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Fairy Tail Possible Upgrades
- Thread starter Dragonmasterxyz
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I will let the others decide what to do. Can I assume you are on faction 3? ovoSaikou The Lewd King said:
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This thread seems to be running a lot on whataboutery.
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I guess.
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Unsure about her being a Glass Cannon. I'd have to heard what Blanked and Dragon think.
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My original plan was to put everyone back to where they were before the initial downgrade. Dunno if that's gonna happen now tho.
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Here is the problem of Erza's durabilty. Now her AP in clean heart cloth is superior than in any other armor while her defence is equal to her base.
The thing is even in her base she was never one shotted by persons who essentially should come close to doing it.
I personally think her durabilty should scale differently from her AP in any case or maybe that can simply be attributed to her abilty to take shit ton of punishment.
That said she is a sort of a glass canon when using Clean heart cloth(only with that tho).
The thing is even in her base she was never one shotted by persons who essentially should come close to doing it.
I personally think her durabilty should scale differently from her AP in any case or maybe that can simply be attributed to her abilty to take shit ton of punishment.
That said she is a sort of a glass canon when using Clean heart cloth(only with that tho).
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Erza generally has better durabilty feats than other characters in the series and usually her durabilty>her AP going by feats.
That said i am fine with threating her clean heart cloth as sort of a glass canon tho it should be underlined she won't get one shotted in any case due to her abilty to take punishment or stamina or whatever.
That said i am fine with threating her clean heart cloth as sort of a glass canon tho it should be underlined she won't get one shotted in any case due to her abilty to take punishment or stamina or whatever.
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Count me in for the not really care as long as it is legit. ovo
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Would this affect Erza only or the God Tiers and High Tiers as well?
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The Reaching is real.
Firstly the entire feat should be a huge outlier. Irene rekt Erza with the most casual of touches. Only has her one arm to move,launches herself and the meteor (she uses her clear geart armor which reduces her durability; as it swaps all defense for offense) spouts FT's classic friendship speeches and oneshots the meteor and nullifies the resulting KE. Which means it would scale to her durability. Which is nonsense ontop of destroying the meteor.
Erza did not get a powerup of any sorts. Nowhere is this written or implied at all. Using a friendship speech to upgrade this is hilariously wanked, in all honesty. All it was; was to boost her morale/motivation, let's not get carried away here
So it is PIS. Which is why it was deemed a outlier in the first place.
Also to whoever said Erza beat Irene. Irene stabbed herself.
Firstly the entire feat should be a huge outlier. Irene rekt Erza with the most casual of touches. Only has her one arm to move,launches herself and the meteor (she uses her clear geart armor which reduces her durability; as it swaps all defense for offense) spouts FT's classic friendship speeches and oneshots the meteor and nullifies the resulting KE. Which means it would scale to her durability. Which is nonsense ontop of destroying the meteor.
Erza did not get a powerup of any sorts. Nowhere is this written or implied at all. Using a friendship speech to upgrade this is hilariously wanked, in all honesty. All it was; was to boost her morale/motivation, let's not get carried away here
So it is PIS. Which is why it was deemed a outlier in the first place.
Also to whoever said Erza beat Irene. Irene stabbed herself.
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@LAS
1) Try to be less condescending
2) We have literally been talking and proving with scans about how magic is intrinsically tied with emotions, willpower, love, etc. in Fairy Tail for two threads now.
3) It is 100% logical that Erza would be boosted when performing the feat. We also spend multiple threads talking about how these things are completely common in Shounen. Characters doing things which were otherwise / previously impossible.
4) It's less PIS and more the series following with established mechanics. You may think it is bad writing but not PIS and outlier is being debated heavily.
1) Try to be less condescending
2) We have literally been talking and proving with scans about how magic is intrinsically tied with emotions, willpower, love, etc. in Fairy Tail for two threads now.
3) It is 100% logical that Erza would be boosted when performing the feat. We also spend multiple threads talking about how these things are completely common in Shounen. Characters doing things which were otherwise / previously impossible.
4) It's less PIS and more the series following with established mechanics. You may think it is bad writing but not PIS and outlier is being debated heavily.
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Not really a PIS because Erza also overwhelmed Acnologia afterwards, not overpower but she was still able to push him back.
And yes, Emotional rage is a thing in FT, natsu litrally beat Zeref becuase of flames of Wild emotions
As much as of a bs it is, this is an actual thing in FT. Characters evolve in mid battle due to this, most of the Natsu and Erza fights in the series are proof of this
And yes, Emotional rage is a thing in FT, natsu litrally beat Zeref becuase of flames of Wild emotions
As much as of a bs it is, this is an actual thing in FT. Characters evolve in mid battle due to this, most of the Natsu and Erza fights in the series are proof of this
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Aizen had said everything I have to think about this.
