Fire Emblem discussion thread 3 (Houses): ZA WARUDO is now a green -haired child

[DarkDragonMedeus]

To be honest, it does sound fitting to make Edelgard the most overpowered character in the game given how she's one of main villains in most routes; at least besides Immaculate One and Nemesis. But I do agree Dimitri being the underdog of the three seems weird. But I suppose it makes up for his route having the easiest levels or his house being the most simplistic to manage.

 

[PaChi2]

She'd still be in an armored class, my dood. And armored classes lack mobility and canto. Giving her the ability to use magic is the only way for us to have some reason to use that class. She'd be a better mortal savant at best. Which isnt very good, but it'd make her unique.

Dimitri, underdog? Wyvern Lord Dimitri is easily top 2 strongest unit in the game. With only Barbarossa Claude on top because his bow is >>>>>>>> Any weapon Dimitri has access to in that class.

Dimitri's stat growths are the best in the game for a physical unit.

 

[PaChi2]

So rare it's not even worth mentioning. I'd like them to be more common.

^This would give a reason for us to use those horse/armor-protection skills. Because currently they are basically worthless. Ridersbane and Armorsbane are too uncommon. Arrows are the only thing you should watch out for.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Except, you said Edelgard's ability is broken; and she basically plays like a female Hector. And personally, I make her a Warmaster; everyone's always saying Caspar is the ultimate heavy hitter, but Edelgard happens to be a bigger, stronger, and tougher version of Caspar. But between axes and brawling, she's super tough with that.

 

[PaChi2]

The only thing broken about Edelgard is her weapon, that can be used in any class.

Im just trying to fix her personal class being so inferior to common classes like Wyvern Lord or Falcon Knight, or Assassin.

"Emperor Edelgard" is not that good of a unit. Edelgard has better options to choose from.

 

[PaChi2]

Except, you said Edelgard's ability is broken; and she basically plays like a female Hector. And personally, I make her a Warmaster; everyone's always saying Caspar is the ultimate heavy hitter, but Edelgard happens to be a bigger, stronger, and tougher version of Caspar. But between axes and brawling, she's super tough with that.

You must be confused, because you cant make Edelgard WarMaster. Its a male-only class.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Probably was referring to her Emperor Class then; I know I trained her with Armor, Axes, and Brawling and she still remained by MVP.

 

[FDrybob]

She would've been even better if you made her a Wyvern Lord, or even a Warrior. Offensive classes are superior in this game due to the large, open maps and heavy emphasis on player phase.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

I do agree she'd make an excellent Wyvern Lord. And she was a Warrior before her promotion to Empress.

 

[DemonGodMitchAubin]

So I finally got around to finishing Golden Deer, and I gotta say, I'm glad I played it last, it felt like the most complete and satisfying route, I really liked Claude and I feel that I really agree with him politically, as well, since Silver Snow, Crimson Flower, and Blue Lions, I was wondering for so long, who the hell are TWSITD, what went on with Nemesis, and what are the Heroes Relics, and finally Rhea/Seiros told us everything about Zanado, the Red Canyon, and everything above, which was the biggest relief ever, finally knowing all the pieces of Three Houses, and because of that, I'm a little more sympathetic to Rhea, also in this route alone, you deal with the Flame Emperor, Death Knight, TWSITD, and Nemesis, all the villains of the story, as well, Nemesis being a Final Boss was very climatic and felt like the most anime-esk ending, yeah I know he's not really developed and is kinda bland, but I thought it made sense, also God Shattering Star is just amazing, and is arguably my favorite final boss song in the game

Overall I gotta say Golden Deer was my favorite, it's just a better Silver Snow, and It feels the most satisfying storywise, Blue Lions and Crimson Flower are also good and deal with all the Dimitri and Edelgard lore too, so you really need to ay every route to know the whole Story, it's kinda like the 3 routes in Fate Stay Night

This was my favorite Fire Emblem game of the ones I have played for sure, and I'm looking forward to the new story content and extra dlc for next year

 

[FDrybob]

Warmasters are a bit OP. I think they should be allowed to attack up to six times in return for dealing less damage with each hit (and therefore increasing the value of defense). Also, mounting or dismounting a flying unit should end that unit's turn.

 

[DemonGodMitchAubin]

So where are we with feats, can we calc the Sword of the Creator supposedly splitting a Mountain, and the Javelin of Lights destroying Aileil

 

[DemonGodMitchAubin]

Javelins of Light Feat

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Actually, I it was said the Thunderbrand can split a mountain, but yes it sounds like a good feat. The Javelins of Light calculation also looks pretty good to me. But it would need input from a calc group member.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

So I am lost, people say Cyril sucks, but with Aptitude his growths are pretty great. He's no Dimitri pre Apt, but with Apt he has neat growths. Like his growths are 35/20/15/40/40/30/10/10/15 w/o aptitude and 55/40/35 /60/60/50/30/30/35 with aptitude. Can someone explain this one to me?

