That is true that Lumi-Arc fights them physically, plus I could have sworn that Neco-Arcs are considered far weaker than the rest of the cast. Did Lumi-Arc have any dialogue or statements putting them on a similar level with the rest of the cast? If they're weaker, then the cast probably all upscale to anything Lumi Arc can do including the super.
Yeah scaling characters to arc drives, would mess the scaling as that would mean that everyone can tank shiki Death eyes, or arceuid full power and..... alot of top tier hax really
She canonically gets a massive powerup apperently with "Reboot power"
I’m mainly talking about raw AP and less Hax although you do bring up a good point.
Yeah basically the point is that saying that they cannonically tank last arc drive would mean that 99% of the cast is 1-C
Well I mean it’s a fighting game. Tons of fighting games have attacks that seemingly destroy cities or the entire stage (Wagner’s for example) but return to it simply because they can’t just remove the stage and have the characters fight in a void or the rubble.
My fault og, I forgot about Fate scaling.
Yes, that's correct, fighting games where the super is a massive spectacle way above the character's actual shown and stated capabilities otherwise, and has a massive amount of damage done to surroundings which then is contradicted by everything being fine right after, are in fact usually not valid or used to then scale to everyone for surviving, or the character's base stats
It being a 'gag' doesn't make it any less of a feat, what does that even mean? At that point we should go ahead and nuke all the Looney Tunes profiles. It being a bright flash because the floor underneath the fighters wasn't destroyed also doesn't seem to make any sense, unless neco-arc is known for bright flashes.
Yes, it does, because this isn't Looney Tunes, I'm not sure why that's always the defense for using gag feats in any given series, "but muh Looney Tunes". This isn't a joke cartoon where all that occur are gags and so you take them as feats. This is a mostly normal series, where a very clear gag occurs, showing something absurd, very clearly not serious in the slightest, and outside of the pay grade of the person who does it. Our references for common feats page literally encourages you to scrutinize gag feats more, because something done for a gag usually isn't consistent with something you can actually use for a given verse as, well, it was meant as a gag.
It being a bright flash makes more sense when the stage isn't affected in any way, because idk if you realize right, the earth is in that galaxy that people are assuming was destroyed (all thats shown is light, nothing implying its destroyed either, this is by an attack that hit the earth too, not something even targeting the galaxy, and we've seen the results of this exact rocket being crashed from space before, and it did literally 0 damage to the planet). You'd honestly argue that her destroying the galaxy by accidentally dropping her food, and the earth being fine despite that, is the more likely interpretation from seeing nothing but a flash of light?
Those are two different types of toon feats, one is a feat that is a massive outlier, then one is made from a character who whole stick is being a joke (aka looney toones and neco arc), and that doesn't
Those are so different isn¿t even funny. One is a massive outlier that breaks the scaling and is obviously a first type joke, the second is a thing that only scales to a specific character (because unless you want to give 99% of the cast resistance to shiki funny death manipulation based on arc drives)
Except the second is also a massive outlier that breaks scaling even if you try to say others don't scale to tanking the attack, because there are people that just scale above her, and not just physically, but scale above her to the point she'd need help to fight them, or thinks she outright can't win.
And again
Nothing here addresses the things I posted above to show that it in fact does cause issues with scaling, and is an joke outlier for her own feats, besides 3 (1 ignores the fact that I gave reasons it would in fact, scale to people besides Neco), so that's all I'll address.
I am not saying that, what i am saying is that she apperently didn't use the rocket, and you can't scale arc drives because that would be a hell for scaling
Like how she got her ass beaten, or how she didn't even got to figth, or how preparing a pseudo mortal kombat death matchs is nothing really special. Specially when every character was there because their own agencies
That is not how outliers works, i don't care if a dog with a gun came out of nowhere and shoot to death arceuid at her peak, changing the tsukihime story for ever that still wouldn't be a outlier for the dog. You are literally missusing terms, outliers is not "character does big feat higher that every feat seem for now" outliers are "character big feats get contradicted by several ones"
1. Didn't you say that neco arc isn't limited by game mechanics, except when she directly mention it. Weird rigth
Ｑ：奈須きのこ作品全部を通して（空の境界、月姫、Fate、DDD）最強キャラトップ3を決めるとしたら誰になりますか？（石川県／聖なるパンダ） Ａ：マジカルアンバー（ルビーちゃん）。ネコアルク。虎。―――ではなく。 真面目な話なら1.アルクェイド、2.“両儀式”、3.原初の悪魔でしょうか。（サーヴァント除く |
Yes, he says that it's a joke. I also noted it was a joke and thus not used in my comment, that was in fact, the entire point. I'm not seeing your argument here kek
But can you prove she wouldn't have even thought of the rocket in all those cases where she says those things. When she says Akiha was equal to her and thus the fight would have went on forever, was she just omitting the existence of this attack, and they don't scale to it? When she mentioned how she needed Ciel on the ground to beat her, was she again just omitting the attack? The issue, as I've said multiple times, is you don't even need to scale people to tanking it in gameplay, because statements imply it scaling to people, or Neco herself
Are you okay? Preparing pseudo mortal kombat death matches in a route she created with characters who were different than normal, getting to narrate it, and the entire mode before the route, and tell us the story, get Miyako included in the game etc, totally nothing special I swear :copium:
That's exactly how it works kek. "Character has only feats far, far below this one, and one conditional 'feat' by using hax that is anywhere near this, therefore this feat that is several infinities higher than everything else they do and can possibly scale to, is an outlier"
???? That has nothing to do with game mechanics lol, thats talking about her strength. She's being called the same strength as the other Neco Arc from pre remake MB, idk how you misconstrued this as game mechanics (because mechanics wise she's definitely not the same strength)
The keys aren't for OG and remake, the keys are for OG Melty and the classroom scenes in Tsukihime
And again we considere characters NOT using last drives unless specifiied on canon, we alredy treath several figthing games like that
Carnival Phantasm and Melty Blood are two completely different things and just because the rocket looks similar to the one in Carnival Phantasm doesn't mean it's the exact same and that it's as weak as it. That's just making assumptions.
