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Fire Emblem discussion thread 3 (Houses): ZA WARUDO is now a green -haired child
- Thread starter PaChi2
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And I think it is pretty clear that I am talking about after the tomb. Not to mention that she was around during the defense at Garreg Mach iirc.
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Well, It'd make more sense for her to join the fight in the tomb because they were protecting her people's... hearts? The stones were the hearts, right? So if Rhea didnt join in an actual battle it wouldnt strike me as unusual. And yes, she fought in Chapter 12.
You can still have plenty of development for her without support conversations.
Jeritza is more needed of development because the guy:
1) Does not show up in the CF post time skip route at all.
2) His relation to Mercedes is only revealed in a paralogue. If you skip it, you are left clueless about his backstory.
3) Dood is supposedly a minor antagonist, similar to. Camus/Aversa....
You can still have plenty of development for her without support conversations.
Jeritza is more needed of development because the guy:
1) Does not show up in the CF post time skip route at all.
2) His relation to Mercedes is only revealed in a paralogue. If you skip it, you are left clueless about his backstory.
3) Dood is supposedly a minor antagonist, similar to. Camus/Aversa....
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I agree to an extent. The fact that she doesn't aid you in the tomb seems more like an out of character moment tbh considering her nature later on and on Ashe and Catherine's paralogue.
I also would consider it pretty unfair to Rhea when she's basically the "4th Lord" in the game and the other 3 get supports with others. You can build development without supports yes, but I also believe these supports are still useful and important to the characterization of FE characters as it give you detail on things you may not get answers to or get to see in the story. I want to see this stuff for Rhea as I want to know more about her and how she is to others. Like the whole idea of her not wanting to got the the diner with students because she knows they'll be nervous around her instead of being themselves would lead to some pretty wholesome and funny interactions which is what I want to see from Rhea.
TL;DR
1) I say she needs to be playable as I personally see that it makes more sense for her character to fight alongside you, especially post-TS.
2) I also believe she needs more supports just to flesh her character out along with possibly fleshing out other character's opinions on her and how she addressing any of these small concerns. I also just believe that Rhea deserves some truly wholesome moments as she severly lacks them and I want to see them to expand her character. Also, a support between her and Cyril I think is really needed as I want the kid to at least have a bit more to support his undying loyalty and obsession to Rhea aside from "she saved me despite me being a war orphan and gave my life meaning". I want to see how she treats him on a daily basis and possibly how she handles his obsession. We never truly see things from her perspective and thus I want to see this.
I am not arguing who needs more development and arguing Jeritza is irrelevant as he's getting more development by default with DLC. So arguing him is pretty pointless when I'm arguing for the future.
I also would consider it pretty unfair to Rhea when she's basically the "4th Lord" in the game and the other 3 get supports with others. You can build development without supports yes, but I also believe these supports are still useful and important to the characterization of FE characters as it give you detail on things you may not get answers to or get to see in the story. I want to see this stuff for Rhea as I want to know more about her and how she is to others. Like the whole idea of her not wanting to got the the diner with students because she knows they'll be nervous around her instead of being themselves would lead to some pretty wholesome and funny interactions which is what I want to see from Rhea.
TL;DR
1) I say she needs to be playable as I personally see that it makes more sense for her character to fight alongside you, especially post-TS.
2) I also believe she needs more supports just to flesh her character out along with possibly fleshing out other character's opinions on her and how she addressing any of these small concerns. I also just believe that Rhea deserves some truly wholesome moments as she severly lacks them and I want to see them to expand her character. Also, a support between her and Cyril I think is really needed as I want the kid to at least have a bit more to support his undying loyalty and obsession to Rhea aside from "she saved me despite me being a war orphan and gave my life meaning". I want to see how she treats him on a daily basis and possibly how she handles his obsession. We never truly see things from her perspective and thus I want to see this.
I am not arguing who needs more development and arguing Jeritza is irrelevant as he's getting more development by default with DLC. So arguing him is pretty pointless when I'm arguing for the future.
