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Hitman Reborn Pages Overhaul

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Majinere566

Majinere566

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Now this verse is very dead in the wiki with only a handful of supporters. Due to the lack of supporters the pages, the pages remain very outdated so i'll be trying to fix that.

Supporting Feat: Possibly Planet Level?

It is stated by Byakuran's that he destroyed Ghost's World, Which is a parallel Earth, which is supported by the Anime showcasing the Planet when he made the statement.

Too address the Counter arguments I've seen.

1."It's the effect of bring ghost to his world"

He talks of it as two different things hence the use of and

"I destroyed his world" and "I managed to bring him back"

There's no mention of a paradox leading to a world's destruction, only thing mentioned is it being impossible to bring a doppelganger into a different world

2. This panel has been brough up to refute the notion that it wasn't by his power but I disagree

  • He mentions that the past and future can't be at the same place , it would destroy the world, what byakuran did is much more different. He brought basically a doppelganger from a parallel world. And by the illustration in this panel he's clearly not bring a past version of himself to coincide with the present him.
  • And to steelman this, if ghost was from the future, then the world would've been destroyed as per due to the law, but that didn't happen.

Now onto the pages.


Just a few things to be fixed.

Stamina: Should be changed to Peak Human as "High" doesn't exist according to the new standards for Stamina

Intelligence: Extremely Wise should be changed to Extraordinary Genius due to the reasonings on his page. Extremely Wise isn't part of the site standards

Attack Potency: His Low 7-B Key isn't really necessary because it's basically the same version that also dominates Tsuna which would mean he's 7-B. If Planet level is accepted it should cover the low 7-b and 7-B keys.


Attack Potency: His current 5-A rating justification's isn't the best.
At least Large Planet level (As he always be the rival of Mukuro, he should be comparable to him)
Click to expand...
I'd like to replace it with this

Large Planet level with VG Cambio Forma( Is able to fight and injure Daemon Spade possessing Mukuro's Body)
Click to expand...
Stamina: High should be replaced with Superhuman for the reasons on his page.

Attack Potency : His Base Key should be replaced with Vongola Gear. Base insinuates No Good Tsuna which is his clumsy normal self.
So it should be Vongola Gear| Oath Flames| Ultimate Dying will

His Tiering should change from this
5-A, higher with XX-Burner | 5-A | At least 5-A, higher with XX-Burner | At least 5-A, likely higher | 5-A
Click to expand...

To this
5-A, higher with VG Cambio Forma even higher with XX-Burner | At least 5-A with Oath Flames| 5-A with Ultimate Dying Will
Click to expand...

Speed: I made recalc to the current Sub Relativistic calc which now put him at FTL, it's not been evaluated so we can ignore this for now.


I made a sandbox to give a visual representation for what I am proposing. I am not done everything yet but I added a VG cambio forma tabber for hibari and numerous tabbers for multiple tsuna forms which don't exist on their profiles.
 
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Can't do much now, but once I get home later today I'll respond to more of it. For now, I disagree with Planetary Byakuran. "Destroy the world" is too vague, and it could simply mean that he wiped out all life on the planet, which would be pretty easy for a City level character. I think it could warrant a "possibly far higher" though.
 
I would be inclined to believe it's vague but here's a few things I think we can consider.

1. When Visualizing What "Destroying the World" is, that word is often associated with the planet being destroyed. Even a Google search of destroying the world shows the planet being destroyed.

2. The Anime Implying a Planet level destruction by showing Earth when he made the statement.

This isn't the main focus tho if it gets rejected so be it. The pages need to be fixed
 
Hmmm, I don't know how to think of the Planet Destroying for Byakuran, definitely on the agreeing side seeing the points being made here. They make sense to me, but I'm still a step back -- but I agree with the rest.

I do think another secondary piece of evidence that can be used is that he tossed around a Tsuna who could easily destroy several buildings 20x stronger than regular buildings-- though Idk how far that'll get you.
 
Majinere566 said:
Obberglob is responsible for the scaling chain so I feel he'll explain it better.
Click to expand...
Well, from what is the verse page, Bermuda scales to 4.92 Ninatons while the baseline of the next tier is 16 Ninatons, i don't see how anyone would be able to upscale here.
 
