General DC Comics Discussion Thread

[PRIDEXEGO]

He didn't see the source or presence be born

He just went back before COIE and to the big bang thats stated to contain all matter and possibilities

When was it happened, maybe i just miss something. But probably this doesnt give any tier, prime did this long before him, even in earth prime before coie, there is a comic featuring the presence. And the real writer from earth prime saying this comic is written by him.

Talking about flash comic where it show Darkseid wipe eclipso like nothing.
Eclipso was having daddy issue and he started treating Darksied as a father figure or being is sidekick looking for his approval. Also the dog you see is foxy a baby source and juvenile presence that is restraining eclipso.
Flash giving a lecture to stop throwing tanturm about being a sidekick of someone.

Here it shows what dog aka foxy truly is. Ofcouse it may be something created directly to counter eclipso. Like eclipso directly counter Hecate.

 

[KirbyFan03]

Talking about flash comic where it show Darkseid wipe eclipso like nothing.
Eclipso was having daddy issue and he started treating Darksied as a father figure or being is sidekick looking for his approval. Also the dog you is foxy a baby source and juvenile presence that is restraining eclipso.
Flash giving a lecture to stop throwing tanturm about being a sidekick of someone.

Here it shows what dog aka foxy truly is. Ofcouse it may be something created directly to counter eclipso. Like eclipso directly counter Hecate.

Well then... All In Darkseid was weak weak compared to other iterations then as full power Eclipso beat his ass

Also don't scale Darkseid to those two beings

Darkseid at best would scale to Hecate at full power

 

[PRIDEXEGO]

Talking about flash comic where it show Darkseid wipe eclipso like nothing.
Eclipso was having daddy issue and he started treating Darksied as a father figure or being is sidekick looking for his approval. Also the dog you see is foxy a baby source and juvenile presence that is restraining eclipso.
Flash giving a lecture to stop throwing tanturm about being a sidekick of someone.

Here it shows what dog aka foxy truly is. Ofcouse it may be something created directly to counter eclipso. Like eclipso directly counter Hecate.

fixed second scan with the correct one earlier it was same as third one.

 

[PRIDEXEGO]

Well then... All In Darkseid was weak weak compared to other iterations then as full power Eclipso beat his ass

Also don't scale Darkseid to those two beings

Darkseid at best would scale to Hecate at full power

Where eclipso beat Darkeid it was Darkseid that almost no diff him right? It was so bad he started calling Darkseid father. Whatever tactic Darkseid used worked(maybe using baby source/presence). I guess either Eclispo got rectonned here in this story or writer had no idea what he is writing.

 

[Frankky123]

Emanation worlds

Well then the only things left are, how prime's reality is just fine and given superman has already travelled through monitor sphere and time trapper has been communcated with world forger probably known multiverse is larger than orerry. And death metal one couldn't be just an emanation

 

[KirbyFan03]

Well then the only things left are, how prime's reality is just fine and given superman has already travelled through monitor sphere and time trapper has been communcated with world forger probably known multiverse is larger than orerry. And death metal one couldn't be just an emanation

1. Primes reality was created by Time Trapper as a pocket dimension. An ability TT always possessed

2. Death Metals one was the true one but after that emanations appeared again in the new DC Cosmology

 

[PRIDEXEGO]

Prime reality was created outside of DC multiverse by TT its not his original world which was destroyed by antimonitor just replica of it. Tbf its very convoluted as prime during clash with himself rectonned back to original world which is said to be ourworld where he barge into DC office to strangle them and then multiversal Braniac saved them by teleporting prime out of there.

 

[KirbyFan03]

Where eclipso beat Darkeid it was Darkseid that almost no diff him right? It was so bad he started calling Darkseid father. Whatever tactic Darkseid used worked(maybe using baby source/presence). I guess either Eclispo got rectonned here in this story or writer had no idea what he is writing.

All In

 

[KirbyFan03]

Prime reality was created outside of DC multiverse by TT its not his original world which was destroyed by antimonitor just replica of it. Tbf its very convoluted as prime during clash with himself rectonned back to original world which is said to be ourworld where he barge into DC office to strangle them and then multiversal Braniac saved them by teleporting prime of there.