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- #125
Oh, I wasnt trying to Jeritza vs Rhea, I was just saying that Jeritza's character needed moar development. That's why Im glad he is in the DLC. Its ofdtopic.
1) If you want her playable, imo, she should join the frey in chapter 11. My point was that it wasnt needed, not that it didnt make sense. It makes more sense, actually.
I dont really mind Rhea becoming the 4th Lord in Silver Snow. I just dont want her playable as a generic character for all routes.
1) If you want her playable, imo, she should join the frey in chapter 11. My point was that it wasnt needed, not that it didnt make sense. It makes more sense, actually.
I dont really mind Rhea becoming the 4th Lord in Silver Snow. I just dont want her playable as a generic character for all routes.
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1) I agree with this. I do feel that she was needed as a playable character personally however.
Yeah, that's not what I wanted. I really would have rathered her be playable around Chpt 11 as it really makes no sense as to why she'd join you earlier on. She has no reason to.
Yeah, that's not what I wanted. I really would have rathered her be playable around Chpt 11 as it really makes no sense as to why she'd join you earlier on. She has no reason to.
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Yeah, I can understand, but as long as I'm having fun I don't care much. I kinda want it from a story point of view which is what I focus on.
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I like balancing both story and game play.
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Divine Dragons are practically immortal, so even thousands of years is still quite young. There's no such thing as old if you're immortal.
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- #135
For how old Rhea is Im surprised she has those mommy issues.
1) Creates a church around herself/her mother.
2) 1000 years later she tries to revive her mother using Byleth as vessel (forcibly, mind you). Reminds me of Awakening amd Grima.
3) Hates you for "stealing her mother" (Crimson Flower only).
Like, I get it, but she should have grown up and become independent after 1000 years. She reminds me a bit of Dimitri in that regard.
1) Creates a church around herself/her mother.
2) 1000 years later she tries to revive her mother using Byleth as vessel (forcibly, mind you). Reminds me of Awakening amd Grima.
3) Hates you for "stealing her mother" (Crimson Flower only).
Like, I get it, but she should have grown up and become independent after 1000 years. She reminds me a bit of Dimitri in that regard.
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I mean, trauma doesn't exactly go away the same for all people. We don't live for 1000s of years but it's more than likely that for an immortal Dragon Person who can live forever, it is more than likely that 1000 years is nothing but a fleeting time for them (See how Flayn is still physically and almost mentally a child. Or look back at Awakening and Nowi who is very childlike despite being 1000 years old).
It's noted that the death of Sothis caused a bunch of trauma for Rhea/Seiros. This trauma stuck with her all these years. Doesn't help that she personally witnessed her entire race be slaughtered and used as weapons for evil minus her and 4 others. That likely made things worse. It's easy for us on the outside to say "get over it" when we aren't the one facing her trauma nor do we handle trauma the same way another person does.
It's noted that the death of Sothis caused a bunch of trauma for Rhea/Seiros. This trauma stuck with her all these years. Doesn't help that she personally witnessed her entire race be slaughtered and used as weapons for evil minus her and 4 others. That likely made things worse. It's easy for us on the outside to say "get over it" when we aren't the one facing her trauma nor do we handle trauma the same way another person does.
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- #137
That... Doesnt take away anything of what I said. I get she was traumatized. I understand everything you said.
She still is chidlish when it comes to her mother and is very dependant on her after 1000 years. She didnt try to get over it. She didnt try to move on. She got stuck in that moment. That's the issue. Its the typical villain backstory. She even resents humans, after 1000 years.
Which makes me wonder what kind of mother Sothis was for Rhea to grow so dependant on her.
Heck, Lucina of all people faced her traumas better.
She still is chidlish when it comes to her mother and is very dependant on her after 1000 years. She didnt try to get over it. She didnt try to move on. She got stuck in that moment. That's the issue. Its the typical villain backstory. She even resents humans, after 1000 years.
Which makes me wonder what kind of mother Sothis was for Rhea to grow so dependant on her.