Everyone is taking these friendship power ups too literally. The jump from baseline 7-A is ridiculous. Can't see how everyone is using the excuse that she did this with the power of friendship.
Erza doesn't have a single feat anywhere close to High 6-C. Unless you wanna scale her to Natsu which is honestly ridiculous. A single attack from Irene was enough to almost kill Erza yet here Erza is overpowering one of her strongest attacks. Makes zero sense. Hell we even consider that fight as Plot Induced Stupidity in Irenes profile.
Also these things really aren't very common in Shounen mangas especially to this extent. Using the argument that the power of friendship is pure head canon.
Everyone is taking these friendship power ups too literally. The jump from baseline 7-A is ridiculous. Can't see how everyone is using the excuse that she did this with the power of friendship.
Erza doesn't have a single feat anywhere close to High 6-C. Unless you wanna scale her to Natsu which is honestly ridiculous. A single attack from Irene was enough to almost kill Erza yet here Erza is overpowering one of her strongest attacks. Makes zero sense. Hell we even consider that fight as Plot Induced Stupidity in Irenes profile.
Also these things really aren't very common in Shounen mangas especially to this extent. Using the argument that the power of friendship is pure head canon.
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Pretty sure in YYH, Hiei, Kurama, and Kuwabara jumped from 7-C ish to High 6-C+ from watching Yusuke die...Knightofannihilation666 said:
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"Everyone is taking these friendship power ups too literally."
Because it is literal. As was explained multiple times.
"The jump from baseline 7-A is ridiculous. Can't see how everyone is using the excuse that she did this with the power of friendship."
Because emotion-based power boosts exist in Fairy Tail. We accept them for a phletora of Verses, even more so when it is simple Rage Boosts. It is pure bias not to do the same for Fairy Tail.
"Erza doesn't have a single feat anywhere close to High 6-C"
She has this, while she is amping her Attack Potency through multiple sources and pushing herself to newfound limits.
" A single attack from Irene was enough to almost kill Erza yet here Erza is overpowering one of her strongest attacks. Makes zero sense."
If you ignore all the context it does. But if you analyze the verse without bias it is very consistent with its internal logic.
"Also these things really aren't very common in Shounen mangas especially to this extent."
They are, and often to greater extents. Saint Seiya has people going from 6-B to 4-A in minutes by sheer strength of willpower and emotions.
"Using the argument that the power of friendship is pure head canon."
What is stated on page isn't a headcanon. It's a fact.
Because it is literal. As was explained multiple times.
"The jump from baseline 7-A is ridiculous. Can't see how everyone is using the excuse that she did this with the power of friendship."
Because emotion-based power boosts exist in Fairy Tail. We accept them for a phletora of Verses, even more so when it is simple Rage Boosts. It is pure bias not to do the same for Fairy Tail.
"Erza doesn't have a single feat anywhere close to High 6-C"
She has this, while she is amping her Attack Potency through multiple sources and pushing herself to newfound limits.
" A single attack from Irene was enough to almost kill Erza yet here Erza is overpowering one of her strongest attacks. Makes zero sense."
If you ignore all the context it does. But if you analyze the verse without bias it is very consistent with its internal logic.
"Also these things really aren't very common in Shounen mangas especially to this extent."
They are, and often to greater extents. Saint Seiya has people going from 6-B to 4-A in minutes by sheer strength of willpower and emotions.
"Using the argument that the power of friendship is pure head canon."
What is stated on page isn't a headcanon. It's a fact.
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Yeah gotta hand this to FT, they have a tendency to weaponize feelings as any other shonen. Friendship, willpower, etc. Heck even other powers apply. Gotta be not bias and give them this at least. Sides, Wendy gave the buff to Erza to allow her to harm her mom anyway.
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Everyone.
Seriously.
Friendship power ups, as memetic as they are in this series, are a canon thing in FT.
You can't just dismiss them because they're Power of Friendship power-ups.
This only scales to Ezra under this particular amp, but it is a legitimate feat.
Seriously.
Friendship power ups, as memetic as they are in this series, are a canon thing in FT.
You can't just dismiss them because they're Power of Friendship power-ups.
This only scales to Ezra under this particular amp, but it is a legitimate feat.
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As COB and Ever mentioned, it probably scales tonly to Erza in this particular instance.
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A seperate key for High 6-C AP and no Durability?
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"This only scales to Ezra under this particular amp, but it is a legitimate feat."
This should scale her to island level in general, tho. As I said before, she was still able to push Acnologia (God tier of the verse), implying the boost was not only for Irene fight but permanent amp.
