FTE feats

[NikHelton]

In fiction universes, we can often observe feats where characters completely suppress human perception and move so fast that they seem invisible.

I recently found out that the methods with 220 fps and 0.013 seconds have been disproved. I do not know the reasons, but it seems that it was approved by the administration and we cannot use it.
Some calculations on this wiki also rely on the use of subsonic reaction time, however, this has also been recently refuted.

What timeframe should we use in this case?
The peak time of human perception significantly understates the results.
Let's say a character threw a jab so fast that no one could see it. With an average arm length of 75 cm, this means that the impact velocity will be 9.375 meters/second. Even if we double the result, because the character returned the hand to its previous position, this will give us 18.75 meters per second.
This gives superhuman attack speed and doesn't even come close to FTE speed.
Blows at such a speed will be noticeable to the human eye, but the enemy's brain simply will not have time to give the command to respond.
But what about the people who are watching from the sidelines? Do they see the impact and they don't have to react to it? In order for the blow to be invisible, do you need to deceive the speed of their visual perception?

Do you have any ideas what we can do for these feats?
Maybe we should use a subsonic response or an average human perception of 60 frames per second?
I think this will give more fair results.
I will be glad if you offer your ideas.

 

[BreezeHM]

The standards are getting revised again, you can no longer use a perception speed from the page since that’s Hiding Calculations.

You either use 0.08 or rank it as a Baseline Subsonic feat.

You would need a characters stated perception speed to use it in calculations.

 

[KLOL506]

This thread is redundant because this exists.

 

[NikHelton]

This thread is redundant because this exists.

Oh, it looks like it's only recently.
Thanks for the link

 

[Vzearr]

Well, I'd like to preface I think these discuss to entirely different topics.

For a reaction blitz it would be 0.13

For a perception blitz it would be 0.029 seconds (Subsonic reaction speed)

I don't really think 0.08 seconds for a perception blitz makes any sense and think its just a way to stop calcs from getting high numbers (which I think is dense since there is no reason behind why a human wouldn't be able to perceive things at superhuman speed)

 

[NikHelton]

Why don't we use the average human perception of 40-60 fps? This is 4-6 times lower than what the pilots showed and is a mundane result.

 

[Vzearr]

Why don't we use the average human perception of 40-60 fps? This is 4-6 times lower than what the pilots showed and is a mundane result.

Could you link your source ?

 

[NikHelton]

Could you link your source ?

The Number of Frames That Human Eyes Can See Per Second

The visual cues in the world around us move at a particular rate, and our eyes can take in this information at a specific pace of perception. Most experts have a tough time agreeing on an exact number, but the conclusion is that most humans can see at a rate of 30 to 60 frames per second.

caseguard.com

 

[Vzearr]

The Number of Frames That Human Eyes Can See Per Second

The visual cues in the world around us move at a particular rate, and our eyes can take in this information at a specific pace of perception. Most experts have a tough time agreeing on an exact number, but the conclusion is that most humans can see at a rate of 30 to 60 frames per second.

caseguard.com

I don't really like when a site doesn't show you the studies behind it. I could make a site and say humans perceive things at 100 frames per second and say that the numbers come from experts but I'd just be blatantly lying. I'd find a more reliable source. Just my opinion though.

 

[NikHelton]

Well, you can look for a more reliable source and provide it here

 

[Vzearr]

Well, you can look for a more reliable source and provide it here

I personally think the subsonic reaction speed timeframe would be perfect for perception blitzes. (0.029s)

 

[BreezeHM]

I personally think the subsonic reaction speed timeframe would be perfect for perception blitzes. (0.029s)

this got nuked in that thread Klol linked.

 

[Vzearr]

this got nuked in that thread Klol linked.

It didn't ? That thread discusses reaction speed timeframes not perception speed.

 

[BreezeHM]

It didn't ? That thread discusses reaction speed timeframes not perception speed.

From the replies, it’s seem to apply to both, unless people are saying perception when they mean reaction.

 

[Vzearr]

From the replies, it’s seem to apply to both, unless people are saying perception when they mean reaction.

I'm failing to realise why this thread would even be accepted for abolishing perception speeds when there is no evidence behind why using 0.08s is better then using subsonic reaction speed as human's cap on perception speed.

 

[NikHelton]

I'm failing to realise why this thread would even be accepted for abolishing perception speeds when there is no evidence behind why using 0.08s is better then using subsonic reaction speed as human's cap on perception speed.

Bro, the best thing you can do is find a reliable alternative.
The only person who supported this method abandoned it.