Heck, Lucina of all people faced her traumas better.
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"That... Doesnt take away anything of what I said. I get she was traumatized. I understand everything you said."
Except it does as you blatantly say "she should have grown up and become independent after 1000 years". My refuted that by saying that you cannot say one should have "grown up or gotten independant" from a trauma induced mindset.
"She didnt try to get over it. She didnt try to move on. "
Once again this is a trauma induced state. Hell, we have no idea of what happened throughtout those 1000 years so for all we know, she could have tried to "get over it" and failed. And once again, it requires more to "get over" something and you can't tell someone who is in a trauma induced state to just get over it. There needs to be more outside help. Which we are not even sure she got. Seteth and Flayn didn't return until at least 20 years before the start of everything. The other 2 Saints are pretty much in secluded places where Rhea likely can't go due to her duties as Archbishop.
"She got stuck in that moment. That's the issue. Its the typical villain backstory. She even resents humans, after 1000 years."
But Rhea is not a villain unless you play Crimson Flower, and that's only after you induce the trauma on her once again. It's a simple backstory, but it is still effective as it explains her mindset and that it's a result of intense mental trauma that she never managed to get over. I get you don't care for Rhea, but I am not going to sit here and allow you to flat out undermine her mentality and simply write it off as being "childish" because you think someone can just get over ******* trauma. Also, if she does not reset humans, she just doesn't have complete trust over them. If she resented humans, she would not have made the personal decision to aid Cyril or Catherine along with her other benevolent actions.
"Heck, Lucina of all people faced her traumas better."
And once again, not everyone can face trauma in the same way. Comparing how once handled trauma to another does nothing more than try to undermine one's trauma. I repeat, not everyone will or can handle trauma the same way. Your comparisons do not change that whatsoever.
Except it does as you blatantly say "she should have grown up and become independent after 1000 years". My refuted that by saying that you cannot say one should have "grown up or gotten independant" from a trauma induced mindset.
"She didnt try to get over it. She didnt try to move on. "
Once again this is a trauma induced state. Hell, we have no idea of what happened throughtout those 1000 years so for all we know, she could have tried to "get over it" and failed. And once again, it requires more to "get over" something and you can't tell someone who is in a trauma induced state to just get over it. There needs to be more outside help. Which we are not even sure she got. Seteth and Flayn didn't return until at least 20 years before the start of everything. The other 2 Saints are pretty much in secluded places where Rhea likely can't go due to her duties as Archbishop.
"She got stuck in that moment. That's the issue. Its the typical villain backstory. She even resents humans, after 1000 years."
But Rhea is not a villain unless you play Crimson Flower, and that's only after you induce the trauma on her once again. It's a simple backstory, but it is still effective as it explains her mindset and that it's a result of intense mental trauma that she never managed to get over. I get you don't care for Rhea, but I am not going to sit here and allow you to flat out undermine her mentality and simply write it off as being "childish" because you think someone can just get over ******* trauma. Also, if she does not reset humans, she just doesn't have complete trust over them. If she resented humans, she would not have made the personal decision to aid Cyril or Catherine along with her other benevolent actions.
"Heck, Lucina of all people faced her traumas better."
And once again, not everyone can face trauma in the same way. Comparing how once handled trauma to another does nothing more than try to undermine one's trauma. I repeat, not everyone will or can handle trauma the same way. Your comparisons do not change that whatsoever.
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- #139
I dont understand what you are trying to get by arguing, tbh. Im aware of everything you are saying.
Im just surprised by how deep is Rhea traumatized, that's all.
"Except it does as you blatantly say "she should have grown up and become independent after 1000 years". My refuted that by saying that you cannot say one should have "grown up or gotten independant" from a trauma induced mindset."
She should have done that for her own mental health, not saying that she could have done it by herself. Lol.
"I get you don't care for Rhea, but I am not going to sit here and allow you to flat out undermine her mentality and simply write it off as being "childish""
One thing and the other are true. She is childish when it comes to Sothis due to her inability to move on from her trauma. And that's it. Cause and consecuence. Everything I said was remarking her trauma...?
