as physical it still wont qualify for proper spatial dimensionality unless the verse elaborates it that way.

 

[ExcelsisBerny]

Yo big bro, if you had any doubts, it turns out the infinite dimension thing actually has no cosmological implications lelel. It's him stating a theory js like the hilbert stuff

Oh wow, another obscure scan being completely taken out of context. I will pretend to be surprised.

 

[Mbpoops]

https://honkai-impact-3rd-archives.fandom.com/wiki/Reading_Resources Im gonna leave this here aswell for the peiple who srent in the discussion board but this is the link to play the durandal and AE vns. Half of my tabs are now just imgur from ss so much stuff since apparently no one has seen the games other than the specific statements on the cosmology page

 

[Mbpoops]

I still dont agree with low 2-c SoQ since ethee anchors are higher dimensional and transcend the bubble world they were familiar with which was stated by iron mask to be infinite 4D finite 7D and if we are saying the sea is the bulk that contains the ether anchor point, anchors, and infinite bubble universes it should be 5-6D minimum

 

[Voidnether]

The problem with this is, ive yet to seen anything on the likes aleph-1 of dimensionality, and fyi dont appeal to hilbert spaces, they are fundamentally different in dimensionality and arent even physically real to begin with, so even if the verse treats it as physical it still wont qualify for proper spatial dimensionality unless the verse elaborates it that way.

The Tree is infinite in relations to that, so it should still be aleph-1 of dimensionality at the very least, that's my point