 

[Vzearr]

Bro, the best thing you can do is find a reliable alternative.
The only person who supported this method abandoned it.

Sorry but what exactly is unreliable about using subsonic speed for a cap on human perception ?

Humans can no longer perceive some objects after they go past 34.3 m/s, so it would only make sense for human perception speed to be 1 / 34.2 (0.0292 seconds). I don't understand why I'm "wrong" here.

 

[NikHelton]

Sorry but what exactly is unreliable about using subsonic speed for a cap on human perception ?

Humans can no longer perceive some objects after they go past 34.3 m/s, so it would only make sense for human perception speed to be 1 / 34.2 (0.0292 seconds). I don't understand why I'm "wrong" here.

Because we don't have any studies that give us these numbers.

You can watch and follow Bugatti from the side, which is traveling at a speed of 400 km/h and you can see the meteorite fall, which is 11 km/second in total.

However, this does not give us a supersonic or high hypersonic reaction.

 

[Vzearr]

Because we don't have any studies that give us these numbers.

You can watch and follow Bugatti from the side, which is traveling at a speed of 400 km/h and you can see the meteorite fall, which is 11 km/second in total.

However, this does not give us a supersonic or high hypersonic reaction.

I'm using battle wiki numbers.

 

[Furudo_Erika]

The human eye doesn't see in "frames" as the universe doesn't have a framerate; there is no framerate of "reality".
And even if it did, the human eye can still distinguish between 120 - 240 fps, some games nowadays actually have an 120+ fps option in fact, and some games have frame rate options above that (such as 240 fps).

 

[Furudo_Erika]

This article actually does list the speed of human perception could be as quick as 13 milliseconds.
As in, you can see an image that popped on a screen for only 13 milliseconds and still recognize enough detail to know what it is.
13 ms is still enough time for the human eye to process visual input.

13 ms = 0.013 seconds (76.923 m/s)
So according to that article, the human eye could have Subsonic perception speed (not reaction speed, that's something entirely different)

"Perception speed" as in:
Your eye is still fast enough to "capture" the image that only appears for 13 ms, but it still takes time for you to realize that you saw something (which would be reaction speed). But according to the article, 13 milliseconds still isn't quick enough to escape the eye, if it can still be "captured" by it.

And to prove this, here is a test: STROBE WARNING
Turn this to 60 fps, and if you can make out detail with some of the images, you can perceive detail in 1/60 seconds...or ~16.7 milliseconds.
Which would make you have Subsonic perception speed, as you eyes can "capture" the information on images.

If you go 30 fps, that'll be 33.4 ms instead, which is the upper end of Superhuman.

 

[NikHelton]

This article actually does list the speed of human perception could be as quick as 13 milliseconds.
As in, you can see an image that popped on a screen for only 13 milliseconds and still recognize enough detail to know what it is.
13 ms is still enough time for the human eye to process visual input.

13 ms = 0.013 seconds (76.923 m/s)
So according to that article, the human eye could have Subsonic perception speed (not reaction speed, that's something entirely different)

"Perception speed" as in:
Your eye is still fast enough to "capture" the image that only appears for 13 ms, but it still takes time for you to realize that you saw something (which would be reaction speed). But according to the article, 13 milliseconds still isn't quick enough to escape the eye, if it can still be "captured" by it.

And to prove this, here is a test: STROBE WARNING
Turn this to 60 fps, and if you can make out detail with some of the images, you can perceive detail in 1/60 seconds...or ~16.7 milliseconds.
Which would make you have Subsonic perception speed, as you eyes can "capture" the information on images.

If you go 30 fps, that'll be 33.4 ms instead, which is the upper end of Superhuman.

For some reason unknown to me, 0.013 seconds were rejected

 

[Furudo_Erika]

For some reason unknown to me, 0.013 seconds were rejected

For reaction speed, definitely should be rejected.
Perception speed however...it shouldn't be.

 

[Vzearr]

For some reason unknown to me, 0.013 seconds were rejected

Well under this there's "similar" threads and the only thing that was rejected was 0.002 second perception speed so I don't know about that.

 

[MorrisHatesYou]

Bump

 

[MorrisHatesYou]

I personally think the subsonic reaction speed timeframe would be perfect for perception blitzes. (0.029s)

I agree with this sentiment, 0.08s just isn't right

 

[MorrisHatesYou]

For some reason unknown to me, 0.013 seconds were rejected

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/U...k_ton_of_people?commentId=4400000000003546438