Gin vs. Minato (This'll Be Over In A Second) (Voting Completed, Grace Period)

[Starter_Pack]

Speed, one of the primary traits that can determine whether a warrior lives or dies, and something that people spend their whole lives attempting to improve and master to gain the upper hand in battle. Speed also happens to be one of the most overlooked qualities to many debates on VSBW due to equalization. However, I believe I have managed to locate two characters that are not only close enough in power to debate, but also close enough in speed to leave this unequalized. And not only that, but these two characters are notorious for being some of the fastest characters in their appropriate universes, for one reason or another. So, who will win, the former Shinigami Squad Captain, or the former Hokage? Today, we find out!

In the blue corner, we have Gin Ichimaru from Bleach, and in the red corner, we have Minato Namikaze from Naruto.



-This is a battle to the death or incapacitation. No holds barred.
-Neither character are aware of each other beforehand, and there is no prep time.

-Neither character are allowed outside help in this fight.

-This battle takes place in the forest outside the Hidden Leaf Village, giving Minato the home court advantage.

-Sage Mode Minato is being used in this fight, and while Gin initially starts in his base form, he is allowed to switch to Bankai if he gets pushed hard enough. (Because if he goes Bankai from the start, Minato wouldn't even have a chance.)

-Speed is now equalized, due to Bleach profiles needing a serious clean-up.

With all this being said, let the debate begin!

Yellow Flash: 5 (AstralKing7, Dr.Fix, Rocker1189, AppleLord, Callsign Castle)

God Spear: 10 (Hst master, Zzsax, DragonEmperor23, Burning Full Fingers, IMadeThisOn8-1-2017, Veloxt1r0kore, Dat Dot, The mysterious man, Ricsi-viragosi, Ovy7)

Inconclusive: 0

 

[AstralKing7]

Minato is around Mach 5000 how fast is Gin

 

[Starter_Pack]

It doesn't help me to explain when everyone is scaled to Ichigo who scales to other characters who's scaled to Ichigo...

 

[Ghostly_Owns]

The forest loses. Either Gin gets 99 Woodcutting in the blink of an eye or Minato blows the forest away with rasengan/biju bomb.

 

[Wrath_Of_Itachi]

I think Gin scales to or around mach 1k.

 

[Starter_Pack]

I sent a message to TataHakai asking about the speed. Apparently, everyone seems to scale from each other with the Bleach profiles when it comes to speed, and I don't know who the blogs on the main Bleach verse page would affect. Somebody may have to make a CRT talking about that, to at least give someone's profile a solid speed feat for others to scale to.

 

[Starter_Pack]

I think Gin scales to or around mach 1k.

I can't really accept that unless you have proof of a real solid speed feat for the characters around this time in the Bleach universe.

 

[Wrath_Of_Itachi]

The only MHS speed feat i know of is candices lightning which was calced at mach 1k.

 

[AstralKing7]

i looked at some bleach profiles and i was so confused at Ichigos speed. How does he go from hypersonic to MHS+ with no links or calcs but just from blitzing some people who arent linked in his profile.

 

[Starter_Pack]

i looked at some bleach profiles and i was so confused at Ichigos speed. How does he go from hypersonic to MHS+ with no links or calcs but just from blitzing some people who arent linked in his profile.

Hence why I think a CRT should be made for that. I would myself, but I'm a bit too busy at the moment.

 

[AstralKing7]

my head is hurting as well lol i would have did it

 

[Starter_Pack]

You know what? Due to the fact that the speed for the Bleach profiles are all kinds of messy, and if best speed we have for Bleach would put Minato at a 5X advantage over Gin, I'm going to go ahead and equalize speed. I really didn't want to do it, but these issues are just giving everyone headaches and it's not going anywhere. But a CRT definitely has to be made for these Bleach profiles.

 

[AstralKing7]

yeah sometime soon

 

[TataHakai]

I don't know where pre-timeskip MHS+ Bleach comes from, the only MHS+ feat i know is Candice's feat, the rest are Sub rel for the god tiers.

Honestly Bleach had a huge revision and the profiles are still kind of a mess, there's a lot that needs to be done for the verse.

 

[AstralKing7]

Dang

 

[Starter_Pack]

Well, thanks for trying TH. Maybe you can look into it later. Anyway, speed is now equalized, sooo, go and debate.

