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High School D×D Discussion Thread #3

Well, Akeno's statement doesn't contradict it. She's only saying Indra's lightning is stronger than hers and her father's.
 
I find it funny that Innovate Clear and Telos Karma combination were almost the same as White Woz future altering Notebook. All that is missing is a notebook to write on and a voice recognition.

It would made the scenario in V25 New Dark be even more funnier if that were to happen. I can already imagine it to be like this:

"The 1st Grim Reaper charge at Kanzaki but then somehow tripped and impale himself with his scythe."

"The 2nd Grim Reaper try to avenge his comrade but his scythe was in a poor condition and instead of cutting Kanzaki. It slide off and ended up fly like a boomerang to others reapers which killed them."

"As the last few reapers charge ahead at Kanzaki, they were unable to win against his own God-class empowerment ability."
 
About Indra Vajra lightning.

Akeno-san is the daughter of an executive fallen angel named Barakiel who uses [Raikou / Holy Lightning]. Akeno-san and Barakiel-san too, can use tremendous Raikou ......

In fact, the thunder of Vajra that Indra has surpasses Akeno-san's lightning by far. No, in the current situation, it has strength and magnitude that are not comparable. No matter who it is: Maou class, God class, if you take that head-on, you can not avoid fatal injuries.
 
I forgot to ask; was Arjuna's power stated and did the Four Heavenly Kings fight against Mahabali's team?
 
No it wasn't. But that battle was not easy for Indra team this time. It was almost equal fight. All of Indra and Mahabali teammates are god-class AT VERY LEAST.
 
That puts Issei's team at a major disadvantage. Aside from himself and Ddraig, I can imagine only Xenovia with the scabbard managing to avoid retirement. Ravel might last for a while via immortality, and Fafnir could protect Asia for some time.

I hope Ingvild makes it to that match...
 
The volume where Issei first faces Sairaorg. I think that was Volume 9. He said his Sacred Gear's power can be used to enhance his defense against power types like Sairaorg or something like that. When he boosted multiple times, he says he uses it to increase his defense and power up his fists as well.

If it didn't enhance his defense, it'd be useless for him to go punching at people after doubling his power, because he'd only break his arm in the process.
 
I want Issei to meet Eros and Angra Mainyu soon.

Since Regalzerva's underlings have seemingly invaded the world, I'm thinking that Issei and Vali will fight the Keito Tenkai. Both are mentioned to serve directly under Regalzerva in the memorial. My line of thought is that if both Issei and Vali reach the final, the tournament won't end with a winner. I simply don't feel as if Ishibumi will write the deciding match in their rivalry in this tournament.

So if both reach the final, Regalzerva's boys force the tournament to be cancelled abruptly. As a result, both Vali and Issei are very upset that they could not finish their match. So they vent their frustration on the Keito Tenkai to warm up for ExE proper. I just think a combination of Regalzerva's men invading + his strongest underlings being two i.e just enough direct opponents for Issei and Vali presents a feasible chance that they'll fight. Eclipsed Seven Luminaries are at the level of chief gods, so I'm not sure how strong the Keito Tenkai would be.

Admittedly, I don't know how Ddraig and Albion would factor if this comes to pass. I think Vali will find a way to release Albion. Their confrontation will attract at least as much attention as Vali and Issei due to their legendary rivalry. Obviously if the match is cancelled, both dragons would be mad as hell.
 
Well surelly prime Strada is weaker than Apollo. At least I could made that conclusion from chapter of Shin 2:

Power within force. Violence of Heavens and Slashing Princess.

And looks like Durandal II less durable than original one.
 
Apollon defeated Ryuuta and Irina, and was dealing with the three of them (adding Xenovia) with only one hand. Strada didn't retire any of them and even got his weapon broken, so I think it's safe to assume he's below Apollon.
 
True, I agree with that.