When it comes to Rhea I get you are going to misunderstand everything I say and think the worst out of it. Bleh. Im out.
Im just surprised by how deep is Rhea traumatized, that's all.
"Except it does as you blatantly say "she should have grown up and become independent after 1000 years". My refuted that by saying that you cannot say one should have "grown up or gotten independant" from a trauma induced mindset."
She should have done that for her own mental health, not saying that she could have done it by herself. Lol.
"I get you don't care for Rhea, but I am not going to sit here and allow you to flat out undermine her mentality and simply write it off as being "childish""
One thing and the other are true. She is childish when it comes to Sothis due to her inability to move on from her trauma. And that's it. Cause and consecuence. Everything I said was remarking her trauma...?
When it comes to Rhea I get you are going to misunderstand everything I say and think the worst out of it. Bleh. Im out.
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I guess I'm reading you wrong as I been inferring that you are saying that she's childish because she has yet to get over her trauma (which I vehemently disagree with).
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I compared her to Dimitri. If that doesnt tell you that I believe she is deeply traumatized, Idk what will.Dragonmasterxyz said:
Idk how you ended up reading "I believe Rhea is childish because she cant get over her mother's death". Im just surprised that after 1000 years she couldnt, which can be explained by your first paragraph in the first reply.
Me using Lucina was just to say that we have other traumatized characters in the franchise that could move on. Which remarks on how badly Rhea has been able to handle her issue, which means she needed help but she didnt get it. In 1000 years. Which is sad (for her).
Since Seteth and Flayn are apparently still trying to move on from their mother/wife's death, I guess they all have issues at handling loss. Doesnt mean they are better or worse, its how they are.
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Also, i find it somewhat dissapointed based on the seecond trailer's impression EVERYONE was going to get an "bad-end" form, but just Edelgard and kinda Dimitri end up like that.
I assumed Byleth would get a precognition of such war and side with one of the three to get them be good and avoid their bad-end punished forms.
But no. No matter what you do, Claude will alwaays be a good guy.
I assumed Byleth would get a precognition of such war and side with one of the three to get them be good and avoid their bad-end punished forms.
But no. No matter what you do, Claude will alwaays be a good guy.
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My issues from your comment and how it came off is that "Rhea should have gotten over said trauma because X character got over said trauma" and it seemed as though you undermined said trauma and acted like it was unreasonable for her to still be hurt by said trauma. Hence why the whole "she should have grown up--" comment angered me as it read to me that you assumed that she should have gotten over said trauma.
My issue also comes from the word "should" as this implies that all trauma works the same. You have to have a reason or evidence to assume that someone should work past X trauma because of Y. Otherwise, there is no reason as to why she should have gotten over said trauma when there is no direct timeframe for Dragon Goddesses to get over their trauma.
Except, your comment on how Lucina came off as "Lucina handled her trauma better and as such Rhea should be able to handle it as well" based on how you worded it as you said "heck, even Lucina faced her traumas better" without any further context on your points. As, going by your post, I get this implication.
Also, don't start playing the whole "you are going to purposely think the worst out of it because it's Rhea" card. Like, instead of correcting the mistake, you'd rather just accuse me of purposely twisting your words which is pretty scummy.
But let's drop this.
My issue also comes from the word "should" as this implies that all trauma works the same. You have to have a reason or evidence to assume that someone should work past X trauma because of Y. Otherwise, there is no reason as to why she should have gotten over said trauma when there is no direct timeframe for Dragon Goddesses to get over their trauma.
Except, your comment on how Lucina came off as "Lucina handled her trauma better and as such Rhea should be able to handle it as well" based on how you worded it as you said "heck, even Lucina faced her traumas better" without any further context on your points. As, going by your post, I get this implication.
Also, don't start playing the whole "you are going to purposely think the worst out of it because it's Rhea" card. Like, instead of correcting the mistake, you'd rather just accuse me of purposely twisting your words which is pretty scummy.
