AlipheeseXIV
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Honkaiverse - Conceptual manipulation
- Thread starter Shiroiyo
- Start date
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haha
KingOfDarknessBelow
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Bump
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Bump
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I'm somewhat confused about this thread since it is mixing HSR and Hi3rd. Was there any CRT that somehow assumes we can now assume that both instances of imaginary space and imaginary tree is the same for both?
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The Forms specifically in Stigma Space are unrelated to Paths. And they serve completely different purposes. I already brought up my concerns for having them even in the same thread. They should be judged separately. You can just read my later comments for my views on the matter.
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So OP argues
Type 1 concept for Imaginary space, stigma, and Path space
Nova argues for Type 2 instead, while also divorcing Stigma from Path space
The exchange ended midway, but from what I've read, these are the current contentions and proposals I assume
Type 1 concept for Imaginary space, stigma, and Path space
Nova argues for Type 2 instead, while also divorcing Stigma from Path space
The exchange ended midway, but from what I've read, these are the current contentions and proposals I assume
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Erm. Are they…?
Dw, T0’s coming soon again anyways. I just have to nuke some other stuff rn
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Hold up now, I gotta make sure I don’t end up on some island.Bro I thought Space already gave invitation to everyone for May and Nova's wedding
Mbpoops
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T0 with cm3 truely peak cant even interact with eugiri
What stance are you leaning towards rn
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Bit weird to dodge your important day
We already
- Rented wedding venue
- Invited all Chinamen (LoTM victims) wankers
- Invited Hoyoshills & Tensura wankers
- Hired Toxic-sama as the pastor
- Decorated everything with Atoms and Klein pictures
- Rented femboys
- Ordered the wedding cake(it has Klein decoration too)
- Hired a photographer
- Booked a DJ
- Prepared wedding rings
- Planned the honeymoon
I am certain @May_Alter will make sure your life will be hell if you don't come
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All of this and bro still hasn’t read past chapter 30
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All of this and bro still hasn’t read past chapter 30
You gotta tell it to your future wife in honeymoon, I will just chill with atoms before dying 
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For every 1 SuperNova comment, theres 20 more derailing ones to come. Classic.
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Bro is crying about how he found out re, I meant very good and loving friends
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Type 2 Concept
Though I haven't checked the latest Asat Pramad story of Planacardia since 4.0, I'll refrain from voting for now
Also stop derailing
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Can u delete their comments staff is gonna come here again and complain that there's too much to readType 2 Concept
Though I haven't checked the latest Asat Pramad story of Planacardia since 4.0, I'll refrain from voting for now
Also stop derailing
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What about the Hi3 side of things with forms?
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Looks type 1 tbh.
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Wait then how are you leaning towards type 2 in general
Mbpoops
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Yea but in what sense is she “projected”? Because the ontology of the projection itself is wholly unrelated to the concept itself. Because it cannot follow that a projection in-itself cannot be physical.
Because the wording sure as hell doesn’t lend to her having some transcendental essence, as if a Form has to be released by imaginary disturbance, as if some phenomena acts on her within Stigma Space to knock her out.
Because now you have to cash an entire new aspect of her ontology to satisfy some inherently non-contradictory aspect of her body simply being special:
Because then, this seems extremely unparsimonious as an interpretation.
Because then, what is the cohesiveness here? For not only Gray Serpent to reaffirm that what exists beside him is the concept itself, but that she can clone herself and die? I mean, we knew Project Stigma aimed at the creation of these Forms to begin with, but now there are even more burdens to satisfy as to how cloning the body itself now is the same thing. As if there lacks a distinction between the body and the Form. I mean, somehow even worse, we know Hare is alive and actively thinks whilst inside Stigma Space, so the Form there is her. What happens when she dies then? Does the Form go poof lol?
So it’s not even implicitly implied no less explicitly so. Which means all that your interpretation is based on is a single point about her body having special ontology, which can super easily be explained by the body being the Form itself. Not even a single distinction is implied, nor addressed on her body and essence or of the sort. Which is just then resorted to how much conjecture can be made for a single allegory, of which then can just be disregarded by unparsimony.