I want to know how you guys feel about a serious Rizevim's strength in comparison to base Sirzechs and casual Ajuka? I've been thinking Rizevim has to be stronger. In Zero, he issued a challenge to them despite knowing of their true power so it'd be strange if he couldn't handle them in their normal state.
 
Who knows... But Ise believe Sirzechs and Ajuka stronger than Rizevim dispite he don't know about true form Sirzechs and serious Ajuka at that moment.
 
When accounting for Rizevim vs TDxD, I would consider Rizevim as perhaps 6/10 or so of true form Sirzechs and serious Ajuka.

I don't know just around what level I could consider casual Sirzechs and Ajuka's strength, but putting them at around 12/10 of the original Lucifer, I still would consider Rizevim as stronger than such in pure specs, though PoD and Kankara Formula would make a direct specs comparison not that relevant in a practical combat situation.
 
What match-ups would you guys like to see (possible or impossible)? Those that currently come to mind are:

Tobio vs Thanatos, Jin vs Fenrir, Dulio vs Cao Cao (in the current tournament), Kuroka vs Rossweisse (without Mistelteinn), Sairaorg vs Resshin, and Eros vs Chichigami (haha). Also Issei vs Mitsuya because of what Ajuka said about the strange things that could happen if they make contact.
 
Tobio vs Thanatos

Hard to say, pretty much equal match-up

Jin vs Fenrir

Fenrir FRA

Dulio vs Cao Cao

Cao Cao mid diff

Kuroka vs Rossweisse

Rose mid diff even without Mist Cane.

Sairaorg vs Resshi

I forgot who is Resshin?

Issei vs Mitsuya

Ise FRA if Ishi not nerf him as he do in every single Shin volume.

I like to see more Indra and 4 HK fights. Surt and his team in action. Maybe Sairaog vs Surt Indra vs Issei Ise vs Vali Vali vs Vidar
 
By Resshin, I mean Dojima in Denpachi. Of course, Sairaorg would stomp but I just wanna see a cool brawl, lol.
 
Tobio vs Thanatos: Tobio win I would say if he's in Abyss Side, going by how hard he beat that other Grim Reaper executive just in normal BxB.

Jin vs Fenrir: I think Fenrir would win, though I am not sure on Jin's standalone ability.

Dulio vs Cao Cao: I actually see no way for Cao Cao to win against Dulio, especially in BxB. Too much long range AoE ability and even trapping to stop Cao Cao from teleporting freely.

The other ones I don't have much idea on how they would stack up, especially since Mitsuya's cheats are a bit nebulous in terms of their limitations.

My very own dream match ups would be Tobio vs Dulio (which thankfully is happening. Rooting for my boy Slash Dog), Tobio vs Mitsuya, Current Yuuto vs Cao Cao and Sairaorg vs Balor Rias.
 
I also want to see Tobio vs Mitsuya, but Telos Karma... Still, Tobio and Jin confronted him despite knowing about its effects, so it might not be as straightforward as it seems.

Vali vs Wukong should be pretty good. I'm looking forward to it. It's overshadowed by the other matches because people know Vali will almost definitely reach the final, unlike Issei's situation. I'm sorry for the second generation Zhu Bajie and Sha Wujing though; I'm pretty sure their first generation counterparts will school them. Lol.
 
Telos Karma is a huge cheat, but i doubt it can work automatically. Mitsuya might be able to control phenomena he's aware of, but what if he's attacked from beyond his field of sight or hit by a hidden property or such? That might be a gap which can be exploited against someone like him. Though of course, it can go either way.

I have been thinking of Vali vs Wukong and I have a hypothesis that Sun might get turned back to his youth for the game, use a Yu-Long armor, or both. To bring him up to a spec level in which his superior technique can seriously trouble or even outclass DxD L Vali initially.
 
Tobio vs Thanatos: Tobio win I would say if he's in Abyss Side, going by how hard he beat that other Grim Reaper executive just in normal BxB

We don't know how strong Abyss side is. Only that it is stronger than normal one which is Maou-class from fact he could cut and kill Gods in it thanks to blade in Jin mounth. Thanatos is mid God-class in Loky league.