A space and time outside the orrery yeah

 

[PRIDEXEGO]

A space and time outside the orrery yeah

Screenshot 2026 07 06 092200 hosted at ImgBB

Image Screenshot 2026 07 06 092200 hosted on ImgBB

ibb.co

He did say outside the known multiverse.

 

[KirbyFan03]

Screenshot 2026 07 06 092200 hosted at ImgBB

Image Screenshot 2026 07 06 092200 hosted on ImgBB

ibb.co

He did say outside the known multiverse.

"Pocket timeline" outside the known MULTIVERSE


The Sphere has been said to be an ultra multiversal place before

I think you can get it to 12D yeah but nothing more

 

[Frankky123]

1. Primes reality was created by Time Trapper as a pocket dimension. An ability TT always possessed

2. Death Metals one was the true one but after that emanations appeared again in the new DC Cosmology

I mean, where does TT scales to for making reality that outside of known multiverse that makes it just unaffected by death metal destruction. And does TT scaled to this level without alpha omega energy.

 

[PRIDEXEGO]

"Pocket timeline" outside the known MULTIVERSE


The Sphere has been said to be an ultra multiversal place before

I think you can get it to 12D yeah but nothing more

If its still below speedforce wall and SOTG how did TT hide it from this Omega Darkseid.

 

[KirbyFan03]

I mean, where does TT scales to for making reality that outside of known multiverse that makes it just unaffected by death metal destruction. And does TT scaled to this level without alpha omega energy.

He'd scale above the orrery and below the Sphere

 

[Frankky123]

He'd scale above the orrery and below the Sphere

Death metal event is above that level isn't it? And TT's reality are beyond that.

 

[KirbyFan03]

If its still below speedforce wall and SOTG how did TT hide it from this Omega Darkseid.

That's a good point

However if you did read the issue you'd see supes and prime would punch their way to the future by punching space and time

It's clearly located inside the material plane but possibly cloaked as during the event Darkseid was collapsing all possibilities into him

 

[KirbyFan03]

Death metal event is above that level isn't it? And TT's reality are beyond that.

Whst reason besides vague stuff thaf got bunked in the comic

 

[Frankky123]

Whst reason besides vague stuff thaf got bunked in the comic

Not trying to be denial because im also confused. Given how prime's reality unaffected even before the hand fix it. It cant be vague for it beyond the multiverse. If only this reality isn't featured to be just fine morning while the other are fighting the god with all the destruction, yeah TT's statement could be vague. But death metal confuses me.

 

[KirbyFan03]

Not trying to be denial because im also confused. Given how prime's reality unaffected even before the hand fix it. It cant be vague for it beyond the multiverse. If only this reality isn't featured to be just fine morning while the other are fighting the god with all the destruction, yeah TT's statement could be vague. But death metal confuses me.

Primes reality was literally a pocket universe created by TT outside the known multiverse aka the material one to make sense as prime and supes punched their way to the future from there meaning its still connected to the material multiverse

Its simple

 

[Antvasima]

There is too much mostly irrelevant spam here currently. That is not the intended purpose of this thread.

 

[Antvasima]

I'm so happy for Deniz Camp!!

Yes. It was well deserved, but I think he or Al Ewing should have won the "best writer" category.

 

[DecisiveGoldfinch419]

No one is arguing about king omega superman not being High 1-A anything below does not make sense. They were arguing for base superman being 1-A.

I think that the people pushing so hard for Superman 1-A just like the rank more than the justification as to why he should be 1-A. At least that's the impression I'm getting.

 

[DecisiveGoldfinch419]

Yes. It was well deserved, but I think he or Al Ewing should have won the "best writer" category.

True true, but Al Ewing should have gotten a nomination at least.

 

[AyOgUyS]

I think that the people pushing so hard for Superman 1-A just like the rank more than the justification as to why he should be 1-A. At least that's the impression I'm getting.

Yeah the arguments the peeps are bringing up simply aren’t good and don’t meet the standards for 1-A.

 

[Rozeyroze]

Yeah the arguments the peeps are bringing up simply aren’t good and don’t meet the standards for 1-A.

This sites very specific standards*

Many people have superman at 1-A outside of VSwiki.

 

[AyOgUyS]

This sites very specific standards*

I mean you can make a Staff Thread if you really want

Many people have superman at 1-A outside of VSwiki.

Mhm.

 

[PromptedElephant641]

This sites very specific standards*

Many people have superman at 1-A outside of VSwiki.