U know what imma channel my inner speedster
ObberGobb said:
Can't do much now, but once I get home later today I'll respond to more of it. For now, I disagree with Planetary Byakuran. "Destroy the world" is too vague, and it could simply mean that he wiped out all life on the planet, which would be pretty easy for a City level character. I think it could warrant a "possibly far higher" though.
Click to expand...
What are your thoughts now?
 
So essentially, you are wanting to combine his two base keys into one, and his two Oath Flame keys into one? Personally, I think that there is a significant enough jump in power between Inheritance Ceremony base and Curse of the Rainbow Base. Here is my proposal:

Inheritance Ceremony Arc | Curse of the Rainbow Arc | Ultimate Dying Will

5-A, higher with XX-Burner, even higher with Oath Flame | At least 5-A, higher with XX-Burner, even higher with Oath Flame | At least 5-A, likely higher

Base Tsuna is more than six times stronger in base between those two arcs, and they scale to separate values, so I think they should be different keys. Also, I think I made a math mistake with the scaling chain. The values are all fine, but I must have put it into the calculator wrong because the gap between the Vindice value and High 5-A is bigger than I had thought. Characters who scale from Vindice should be changed to just "5-A". People who scale above the Vindice can be "At least 5-A", while Ultimate Dying Will Tsuna can get "likely higher". Kawahira is the only who gets flat High 5-A, although if you want Ultimate Dying Will Tsuna could get "possibly High 5-A", as I think that he is more than 4x stronger than the Vindice, but I don't think the wiki allows that much upscaling.

I agree with Hibari, but I disagree with removing Byakuran's base key. I think Byakuran's key should now look like this:

Base | Ghost Absorbed | Curse of the Rainbow Arc

At least Low 7-B, possibly far higher | At least 7-B, possibly far higher | 5-A

The justification for the "far higher" would be the statement about him destroying Ghost's world.


For a "to-do list" of things I believe we need to accomplish in this thread:
  • Scaling and key changes (like we are discussing now with Byakuran and Tsuna)
  • Grammar fixes
  • Find scans to support all of the claims made
  • Add citations for everything
 
ObberGobb said:
So essentially, you are wanting to combine his two base keys into one, and his two Oath Flame keys into one? Personally, I think that there is a significant enough jump in power between Inheritance Ceremony base and Curse of the Rainbow Base. Here is my proposal:
Click to expand...
Nah infact its the opposite. I want to replace his base post future key with Vongola Gear. By Base it means No good Tsuna which we know doesn't really need a Key
ObberGobb said:
Inheritance Ceremony Arc | Curse of the Rainbow Arc | Ultimate Dying Will
Click to expand...
Yes
ObberGobb said:
5-A, higher with XX-Burner, even higher with Oath Flame | At least 5-A, higher with XX-Burner, even higher with Oath Flame | At least 5-A, likely higher
Click to expand...
This is forgetting stuff like cambio forma which makes him much stronger so I feel it should be like this

5-A, higher with VG Cambio Forma even higher with XX-Burner | At least 5-A with Oath Flames| At least 5-A with Ultimate Dying Will.

I don't really agree with the Proposal of possibly far higher for byakuran.

It should be like this.

At least Low 7-B | At least 7-B| Likely 5-B| 5-A
 
5-A, higher with VG Cambio Forma even higher with XX-Burner | At least 5-A with Oath Flames| At least 5-A with Ultimate Dying Will.
Click to expand...
My main concern with this is that it puts the two arcs together when Tsuna got much stronger between the two. They are technically the same tier, but in Curse of the Rainbow arc, he scales to a value 6x higher than in Inheritance Ceremony. Am I correct that your proposal is Vongola Gear | Oath Flame | Ultimate Dying Will? But yeah, I see what you mean with VG Cambio Forma.

Inheritance Ceremony Arc | Curse of the Rainbow Arc | Ultimate Dying Will

5-A, higher with VG Cambio Forma, even higher with XX-Burner, far higher with Oath Flame | At least 5-A, higher with VG Cambio Forma, even higher with XX-Burner, far higher with Oath Flame | At least 5-A, likely far higher

What do you think about this? One of my concerns is getting across how much stronger Ultimate Dying Will is than his previous forms. We don't have set multipliers, so we can't list a value for it on the verse page, but I also don't know if it is enough to warrant an upscale into High 5-A.