 

[Zzsax]

Is this edo Minato with kurama or normal minato with kurama or just regular jounin/hokage minato without kurama.just making sure before giving my vote...for now forest loses lol

 

[Starter_Pack]

Is this edo Minato with kurama or normal minato with kurama or just regular jounin/hokage minato without kurama.just making sure before giving my vote...for now forest loses lol

As it says in the OP, this is Sage Mode Minato. I haven't gotten that far into Shippuden just yet, but I'm pretty sure that means he doesn't have Kurama's power in this fight.

 

[Ricsi-viragosi]

Both Edo and Alive minato have sage mode.

We normaly mean alive one when saying sage mode tough.

 

[AstralKing7]

minato gets my vote cause he is much more versatile. Not only was he already a sensory type ninja but sage senses boosts his awarness by a lot. He also has more stamina.

Now when it comes to intellegence. Minato is a genius as smart as Kakashi

If this becomes a close range battle he has the advantage with his seals that can be put on the enemy. When thi happens they will never leave and minato can always be right next to them or he can teleport them.

He has a barrier that can warp attacks to different lands when used.

Next minato also has shunshin that can increase his speed but sage mode already increases his phyiscal abilities also.

 

[Dr.Fix]

^I agree with Astralking that Minato has betetr moveset here and comparable IQ to handle Gin's tricks. Minato's biggest disadvantage here other than range is Gin's lethality but given the former is on the high end of Moutain level I'm thiking he'd be just as lethal with a rasengan.

That said, why is this sage Minato when his profile says he cannot use sage mode?

 

[AstralKing7]

he can use sage mode and that probably should be removed from his profile. Minato stated he wasnt as good at controlling sage mode as naruto or Pervy Sage but Minato still has the perfect sage form compared to Jiraiya

 

[HST_Master]

Gin.

His Zanpaktou is nearly perfect for Minato's style of fighting, capable of keeping up with and tagging him, even with his Thunder God Jutsu.

Gin is almost as much of a genius as Aizen.

Gin's bankai is perfect for a long range or short range fight due to it's extending ability at ridiculous speeds, and to boot one good scratch is all Gin needs to win, in which he cpuld use Korose on Minato and end it then and there.

 

[Rocker1189]

@HST master.

We literally have a speed for the bankai mach 500 it is not toiuching Minato. And it moves in a straight line how on earth is that a counter to FTG.

So what if he is a genius so is Minato completely moot point.

Minato crushes this. Gin has not other attacks apart from his linear and easy to dodge (for people like minato at this speed) bankai.

 

[AstralKing7]

chill brodi ^ he votes naruto characters sometimes

 

[Rocker1189]

Probably but I just cant understand his logic that Gin straight line mach 500 bankai is someohow a counter to a ridiculously fast teleporter.

 

[HST_Master]

@HST master.

We literally have a speed for the bankai mach 500 it is not toiuching Minato. And it moves in a straight line how on earth is that a counter to FTG.

So what if he is a genius so is Minato completely moot point.

Minato crushes this. Gin has not other attacks apart from his linear and easy to dodge (for people like minato at this speed) bankai.

Minato still has to quite literally get close to Gin to do some damage alongside Gin himself is fast enough to keep up with Ichigo in Bankai. Also Gin actively acknowledged he lied about his Bankai's speed and length. That said Buto Renjin counters the supposedly "easy to dodge" ability of his Shikai by allowing him to rapidly extend and retract it.

I was saying that in response to Minato

Again litteraly all Gin needs is one Knick to beat Minato

 

[Rocker1189]

Minato still has to quite literally get close to Gin to do some damage alongside Gin himself is fast enough to keep up with Ichigo in Bankai. Also Gin actively acknowledged he lied about his Bankai's speed and length. That said Buto Renjin counters the supposedly "easy to dodge" ability of his Shikai by allowing him to rapidly extend and retract it.

I was saying that in response to Minato

Again litteraly all Gin needs is one Knick to beat Minato

Yes so? He can still teleport away before Gin attacks, he is not locked out from getting close.

Gin literally said it is not as fast as he said it is. Making it slower than mach 500 not faster.

It does no matter if it extends fast and slow we still know mach 500 is its limit.