Other example would be Natsu, who one punch-ed Zeref just after he no diffed him before, and the reason was Rage boost, another emotion based power up
There are many same cases in the series itself, mainly involving Natsu and Erza.
This should scale her to island level in general, tho. As I said before, she was still able to push Acnologia (God tier of the verse), implying the boost was not only for Irene fight but permanent amp.
Other example would be Natsu, who one punch-ed Zeref just after he no diffed him before, and the reason was Rage boost, another emotion based power up
There are many same cases in the series itself, mainly involving Natsu and Erza.
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This isnt an outlier, its just Mashima at it again. Friendship and the will to do something gets people far in FT. Natsu cant deal with Laxus with Gajeel yet 2 shots DF Laxus? The FT 6 cant deal with Ajeel but then Natsu pulls up destroys his strongest attack and punches him away? Gray basically 2 shotting Rufus after removing his shirt this kind of feats are all over FT. Why? Its Mashimas way of saying "friendship gets through everything" or its just PIS, which is all over FT. If we discount this, we discount ALL of FT feats simply because most of their feats are them pulling some BS off a hat, real magic (see what I did there).
I get this isnt the strongest of points, but again this isnt the only time weve seen Erza bs her way out of an impossible situation, such as in Tenrou islands she had NO REASON to survive all those blasts, she said so herself. Its just Mashimas writing, this feat should not be considered an outlier
I get this isnt the strongest of points, but again this isnt the only time weve seen Erza bs her way out of an impossible situation, such as in Tenrou islands she had NO REASON to survive all those blasts, she said so herself. Its just Mashimas writing, this feat should not be considered an outlier
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1. There is no proof of how much strength Dragon Irene put into her hit when she one shotted Erza and that attack could of easily been high 6-C (cause we don't know Dragon Irene's tier)just like her meteor was.(Irene could of killed Erza with anything else so why use a meteor? Because Hiro wanted to show how power of feelings can overcome anything and thus gave Erza a power up in a symbol of that huge magical aura around her)
2. Erza got a direct hit with no possibility react and protect herself in an armor without extra defence. Shown when her sword broke due to her not being able to cut through Dragon scales, while with the meteor the situation is completely different. Just like Irene said Erza can't cut through her scales.
3? For those that say her power-up was not implied, show me another scan of Erza having a huge magical aura around her like the one that she later used to destroy the meteor.
2. Erza got a direct hit with no possibility react and protect herself in an armor without extra defence. Shown when her sword broke due to her not being able to cut through Dragon scales, while with the meteor the situation is completely different. Just like Irene said Erza can't cut through her scales.
3? For those that say her power-up was not implied, show me another scan of Erza having a huge magical aura around her like the one that she later used to destroy the meteor.
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If this gets accepted, then island level for normal Spriggans is more justified.
I mean, we already have two calcs - for Invel and for Brandish that resulted in island level(For Invel it was in the range of 124 megatons - 3 gigatons)
I mean, we already have two calcs - for Invel and for Brandish that resulted in island level(For Invel it was in the range of 124 megatons - 3 gigatons)
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Does Island Level Spriggans affect anyone else? I feel like we'll have a domino effect of scaling as this goes along.
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I'm pretty sure they could scale off of others tbh. Just not sure which but many big shots would be.
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1.The calc for Brandish was revisited and is no longer accepted as island level and same goes for Invel from what i know.
2.There is vast possibility this only affects Erza.
3. It's still hard to tell whether this gets accepted and honestly if it would only scale to Erza and we can't have an agreement or a rather vast majority than things will just stay the way they are so we don't cause any further complications. Hardly worth it for a single character.
2.There is vast possibility this only affects Erza.
3. It's still hard to tell whether this gets accepted and honestly if it would only scale to Erza and we can't have an agreement or a rather vast majority than things will just stay the way they are so we don't cause any further complications. Hardly worth it for a single character.
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1. The other calc for Brandish isn't more accurate(not saying its less accurate). It's just using different panels which results in different outcomes. Both calcs are right, it's just that the city level+ feat was picked due to making more sense(at the time).
Invel's calc wasn't thrown out, it's just that the very low end was accepted, even though the calc itself didn't account all the area of the feat. The higher end is 3 gigatons.
2. I know that that's the only reason you are even arguing, but I do think it should scale to other characters. Not sure about the normal Spriggans, but it scales to human acno and most likely august at least.
3. Even though I agree that there's no guarantee this will be accepted, I think to "let things just stay the way they are so we don't cause any further complications" is just running away from the problem. This wiki's goal is to accurately portray a characters's strength, and ignoring something because of "complications" isn't viable.