Yeah because this is the only site that actually enforces the standards. In other websites people pretty much tier character however they want without proper justification. The standards for the term outerversal were established and refined on this site, just because other sites won’t stay consistent to and follow the established standards doesn’t mean that we will do that here. Getting a 1-A or above tier requires extremely specific evidence snd such evidence must be abundant in nature and as such, it is only reserved for the post powerful of characters who meet these qualifications. Superman simply doesn’t have any legitimate way of reaching 1-A. He doesn’t have a 1-A power source. He doesn’t have 1-A patronage. He doesn’t have some inherent mystical connection or similar such system that grants him access to 1-A capabilities. There simply is no avenue for which he could ever be rated as 1-A or above. Even if he did perform a 1-A feat it would be an inconsistency since as stated, his power source is not 1-A in nature. A 3D being like Superman can ONLY get 1-A power from a 1-A or above power source. Any such instance where a character from below performs a 1-A feat without the proper mechanisms to do so is actually an Anti-Feat against the 1-A being or structure that the lower being affected as this inherently violates the rules for qualitative transcendence.

 

[PRIDEXEGO]

Yeah because this is the only site that actually enforces the standards. In other websites people pretty much tier character however they want without proper justification. The standards for the term outerversal were established and refined on this site, just because other sites won’t stay consistent to and follow the established standards doesn’t mean that we will do that here. Getting a 1-A or above tier requires extremely specific evidence snd such evidence must be abundant in nature and as such, it is only reserved for the post powerful of characters who meet these qualifications. Superman simply doesn’t have any legitimate way of reaching 1-A. He doesn’t have a 1-A power source. He doesn’t have 1-A patronage. He doesn’t have some inherent mystical connection or similar such system that grants him access to 1-A capabilities. There simply is no avenue for which he could ever be rated as 1-A or above. Even if he did perform a 1-A feat it would be an inconsistency since as stated, his power source is not 1-A in nature. A 3D being like Superman can ONLY get 1-A power from a 1-A or above power source. Any such instance where a character from below performs a 1-A feat without the proper mechanisms to do so is actually an Anti-Feat against the 1-A being or structure that the lower being affected as this inherently violates the rules for qualitative transcendence.

Isn't his power source is "story of superman" undestructible and unmoveable story. A story that must and will continue on and cannot be manipulated even high tier like Mandrakk(cosmically charged editor) and Dr Manhattan. One fail(with support of cas) and other gives up leaving all behind after fixing it.

 

[Rozeyroze]

Yeah because this is the only site that actually enforces the standards. In other websites people pretty much tier character however they want without proper justification. The standards for the term outerversal were established and refined on this site, just because other sites won’t stay consistent to and follow the established standards doesn’t mean that we will do that here. Getting a 1-A or above tier requires extremely specific evidence snd such evidence must be abundant in nature and as such, it is only reserved for the post powerful of characters who meet these qualifications. Superman simply doesn’t have any legitimate way of reaching 1-A. He doesn’t have a 1-A power source. He doesn’t have 1-A patronage. He doesn’t have some inherent mystical connection or similar such system that grants him access to 1-A capabilities. There simply is no avenue for which he could ever be rated as 1-A or above. Even if he did perform a 1-A feat it would be an inconsistency since as stated, his power source is not 1-A in nature. A 3D being like Superman can ONLY get 1-A power from a 1-A or above power source. Any such instance where a character from below performs a 1-A feat without the proper mechanisms to do so is actually an Anti-Feat against the 1-A being or structure that the lower being affected as this inherently violates the rules for qualitative transcendence.

And this is why people don't bother making blogs, it's just gonna get written off as a outlier regardless of what is shown so nobody wants to waste their time.

Even king omega superman is getting downplayed (even though he repaired hypertime and the speed force) which darkseid was destroying with omega energy.

Don't say it shouldn't be added to his profile either because wonder woman has her AC form on hers and that form has less appearances.

 

[Wirtzwest]

The second volume of doom patrol is great. Miss Vertigo so much. A gold mine for scaling topics as well for those who are interested. Love how weird it is. Thanks Morrison.

 

[PromptedElephant641]

Isn't his power source is "story of superman" undestructible and unmoveable story. A story that must and will continue on and cannot be manipulated even high tier like Mandrakk(cosmically charged editor) and Dr Manhattan. One fail(with support of cas) and other gives up leaving all behind after fixing it.