And that knick would never happen, Minato never allows things to touch him if he can help it. He even has a barrier for trasporting attacks.

 

[Dr.Fix]

@Rocker I don't disagree about Gin, but fair warning the staff might ban you for speaking of Kami Shino No Yari's canon SPD. It's one of those topics.

 

[Rocker1189]

You get banned for talking canon now? Ok lmao. I did not know there was a rule on that.

 

[AppleLord]

Gin is playful in combat, Minato isn't, so he has my vote.

 

[HST_Master]

If he gets close that's just makes it easier for him

That doesn't make sense, him saying he was lying about the speed doesn't make it slower at best it'd make it higher than his own speed. At worst he'd be ambiguous.

Except you don't, since he said lying about it, it'd be a complete outlier to say so given that he himself is much faster.

"Never allows things to touch him if he can help it"

That's litteraly a majority of people who fight. Gin has his Buto Renjin to stay on the assault and even use Kido to restrict, defend or even knock Minato unconscious the same way he did Rangiku. Gin can take the hits Minato gives but Minato essentially can't get a single cut.

Also Minato admits he's terrible at using Sage Mode and gathering Nature Energy so he's not staying in it for long.

 

[DragonEmperor23]

Can't minato only stay in it for like 2 seconds or something?

 

[AstralKing7]

Isnt speed equal cause if it wasnt Minato would blitz so it be equal doesnt make sense saying he couldnt dodge a sword at close range when he has to typs of senses

Also Gin better not get hit by a wind style rasengan from a Sage cause it would **** his body up bad

Even if minato gets knocked outa sage mode he most likely still has the AP advantage because he scales above 600megatons in base

 

[HST_Master]

Gin is playful in combat, Minato isn't, so he has my vote.

He tried to Kill Ichigo when they 1st met and tried to Kill Momo when her guard was down.

 

[HST_Master]

Can't minato only stay in it for like 2 seconds or something?

He says that his skill is limited and that he prefers not to use it because it gets in the way of his normal combat style.

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

Buto Renjin doubles Kamishini no Yari's speed and it's power is an order of magnitude higher btw.

Kanji:
ÞÂàÚ½ÿÚǃÒüºÒÇî þäíÞ©ÅÒÇì ÒéƵö¥ÒüñµèÇÒÇé ÒÇî þäíÞ©ÅÒÇì Òü«µö╗µÆâÕèøÒü¿ÚǃÒüòÒüîÕÇìÕîûÒüòÒéîÒéïÒüƒÒéüÒÇü µíüÚüòÒüäÒü«Õ¿üÕèøÒéƵîüÒüúÒüƒµö╗µÆâÒü¿Òü¬ÒéïÒÇé

Translation:
"A technique to fire Buto at ultra high speeds. Buto's offensive ability that purposefully doubles it's speed, it's an order of magnitude higher in power and must be held in one's hand to accomplish."


A order of magnitude is a factor by 10.

 

[HST_Master]

Isnt speed equal cause if it wasnt Minato would blitz so it be equal doesnt make sense saying he couldnt dodge a sword at close range when he has to typs of senses

Also Gin better not get hit by a wind style rasengan from a Sage cause it would **** his body up bad

Even if minato gets knocked outa sage mode he most likely still has the AP advantage because he scales above 600megatons in base

Speed is equal but attack speed isn't.

IIRC Minato can't use a Wind Style Rasengan.

And Gin scales higher than several other Mountain+ and is comparable to fake Karakura Ichigo while he's Hollowfied

 

[Zzsax]

Well for one Gin Physically crushes minato in CQC.if he doesn't go sage mode

One rasengan isn't putting Gin down,no that's wrong, actually ten rasengans ain't putting Gin down

Gin shikai wrecks minato with one hit, Gin bankai with one hit super wrecks minato out of existence

Any frogs summoned here would be turn to minced frog meat courtesy Gin zanpakutou

The only chance here for a minato assault here is sage mode which isn't even perfect so it's not as strong as naruto or jiraiya's and Gin isn't so nice to let him sit around and go into it,even if he starts with sage mode it expires literally minutes later.

Well considering Gin ability is tag you're dead and Minato's is no tagging" it's gonna be hard.but Gin wins mid-high diff due to his arsenal being more 100 times more lethal

 

[DragonEmperor23]

Gin fra