Yeah that Deviantart Raoh calc should be looked up, also there's Deviantart calc for the Jagi feat too
@Jasonsith calcs are fine, but there's so many variants, that most people that don't know the series will not be able to decide which one is the most accurate.
I have unlocked the page for you to edit.
Please elaborate.
The are many variants in his calc. Results that ranges from city level to multi-continent level
I mean I already "edited" the Goten Sho calc on deviantart by putting in speeds of 1/34.3 seconds and 1/220 seconds for each of the 2 calcs, and I added the AP values for the split, which the DA calc ignores.
Okay. Noted.
I don't know
Check the assorted feats page, I'm pretty sure someone else rejected it.
Sorry that took so long, I'm kinda slow when it comes to these things, I applied the edits
I support your intelligence 100%, btw.
Okay.
@Therefir @DMUA @Jasonsith @Migue79 @Amelia_Lonelyheart
Oh absolutely. Unless the currently-running Fist of the Blue Sky stuff gives us anything close to that, we can't use it.
Quick one: the cloud hole diameter should roughly equal to height of Thouther himself. So I doubt the AP is meaningful in upgrading anything unless you want me to downgrade it.
Unless this gets accepted somehow, ye
I'm also fine with FTL likely far higher for the top tiers
I think it's worth using calc
I think that Ken scales at the same level as Kasumi, if not slightly above him
I found this. apparently it's a couple of Japanese HNK fans discussing who is the strongest successor in Hokuto Shinken's history. In my understanding,
Kasumi has better skill feats, but we're talking about the strongest here, also if the Fist of the North Star X Fist of the Blue Sky Guidebook thing it's true, then Ken has the better statements since it is the WOG itself.
Yeah but it was the same ritual, the diference was that in HNK they left a bit vague while in SNK they went more into the details which puts Ken at least at the same level as Kasumi
Ryuken said that Kasumi was stronger than him, and he was right, Kasumi is indeed stronger than him, but so is Kenshiro. Koryu (A man who's said to be equal if not stronger than Ryuken) said that, thanks to Toki, Raoh, and Kenshiro Hokuto has never being this strong (and Raoh was able to easily beat him) Hyo also surpassed Juukei
I mean while you're kinda right, is worth mention that Kenshiro was beating Hyoh and the same said that Kenshiro would have beat him if the fight continued.
It's true Raoh did not classified as a successor, but it was not because he's lack of talent no, it was because of his evil ambitions, if that wasn't the case he would become a successor, as Koryu himself said Toki, Raoh, and Ken could all be successors if they were born if different eras. Raoh didn't do the initiation ritual, but he was one of the only 2 Hokuto masters, able to master the Musou Tensei, something that Kasumi would have no answer for. Also Raoh did master many, many martial arts, possibly much more than Ken and Kasumi.
Ken technically lost the intitiation ritual, since he lost to Kaioh the first time, which means that you would need to actually prove that Ken's was the same as Kasumi's; it wasn't left vague at all, it was expressly stated by Ken that he only lived though Shuken's life
Keywords: "said to be", and regardless, the Ryuken Koryu fought was very clearly not prime Ryuken since he only became a successor after the altercation with Koryu, which means that there is no direct comparison between the two. Saying that the Ryuken Koryu fought was at his strongest would be like saying that Ken right before losing to Shin was at his strongest because he had just become successor. Same goes with the other statement, 1) there's no evidence that he'd know of Kasumi 2) he's specifically refering to Toki, Raoh AND Kenshiro together, never in the history of Hokuto has there been more than 1 successor-worthy member at a time. Hyoh surpassing Jukei doesn't really matter, the scaling still puts Kasumi as stronger than Post MT 100% Ken at a bare minimum; the Juukei Ryuken fought was also most likely much stronger than the one who stalemated bloodlusted Hyoh while very clearly trying not to kill him.
After getting a huge amp by awakening his blood
Doesn't really matter, you couldn't possibly surpass the power of a martial art without even mastering it yet, especially when Ken himself becomes unquantifiably stronger than Raoh even before obtaining the full potential of Hokuto. Raoh mastering many martial arts doesn't matter when we already know that Toki scales above him in skill and Ken scales relative to Toki, the Red Berret Colonel is stated to have mastered every martial art, does that mean that he's more skilled than Raoh?
This was obviously retconned. Both of the Nyoninzos are stated to be mystical objects that hold knowledge of the Hokuto Sōke and Hokuto Shinken from millennia past. And both serve the same purpose
Koryu explicitly that each one could be a successor in their own right.
No. you are excluding the fact the both Buronson and Hara said that Ken is the strongest man in Hokuto history period. and it was from the oficial Fist of the North Star X Fist of the Blue Sky Guidebook. that already gives more credibility to Kenshiro. also Kaioh is much stronger and deadlier than Liu Zongwu.
Still, this is full power Kenshiro we're talking about afterall.
False equivalence Colonel did not master Hokuto, while Raoh did it, so he's much stronger than him. And i only used the fact that Raoh mastered more martial arts than Ken and Kasumi, not to say that he was more skilled than them, but just to show that he is a very versatile fighter.
This is obvious a headcanon, Kasumi never used Musou Tensei in any of his fights, he never even mentions anything about it, the only time he "used" Musou Tensei he was not even conscious, and when he wake up, he didn't even fully remember what happened, he only seemed to have a vague recollection of it (unless you count with the Regenesis anime) His Musou Tensei did not even looked similar to the real MT, it could very well be a incomplete version.
"this was obviously retconned" is not an argument. Prove it. That's a wiki article, it doesn't matter
and still says that all of the three put together made Hokuto "the strongest it's ever been", also, prove Koryu knew of Kasumi and how strong he was
using a second hand account from a forum of a guide nobody knows anything about is not valid, especially when the translation is nigh unintellegible. Get a copy of the book, have it translated, and then maybe we can have a talk about that. Kaioh is deadlier than Liu? Based on what exactly? And you really wanna go on about word of god from guides? the Sekimatsu Haou Retsuden guide has prime Ryuken on the same level as Kaioh and End of Series Ken; the manga itself>guides and WOG regardless
Which is irrelevant, I don't understand why you'd bring up him mastering a bunch of fodder martial arts when talking about him surpassing the power of Hokuto
The only headcanon I see here is yours, tell me, how could Kasumi have obtained "the fullest for of Hokuto" without having mastered Musou Tensei? Him not using it is not an argument, he has yet to fight anyone who pushes him to go all out, let alone use Musou Tensei; by the same logic, can you show me Ken using Soryu Tenha? No? Must mean Ken never mastered that move.
none of this matters, it's your word against an omniscient being in the series, you not thinking that Kasumi has the prerequisites to obtain Musou Tensei doesn't matter. It's not a matter of "taking at face value", it's a very simple, straight forward statement with next to no context to it, so, unless you wanna prove the taoist wrong, no amount of "i think" and "maybe it's an hyperbole" will change annything.
Please explain further.