 

[DemonGodMitchAubin]

I'm gonna calc the Mountain Splitting feat when I find out what formula to use for it

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

There is also the Javelin Cloud Piercing feat as well.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

The Cloud splitting one should probably be at least '''Mountain level''' and possibly even Tier 6 depending on the size of the cloud and the speed it was dispersed.

 

[DemonGodMitchAubin]

I actually don't think that cloud split was that impressive

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

I mean...with Cloud splitting you never know lol

 

[DemonGodMitchAubin]

Holy Crap, I hope I got my math right

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

I told you so.

 

[DemonGodMitchAubin]

I should've listened to you

 

[DemonGodMitchAubin]

It looks like the Cloud Split needs to be changed, I noticed that the clouds don't actually go to the horizon and they don't split to the horizon, I have no way to measure the clouds as well unless someone knows how

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

It does still appear to be a Nimbostratus Cloud. And it does still say that 20 km is the standard; but 10km also works as a low end if it's a hazy day.

 

[DemonGodMitchAubin]

What I mean is that we don't see the Clouds go to the Horizon, a Calc member pointed this out

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

He was simply asking if it was being looked at from a 90 degree angle. He's asking if it was from a strait up view; because a diagonal view might imply it might get a higher result if we ang size it correctly.

 

[PaChi2]

So I am lost, people say Cyril sucks, but with Aptitude his growths are pretty great. He's no Dimitri pre Apt, but with Apt he has neat growths. Like his growths are 35/20/15/40/40/30/10/10/15 w/o aptitude and 55/40/35 /60/60/50/30/30/35 with aptitude. Can someone explain this one to me?

His bases are horrible. He doesnt benefit from waiting to recruit him since he is stuck in commoner, so you must recruit him asap if you wish to use him and babysit him until he catches up.

The "villager archetype" are characters that have aptitute(optional), but start with poor bases. You recruit them fairly early in the game and usually need to train them more than other units.

The "Est archetype" are characters that you recruit in the late game, usually not promoted or low level, that have higher bases for the level they are in and that have very high growths.

People say that both archetypes are bad because they require you to give them extra-work, and the extra exp you are giving them could have gone to another unit to make them good anyway. In higher difficulties this is important because bases become much more relevant and experience is less rhan in other diffs.

 

[DemonGodMitchAubin]

He was simply asking if it was being looked at from a 90 degree angle. He's asking if it was from a strait up view; because a diagonal view might imply it might get a higher result if we ang size it correctly.

Can you Angsize it then, I just did like 4 calcs for Three Houses today I'm a little exhausted, can you calc that

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

Okay, then isn't this only an issue in SS seeing as you can recruit Cyril pretty early in other routes?

 

[Ted_Ed]

Okay, someone make it clear for me. What tier are the 3Houses characters.

 

[PaChi2]

Okay, then isn't this only an issue in AS seeing as you can recruit Cyril pretty early in other routes?

Funnily enough, you can recruit Catherine even earlier.

As I said, thr problem is "they require you to give them extra-work, and the extra exp you are giving them could have gone to another unit to make them good anyway. In higher difficulties this is important because bases become much more relevant and experience is less rhan in other diffs."

But its not "impossible" to use them. In fact, Im currently using. Cyril in my no NG+ BL maddening run. Mostly because my Ingrid turned bad.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

I mean...i guess I don't understand "competitive" FE seeing as I don't see this as much of an issue. Wouldn't putting more effort in be simply apart of the challenge?

 

[PaChi2]

I mean...i guess I don't understand "competitive" FE seeing as I don't see this as much of an issue. Wouldn't putting more effort in be simply apart of the challenge?

We are only saying if an unit is bad or good. If the unit needs extra effort, it is bad, if not, it is good. That's mostly the rule.

For example: Felix is good because his bases are high and his growths are good. Same for Catherine.

Characters with good bases are less prone to get "RNG-screwed".

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

I find that rule to be pretty dumb tbh, as it paints a pretty bad picture of the characters actual use. But whatever.

 

[PaChi2]

Well, not everything is late game. You have to take a look at the character's whole career. And villagers start weak and have to climb their way to their full potential. "Good characters" start strong and remain strong. For example, Ingrid has a very rough start if she doesnt level up strength early.

But when playing, just use whoever you like and isnt RNG-screwed lol.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

Maybe I am just a guy who takes shit like this too seriously due to my character-centerd over a competitive mindset. So ignore me...

 

[PaChi2]

3H isnt even a game geared towards PvP. Everyone can be everything, stat boosters are literally farmed and the most notable differences between characters come from spell lists.

Crests are useless except for two or three and personal abilities are pretty standard.

Its not like Awakening or Fates, where ypu had to optimize thr pairings due to stat caps and classes.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

Well, note that when I say "competitive" i mean more towards the stat based mindset.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

@Ted Ed, we're still working on them, please be patient. Most characters will be Tier 7 for sure either from the Meteor calculation or Catherine being able to split mountains in half (That's a 7-C to Low 7-B feat usually). And it looks like those the Lords will be High 6-C at the very least; unless the Immaculate one's supposed High 6-A feat is legit. Sothis at her prime will be Low 2-C, but no one scales from her. But her weakened self should be High 6-C similar to Nemesis and Seiros.