This makes 0 sense. This is the equivalent of saying "Ben has Alien X why doesn't he just always use that." or "Beerus has the Hakai why doesn't he just kill all threats immediately." All this stuff is in the story mode and there wouldn't be a story if Neco-Arc just said "Oh let me nuke the galaxy with this rocket I have."
Why does this matter? I've seen characters go from tier 9 or 8 to 1 before.
This makes 0 sense. When Shiki uses his Last Arc the character doesn't just instantly die because he cut their lines or when Arc does the Moon Drop it doesn't destroy everything around it. Understanding that the game you're playing is a fighting game is important.
No, when a character is acting like they are unable to beat someone at all, or that none of their moves would end a fight, we don't just act like their super move doesn't exist anymore for that moment. That'd be like taking any similar statements in Fate, and ignoring the existence of their NP because that's a super move.
Because those X characters are explicitly far, far beneath that level, that's the issue. Its an outlier because its the only feat around that level for some of them. Like if one character has a bunch of lower end things and that's their best stuff, and then suddenly one thing scales them to a god tier in a verse, you don't usually just accept that as "new scaling" that's just an outlier unless there's an absurd amount of context that makes it apply
I, huh? That's copium beyond all reasonable measures. "The identical rockets, piloted by the same person, with the same graffiti, is not the same rocket" this is despite not only the character being the same one, but also not really even having the ability to upgrade it (she states she's been ignored for the past 10 years, which she has)
No, its quite a bit different. Its more like "the person who wants to do X doesn't do X with their ability that's very capable of doing it, and its not a one off thing, this is the case multiple times in a row". I could maybe see this Alien X equivalence if it was only "oh why didn't she just nuke the MB world" (doesn't really even work there, because Ben and Beerus both have reasons for not doing what you said, Neco Arc has numerous reasons to do it, and none to not), but no, it then goes into the Neco Ciel thing, and into the Akiha thing, etc
Yes, and that's either with multiple feats, or a lot of supporting context. This has neither, this is "okay so there's this one attack with nothing supporting it besides visuals, and a ton of things against it being anywhere near what the character can actually do, lets use it." Its the equivalent of if a character who consistently tops off at wall busting, suddenly just had a one off statement that they could bust an infinite dimensional space or something. You don't just go "well, guess they're high 1-B" without a very good reason, that's how outliers work
See, the issue with ignoring the visuals because "muh fighting game, wouldn't be balanced so lets handwave it" is that, funnily enough, the entire feat is purely the visual of one frame. You can't argue to ignore the visuals in one case because its a fighting game, but then use them to get a feat. I could maybe understand if we saw at least some temporary superficial damage to the stage like other arc drives (debris existing for a few seconds at least), or actually saw the galaxy being destroyed, but no, all we see is a flash of light in the galaxy, and then we land on earth again. I'd be more of a fan of ignoring the lack of damage to the stage if we at least actually saw idk, the galaxy actually explode (which we don't), or maybe at least some rocks flying up from the damage this should have inflicted.
Master Roshi disproves this, his Kamehameha is shown destroying the moon yet he does have a higher tier while using it. His other attacks come nowhere close to this kind of power. Seemingly average fighters can have more powerful moves, this one is just a very powerful one.
Neco Arc would likely not want to blow up the galaxy during a fight, her goal isn't to just blow up everything. This sort of attack would likely be a last resort for Neco Arc.
The visuals and sound make it very clear that an explosion occurred, there isn't much an argument here for you, the developers were not going to make an entirely new stage just because the funny cat did a super, they are not a huge company with the time to do that.