Dulio vs Cao Cao: I actually see no way for Cao Cao to win against Dulio, especially in BxB. Too much long range AoE ability and even trapping to stop Cao Cao from teleporting freely.

Cao Cao has no problems with facing BtB of Sairaorg which has much more AP and big AOE shockwaves that spread around whole rating game fields. Dulio bubbles could be broken by combine might of Nakiri and Bova, Cao Cao could easily teleport from it or broke it with his Spear with Maou-class output in base.
 
Tbh, we don't know how strong Loki is exactly. The way I see it, based on their feats Thanatos has better attack power by virtue of destroying a portion of CxC Issei's armour with ease (Loki's casual attacks could be handled to an extent by Issei and Vali) and Loki has better defense with his barriers, by virtue of blocking Azazel and Barakiel's attacks, while Thanatos chose to dodge Grayfia's attack.

@Jester

Woah, I never thought of a Yu Long armour. Yeah, I like your idea.
 
@Vergil Lucifer Thanatos' class hasn't really been mentioned. He's faster than PDxD but his durability is such that he would be one-shot by it. Also Tobio's base BxB and Abyss Side are both in undetermined class.

The superior AP is not that much of an issue since Cao Cao's durability is still his weakest point. Comparing Dulio's AP with Sairaorg's AP against Cao Cao is like pondering whether a sniper bullet or a nuke are more effective at killing a person. Both get the job at hand done equally because one is simply way more overkill. Dulio's AoE is higher than Sairaorg in spread, and even breaking the bubbles is not that much of an issue if you look back at Volume 17. Ladon trapped Issei in his barriers, and while Issei could break them, it wasn't a big issue since Ladon could just trap him in another one. Dulio could do the same, and as I mentioned, he could trap Cao Cao away from his bubbles. And while Cao Cao fought BtB Sairaorg, their fight didn't really end, since the match time ended with Cao Cao team's victory before that. So it's unsure who would have won that fight had it continued.

Also, Grayfia has never been called above Maou-class. She has been consistently mentioned as Maou-class in all volumes with specific mention of her power.
 
Thanatos was been mention several times as god level threath in Vol.24 also since Loki was mentioned so often in conversations about Thanatos it means that they are considered to be a threat of comparable level. Also Thanatos is far stronger than Pluto who is in same league as Fafnir Armor Azazel who one-shot Maou class Katleya. Pluto and armoured Azazel both above-maou class. They on level of Diehauser who could fight and defeat non-combat gods.

Well actually all current Maou a stronger than first one it was stated in DxD Zero. And they a significaly stronger. Ise in CxC who stated in DX.4 to be in same league as Grayfia. And Ise easily deal with Barakiel who is comparable with first Maou
 
Grim Reaper executives are Ultimate-class in the Grim Reaper ranking, therefore Maou-class right?

About Grayfia, he probably just means that she's stronger than the first set of Maou, which is what is used to judge Maou-class. But it doesn't mean she and the others are above Maou-class like Balorias, Gressil, etc.

I keep on seeing that CxC Issei was stated to be above Maou-class in DX 4 though. Is that a fake spoiler or mistranslation?
 
So how about Truth Idea and Mala Ratana? Cao Cao could technically counter some of Dulio's weather based abilities and his light attacks with the latter.

But yeah, Azazel said Dulio would have an advantage against Cao Cao based on their abilities.
 
@Vergil I didn't see Thanatos being mentioned as God-class in Volume 24, but fair enough, his performance against PDxD should put him near that. And Diehauser was also called Maou-class, not god level. He can beat non-combat gods because of Worthless, which is a huge hax advantage.