The “Story of Superman” was a head canon mechanism that was created by social media power scalers professional wankers such as Webcamparrot and a few others 6 or so years ago. While Superman has limited plot hax in that he will always return, this is NOT really combat applicable. Plenty of people such as Doctor Manhattan have successfully manipulated the story of Superman which was how the New-52 was created. It is not some invincible immutable concept that people make it out to be. “The Story of Superman” is not an officially recognized thing by DC Comics; however, from what they actually have written in the comics, it is abundantly clear that Superman has a degree of meta narrative importance that the authors make the reader aware of on a few occasions. Once again, this DOES NOT provide Superman any increase in Attack Potency, it is more of a niche form of reality warping resistance. Basically, any time Superman’s story is manipulated, it will eventually start to return to normal, though oftentimes some of the changed elements DO continue onwards.

 

[Wirtzwest]

Why is the Overvoid paraconsistent physiology type 1?

 

[PromptedElephant641]

Why is the Overvoid paraconsistent physiology type 1?

It has PP Type-1 for being beyond dualities, as such it has a logic state of Neither X or Not-X. This is one of the four traditional logic states which are as follows: (1) X (2) Not-X (3) Both X and Not-X (4) Neither X or Not-X.

 

[PRIDEXEGO]

The “Story of Superman” was a head canon mechanism that was created by social media power scalers professional wankers such as Webcamparrot and a few others 6 or so years ago. While Superman has limited plot hax in that he will always return, this is NOT really combat applicable. Plenty of people such as Doctor Manhattan have successfully manipulated the story of Superman which was how the New-52 was created. It is not some invincible immutable concept that people make it out to be. “The Story of Superman” is not an officially recognized thing by DC Comics; however, from what they actually have written in the comics, it is abundantly clear that Superman has a degree of meta narrative importance that the authors make the reader aware of on a few occasions. Once again, this DOES NOT provide Superman any increase in Attack Potency, it is more of a niche form of reality warping resistance. Basically, any time Superman’s story is manipulated, it will eventually start to return to normal, though oftentimes some of the changed elements DO continue onwards.

We do know that superman story was not really manipulated real superman was hiding while n52 superman was doing supermaning. There is reason why Dr Manhattan don't see anything futher in the future where he meet superman face to face as everthing turn dark for him as he said "I either destroy everything or superman kills him" and we know both are not true.

The story of superman being indestructible and unstoppable story comes from final crisis itself and was said by Monitors themselves not just any Monitor but the love of Dax Novu the first monitor. So it not really a headcanon. Its the only thing that could have stop Mandarkk(Dax Novu version) in the vision of Morison and Monitors as the only thing that can pilot the Thought robot.

Screenshot 2026 07 26 020404 hosted at ImgBB

Image Screenshot 2026 07 26 020404 hosted on ImgBB

ibb.co

 

[PromptedElephant641]

We do know that superman story was not really manipulated real superman was hiding while n52 superman was doing supermaning. There is reason why Dr Manhattan don't see anything futher in the future where he meet superman face to face as everthing turn dark for him as he said "I either destroy everything or superman kills him" and we know both are not true.

The story of superman being undestructible and unmoveable story comes from final crisis itself and was said by Monitors themselves not just any Monitor but the love of Dax Novu the first monitor. So it not really a headcanon. Its the only thing that could have stop Mandarkk(Dax Novu version) in the vision of Morison and Monitors as the only thing that can pilot the Thought robot.

Screenshot 2026 07 26 020404 hosted at ImgBB

Image Screenshot 2026 07 26 020404 hosted on ImgBB

ibb.co

The reason why Doctor Manhattan couldn’t see anything is because of the release of Tachyons (Doctor Manhattan’s only weakness as they cloud his omnitemporal vision). Because he couldn’t see the future past this point, due to the burst of Tachyons, he came to the conclusion that either he ends reality or Superman must have killed him. This was obviously a mistake in judgement in Doctor Manhattan’s end as Superman is nowhere near Doctor Manhattan’s level.

The stuff by the Monitors simply refers to the fact that there will always be a Superman in Earth-0 / Earth-Prime. It does not mean that Superman is undefeatable or that he has metafictional powers that allow him to fight anyone, it simply means that Superman will always be there as the primary narrative of DC comics.