Yea this is going nowhere. I’ll continue this discussion when the mods eventually decide to show up either tomorrow or in 5 months.
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It is unfortunate that DMC and Doom wankers are not invited to the wedding venue... So unfortunate
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I mean, from the description, it is type 1
But then again, it seems to need a lot of context about the game's story, which I do not have. Which is more so the reason why I said I'm not voting yet.
since im still trying to understand the Hare situation
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What about Paths? I think I brought up some fairly good points on why they can be type 1 and how it ties with the Imaginary being type 1 as well.
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I'm ngl, you probably can just ask @Shiroiyo and @SuperNova55555 together regarding it since I'm sure they both had probably done Chapter 33 of the story (given Hare & Stigma feats are mostly on Chapter 33 anyway) unless one of them just used the skip button
But the context itself from my own perspective that I could digest is that Hare is basically Seeds of Ideas created by the Project Stigma (with Project Stigma's goal creating countless Seeds of Ideas like Hare) and how Hare could apparently return to the World of Ideas whenever she wanted and shape reality (whilst the opposite is deemed impossible since it's established Stigma is able to shape reality but reality is unable to shape Stigma) which stems a lot from the World of Ideas
Going off Hare alone as a conceptual existence, I think Type 1 here would've been from Hare / World of Ideas themselves that's like treated independent and transcend reality or something like that but idrk if this'll qualify as Type 1 given apparently Nova still has contentions that I legit don't understand from the first/second page
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Stigma Space is the mental space of a particular bloodline (like Kaslana or Shariac) which exists within Imaginary Space. Within the particular Stigma Spaces exist Forms, which are types of imaginary concepts.
The goal of Project Stigma is to replace the humans in Reality with the Forms in Imaginary Space, by switching Real and Imaginary. Which is why the goal is to cause Forms like Hare to literally descend into Reality whereas humanity is turned into a dream within Imaginary Space.
Issue is that not everyone has a Stigmata and therefore a corresponding Stigma Space. As such, Project Stigma aims to turn the humans themselves into Stigmata and allow for the creation of Forms in that way.
For Hare particularly, her birth was anomalous in that when Cecilia Shariac died, her stigmata (which is a type of information present within her bloodline), broke the boundary between Imaginary and Real causing the Form (Hare) to descend into Reality.
The above comment I linked is just to show that what descended is the Form itself. As not only is it never implied that Hare has some other hidden essence or whatever, but that she as the literal Form can be killed and then have the information of that Form even be used to clone her. This, with a lot of other problems that should be obvious (like not everyone having a Stigma), should be clear why its not actually CM1.
AlipheeseXIV
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Don't do it, finite time and space
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4.3 has the most obvious CM2 stuff though, also finite space and time stated by Asat is probably refering to Akivili as a finite entity but this doesn't make sense unless Akivili isn't an Aeon (since Mythus stated Aeons are the true infinity and how they're beyond perceptions)Don't do it, finite time and space
My best bet is that Asat is just larping since we know Zandar confirmed the universe being infinite in the databank so lol, not to mention literal Enigmata confirmed universe has no end so it's probably just Asat jobbing I guess or maybe Elation was Enigmata all along
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It's one of the most cut clear CM1 feats we've gotten why do people keep calling it CM2
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Tbh 3.7 is actually the most cut clear CM1 feat for me with Remembrance being independent from both Erudition or Destruction since Remembrance is unaffected by them, idrk the independence argument in 4.3 thoughIt's one of the most cut clear CM1 feats we've gotten why do people keep calling it CM2
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I mean both are pretty obvious. But Voracity is even more. It's word for word.
Explain how it's not CM1 and it's CM2 instead WITHOUT it having the bidirectionality CM2 requires. Please.
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I still don't get that part cause I haven't done 4.4
(Or you can go to my dms and explain it, if it's like deadass word for word then ik what to argue)
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