The current Maou being stronger than the first ones does not make them above the respective class. A class is not people of the same power, but of comparable power. For example, Crom Cruach is somewhat stronger than Ddraig, Albion, Azi Dahaka and Apophis, but he's still Heavenly Dragon-class as mentioned in Shin DxD 2. Another one is Fenrir who is Heavenly Dragon-class, with Typhon being comparable but Typhon is still weaker overall than Ddraig. A class is not a set level of power, but simply a range. Also, Issei didn't deal easily with Baraqiel, they were still comparable to each other and Baraqiel could hold his own.

@Burning Yeah, Ultimate-class Grim Reapers should be Maou-class on average. With Tobio in base BxB dealing with the executive without issue I would think he's at least at a Balor Rias level or such.

Truth Idea is impossible to predict, quantify or analyze, so I wouldn't use it when judging a Cao Cao matchup. Mala Ratana might work, but it's a small sphere. Could it really deal with a 360 degrees assault?
 
Ise CxC was stated to be equal to Grayfia which is above Maou class (but above Maou class, I mean above first Maou) in DX.4. Gressil and Sonneilon is Maou class (strong). And in Shin 2 his feats stated to be on same level as Diehauser. They have no chances agains battle type Gods, but could fight and defeat non battle type. So

Maou class (strong)/Above Maou class: Ise CxC, Serafall, Falbium, Grayfia, Diehauser, Sonneilon and Gresil Maou class: First Lucifer
 
@Demonicjester01

Ise litteraly say several times "even if my opponent is a god" when things comes to Thanatos in talk and not to mention all Grim Reapers is a Gods. PDxD is Heavenly Dragon class and mid class God couldn't do a thing agains him. Far weaker form - EJOD could made a punches which is strong enough to even Maou class not wistand. Nothing mention about Crom is HD-class in Shin 2. He said that several times. Crom surpass HD class. And Fenrir and Typhon are nowhere near HD class level.

Tobio BxB is not abovr or equal to Balor Rias that coul
 
It was stated Fenrir is on par with Heavenly Dragons in Volume 7 or so. Can't really remember, but I see it as retconned info tbh.
 
@Vergil I accepted Thanatos as God-class due to feats, so idk why you're still going on about him. Crom was called Heavenly Dragon-class in Life.4 of Shin 2. Crom has been mentioned to surpass Ddraig and Albion, but once again, that's not surpassing the class, since a class is a range, not a set value. And Fenrir was clearly called Heavenly Dragon-class in Volume 7.

"Our opponent is a God. But the biggest problem is the wolf he is carrying with him. Fenrir.

A real monster which has power surpassing that of its father. What I heard was that it has a power on par with the Two Heavenly Dragons before they were sealed, and even Sensei and old man Tannin can't beat it one on one."

I think you left this message incomplete, but I was just making a hypothesis. Since an executive-class Grim Reaper should be Maou-class, and Tobio defeated one with as much ease if not more than what Balor Rias had to beat Grayfia, then him being around that level is not unnatural.

@Burning I don't think it's so much retconned as it being a figure only accounting for Ddraig's and Albion's normal specs. Ddraig with Boost obviously would be higher than that base, and so on.
 
Yes, but the quote essentially says Fenrir is equal. Not just at some unclear point in HD-class, but literally equal to them. I just find it suspect that Typhon who's equal or superior to Fenrir could initially not put a scratch on unboosted Ddraig, despite the latter giving Typhon a free, clean shot. It contradicts the showings in other battles between people that are equal to Ddraig such as Issei vs Apophis, Vali vs Azi Dahaka, and Vali vs Crom. That's my problem with the statement.

And even though Vidar with MB who's = Thor managed to damage Pseudo DxD, it's still made clear that he's inferior and he had to use Midgardsormr to become equal to the Heavenly Dragons. Remember Pseudo DxD can't afford to use Boost to buff his stats currently. To clarify, I don't believe the likes of Thor and Fenrir are much weaker; I just don't think they're equal to the Heavenly Dragons.
 
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