Invel's calc wasn't thrown out, it's just that the very low end was accepted, even though the calc itself didn't account all the area of the feat. The higher end is 3 gigatons.
2. I know that that's the only reason you are even arguing, but I do think it should scale to other characters. Not sure about the normal Spriggans, but it scales to human acno and most likely august at least.
3. Even though I agree that there's no guarantee this will be accepted, I think to "let things just stay the way they are so we don't cause any further complications" is just running away from the problem. This wiki's goal is to accurately portray a characters's strength, and ignoring something because of "complications" isn't viable.
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2. Actually the fact it could scale only to Erza is why i said "we could just leave it...". That said it depends on how it's accepted(and if), if it's accepted as her only power up than no one scales. (That said the high 6-C scailing for Zeref is iffy, but that's for another day). Instead of discussing scailing we first need to have this accepted so let's drop that for now.
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Fair enough, I'll agree with you on that. It's best for this thread to be decided first.
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The "it doesn't make sense' thing isn't even argument here guys, like everyone here said it's fictional story where everything can happen just like how the author want the story to go down, surely it's bad writing and the power of feelings thing is cringy shitty excuses for all the bad writing he make but if he says it's legit power up in the verse we have no choice but to accept it, it's his own series after all and we are the ones playing with his rules
You have to accept the power of feelings in FT just like the power of rage in DB
You have to accept the power of feelings in FT just like the power of rage in DB
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Just my opinion here but if this feat is accepted i would make the following changes:
1) Erza. high 6-C with emotion boost, her current stats when she is unboosted.
2) Dragon Irene. High 6-C in all stats since the meteor gives her high 6-C ap and high 6-C dura as she tanked (the likely still boosted) Erza's follow up attack and it was never implyed that the meteor would kill her either.
Upgrading dragon irene messes up the scaling some what for August, Gildarts and base human Acno. Here i would have Human Irene, August and Gildarts at: At least high 7-A, possibly 6-C; Acno can keep his current rating since we know he's stronger than these 3.
Finally, no other characters are affected/can stay at their current ratings because they never fought boosted Erza or are stated weaker than Irene and co.
1) Erza. high 6-C with emotion boost, her current stats when she is unboosted.
2) Dragon Irene. High 6-C in all stats since the meteor gives her high 6-C ap and high 6-C dura as she tanked (the likely still boosted) Erza's follow up attack and it was never implyed that the meteor would kill her either.
Upgrading dragon irene messes up the scaling some what for August, Gildarts and base human Acno. Here i would have Human Irene, August and Gildarts at: At least high 7-A, possibly 6-C; Acno can keep his current rating since we know he's stronger than these 3.
Finally, no other characters are affected/can stay at their current ratings because they never fought boosted Erza or are stated weaker than Irene and co.
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I don't have any problem with the upgrade, it's cannon and is on the same power level as other attacks in the serie. It's far from being a outlier and pis, it's more on the bad writing side.
This is not something new, we have seen these kind of thing in other series and they were accepted. I don't understand why it's a problem, when it's about fairy tail.
Emotion, willpower and other kind of power boost has been a big part of shounen, fairy tail has a world in which these kind of things can boost someone magical power in a battle. After all once emotions is linked with their magic, like natsu when he is emotional his fire becomes hotter.
Fire Dragon Slayer Magic (þéÄÒü«µ╗àþ½£Ú¡öµ│ò Honō no Metsuryü Mahō)
"The heat of his fire can increase in temperature, which is proportional to Natsu's emotional state. Natsu subconsciously used this against Erigor; his flame's heat significantly rose as he got more enraged. This is also called the Flame of Emotio"
"The users flame are directly connected to their feelings, meaning the more emotional they get, the warmer their flame will become; this effect is referred to as "Flames of Emotio""
http://fairytail.wikia.com/wiki/Natsu_Dragneel
This is not something new, we have seen these kind of thing in other series and they were accepted. I don't understand why it's a problem, when it's about fairy tail.
Emotion, willpower and other kind of power boost has been a big part of shounen, fairy tail has a world in which these kind of things can boost someone magical power in a battle. After all once emotions is linked with their magic, like natsu when he is emotional his fire becomes hotter.
Fire Dragon Slayer Magic (þéÄÒü«µ╗àþ½£Ú¡öµ│ò Honō no Metsuryü Mahō)
"The heat of his fire can increase in temperature, which is proportional to Natsu's emotional state. Natsu subconsciously used this against Erigor; his flame's heat significantly rose as he got more enraged. This is also called the Flame of Emotio"
"The users flame are directly connected to their feelings, meaning the more emotional they get, the warmer their flame will become; this effect is referred to as "Flames of Emotio""
http://fairytail.wikia.com/wiki/Natsu_Dragneel
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