But let's drop this.
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I mean.....
That's objective fact...anyone who says otherwise is delusional.
That's objective fact...anyone who says otherwise is delusional.
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@PaChi
Not really. They just wanted a big monster boss for Azure Moon.
@Ted
They are 7-C though...
Not really. They just wanted a big monster boss for Azure Moon.
@Ted
They are 7-C though...
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How bad are we talking?
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She also had to bear the murderers of her people be acclaimed as heroes for 1k years.
she bear all of that because she desired peace but i'm pretty sure it must have been a constant hell for her , constantly reminding her about it .
Rhea : is the "bad guy" in one route and burn a village
Edelgard : is the bad guy in all the other routes and burn pretty much the whole continent all the while siding with TWSITD , pretty much the cause for all the bad shit in the game .
mmmh i wonder who is worse...
she bear all of that because she desired peace but i'm pretty sure it must have been a constant hell for her , constantly reminding her about it .
Rhea : is the "bad guy" in one route and burn a village
Edelgard : is the bad guy in all the other routes and burn pretty much the whole continent all the while siding with TWSITD , pretty much the cause for all the bad shit in the game .
mmmh i wonder who is worse...
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They scale to the meteor feat we scale all other Fire Emblem games with meteor to.Ted Ed said:
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Both Edelgard and Rhea have done pretty shitty things. Overtime, I have come to a conclusion that both are morally gray, but Rhea is someone I sympathize with more and as such I stand with her.
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"She also had to bear the murderers of her people be acclaimed as heroes for 1k years."
The church of Seiros called them Heroes.
"Edelgard : is the bad guy in all the other routes and burn pretty much the whole continent all the while siding with TWSITD , pretty much the cause for all the bad shit in the game ."
Have you played CF? Edelgard distrust those guys from the very beginning. Hubert states that once the Church dies, a new war in the shadows would start. As a Flame Emperor she tells Thales that his kind wouldnt flourish or something like that. Edelgard's relation to TWSITD is of "truce until we kill our mutual enemy".
The church of Seiros called them Heroes.
"Edelgard : is the bad guy in all the other routes and burn pretty much the whole continent all the while siding with TWSITD , pretty much the cause for all the bad shit in the game ."
Have you played CF? Edelgard distrust those guys from the very beginning. Hubert states that once the Church dies, a new war in the shadows would start. As a Flame Emperor she tells Thales that his kind wouldnt flourish or something like that. Edelgard's relation to TWSITD is of "truce until we kill our mutual enemy".
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i really have a huge problem with edelgard with how hypocritical she is.
almost nothing that came out of her mouth match her actions :
"the church is evil because it manipulate fodland and destroy anyone that oppose it" > proceed to destroy anyone that oppose her and want to actually rule over all of fodland
"this war is for the people" > kill the people , raid villages , kill the population and leave the orphans to be taken care by the so called evil church
" i hate TWSITD and their horrible experiments" > proceed to ally with them and gladly profits from said horrible experiments , those crest beasts she need won't make themselves after all.
" my path is the less bloody path" > proceed to start war against the whole continent without even trying to open dialogue or try politics first .She even try to kill claude, dimitri and probably a lot of other students right at the begining.
almost nothing that came out of her mouth match her actions :
"the church is evil because it manipulate fodland and destroy anyone that oppose it" > proceed to destroy anyone that oppose her and want to actually rule over all of fodland
"this war is for the people" > kill the people , raid villages , kill the population and leave the orphans to be taken care by the so called evil church
" i hate TWSITD and their horrible experiments" > proceed to ally with them and gladly profits from said horrible experiments , those crest beasts she need won't make themselves after all.
" my path is the less bloody path" > proceed to start war against the whole continent without even trying to open dialogue or try politics first .She even try to kill claude, dimitri and probably a lot of other students right at the begining.
- sigh* Byleth saving her at the start of the game is the worst mistake of his life .She should have died by the same bandits she hired , would have been a fiting end for her .
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