I don't really agree with the Proposal of possibly far higher for byakuran.

It should be like this.

At least Low 7-B | At least 7-B | Likely 5-B | 5-A
Click to expand...
What would the third key be? I'm unsure about 5-B. Series like Yu Yu Hakusho and One Piece have statements about destroying the world, and those are considered outliers by the wiki. Personally, that's what I'm leaning towards as well. However, since in the next arc characters do become Large Planetary, this statement holds a bit more water than those two examples. We'd need a staff member's thoughts though.
 
ObberGobb said:
My main concern with this is that it puts the two arcs together when Tsuna got much stronger between the two. They are technically the same tier, but in Curse of the Rainbow arc, he scales to a value 6x higher than in Inheritance Ceremony. Am I correct that your proposal is Vongola Gear | Oath Flame | Ultimate Dying Will? But yeah, I see what you mean with VG Cambio Forma.
Click to expand...
Oh i see what you mean. And yes that's my proposal.
ObberGobb said:
Inheritance Ceremony Arc | Curse of the Rainbow Arc | Ultimate Dying Will

5-A, higher with VG Cambio Forma, even higher with XX-Burner, far higher with Oath Flame | At least 5-A, higher with VG Cambio Forma, even higher with XX-Burner, far higher with Oath Flame | At least 5-A, likely far higher
Click to expand...
Yes i agree and to add on for the last part is it possible to add "likely far higher with Ultimate Dying Will"?

ObberGobb said:
What would the third key be? I'm unsure about 5-B. Series like Yu Yu Hakusho and One Piece have statements about destroying the world, and those are considered outliers by the wiki. Personally, that's what I'm leaning towards as well. However, since in the next arc characters do become Large Planetary, this statement holds a bit more water than those two examples. We'd need a staff member's thoughts though.
Click to expand...
Honestly I don't know, That's why i wanted the 5-B key to cover for both the first and second key. That's if 5-B gets accepted

Something like this

Likely 5-B, higher with absorbing Ghost| 5-A

Also the whole purpose of 5-B is to support the 5-A stuff alongside other unevaluated calcs i have made.
 
and to add on for the last part is it possible to add "likely far higher with Ultimate Dying Will"?
Click to expand...
I don't think that's necessary to add, as the final key is just Ultimate Dying Will.

What are the other calcs you have that you mentioned?
 
ObberGobb said:
5-A, higher with VG Cambio Forma, even higher with XX-Burner, far higher with Oath Flame | At least 5-A, higher with VG Cambio Forma, even higher with XX-Burner, far higher with Oath Flame |
Click to expand...
What's the difference between these two keys again?

What did Tsuna gain/lose for him to warrant two keys that have the same AP and increases
 
In key one, he scales to Enma's AP value. In key two, he scales above the Vindice's AP value, which is 60x higher than Enma's.
 
While I'm working on formatting stuff, can you lay out all the content changes/additions you are considering? Is there anything else beyond what was in the original post?
 
ObberGobb said:
While I'm working on formatting stuff, can you lay out all the content changes/additions you are considering? Is there anything else beyond what was in the original post?
Click to expand...
For now no

I'll exclude 5-B byakuran because a mod needs to approve of it.

Hibari:


Attack Potency: His current 5-A rating justification's isn't the best.

At least Large Planet level (As he always be the rival of Mukuro, he should be comparable to him)
Click to expand...

I'd like to replace it with this

Large Planet level with VG Cambio Forma( Is able to fight and injure Daemon Spade possessing Mukuro's Body)
Click to expand...

Stamina: High should be replaced with Superhuman for the reasons on his page.


Tsuna:

Tiering: 5-A, higher with VG Cambio Forma, even higher with XX-Burner, far higher with Oath Flame | At least 5-A, higher with VG Cambio Forma, even higher with XX-Burner, far higher with Oath Flame | At least 5-A, likely far higher
 
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