 

[PRIDEXEGO]

The reason why Doctor Manhattan couldn’t see anything is because of the release of Tachyons (Doctor Manhattan’s only weakness as they cloud his omnitemporal vision). Because he couldn’t see the future past this point, due to the burst of Tachyons, he came to the conclusion that either he ends reality or Superman must have killed him. This was obviously a mistake in judgement in Doctor Manhattan’s end as Superman is nowhere near Doctor Manhattan’s level.

The stuff by the Monitors simply refers to the fact that there will always be a Superman in Earth-0 / Earth-Prime. It does not mean that Superman is undefeatable or that he has metafictional powers that allow him to fight anyone, it simply means that Superman will always be there as the primary narrative of DC comics.

They literally call it the "indestructible and unstoppable story" no other story was mentioned like that and they search it hard to find it as the only thing that could pilot thought robot and if it wasn't they could have found anybody that has polor opposite the story of flash or batman etc.
The story of superman is relevant on this level(1-A) as it been used to fight beings at this level and beyond however you scale Mandrakk.

 

[Tarcaver]

The stuff by the Monitors simply refers to the fact that there will always be a Superman in Earth-0 / Earth-Prime. It does not mean that Superman is undefeatable or that he has metafictional powers that allow him to fight anyone, it simply means that Superman will always be there as the primary narrative of DC comics.

It is a heavily important plot point that the Monitors had to specifically find Superman and bring him to their domain or else everyone was doomed by Mandrakk. Saying Superman's story or existence wasn't that important in that regard straight up disregards the driving force behind the story of FC Superman Beyond.

 

[Wirtzwest]

It has PP Type-1 for being beyond dualities, as such it has a logic state of Neither X or Not-X. This is one of the four traditional logic states which are as follows: (1) X (2) Not-X (3) Both X and Not-X (4) Neither X or Not-X.

Is the following buddhist logic. The Overvoid is the pure ground of existence as pure ontological emptiness pervading all things down to resolving possibilities, contradictions, and distinctions. This warrants Paraconstistent physiology type 3.

 

[PromptedElephant641]

Is the following buddhist logic. The Overvoid is the pure ground of existence as pure ontological emptiness pervading all things down to resolving possibilities, contradictions, and distinctions. This warrants Paraconstistent physiology type 3.

That does not warrant PP Type-3. With maybe the possible exception of Acausality Type-5, PP Type-3 is the most difficult ability on the wiki to prove. The statement you provided is not enough for PP Type-3, but may be enough for PP Type-2 depending on the context.

The important part is the “contradictions, and distinctions” segment. Contradictions could mean a truth state of Both X and Not-X for uniting opposites while distinctions could mean that it has a truth state of Neither X or Not-X for standing apart from them. The contradictions reasoning is more so speculation. The Overvoid already has justification for Neither X or Not-X so this would mostly just bolster what is already on the profile. At most this would grant The Overvoid 2 truth states.

While a Tier 0 by definition has all powers granted at their utmost potency due to being omnipotent, when putting powers on a Tier 0’s page, only the powers that have been demonstrated are applied. While yes The Overvoid has the capacity to have PP Type-3, it is not a power it has demonstrated.

 

[Wirtzwest]

That does not warrant PP Type-3. With maybe the possible exception of Acausality Type-5, PP Type-3 is the most difficult ability on the wiki to prove. The statement you provided is not enough for PP Type-3, but may be enough for PP Type-2 depending on the context.

The important part is the “contradictions, and distinctions” segment. Contradictions could mean a truth state of Both X and Not-X for uniting opposites while distinctions could mean that it has a truth state of Neither X or Not-X for standing apart from them. The contradictions reasoning is more so speculation. The Overvoid already has justification for Neither X or Not-X so this would mostly just bolster what is already on the profile. At most this would grant The Overvoid 2 truth states.

While a Tier 0 by definition has all powers granted at their utmost potency due to being omnipotent, when putting powers on a Tier 0’s page, only the powers that have been demonstrated are applied. While yes The Overvoid has the capacity to have PP Type-3, it is not a power it has demonstrated.

Hmm, after looking at the scans of the tier 0s in this wiki only The essential divinity qualifies for type 3. Most cap at type 2.