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We need a modern day guidebook this shit gets tedious lmfao
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Dragon Ball Super Discussion Thread 100
- Thread starter Warren_Valion
- Start date
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There's this statement in Daizenshuu 2 that says that Goku "Drew out the power of Super Saiyan to its limit". Make of that what you will.
The_Yellow_Topaz
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No he doesn't.
Grade 4 is constantly referred to "Natural state of the Super Saiyan without any stamina loss"
The_Yellow_Topaz
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Yeah, the power of the regular Super Saiyan form doesn't drop because of stamina anymore, the very panel used in below this is Goku saying "regular Super Saiyan is best for now"
There's this statement in Daizenshuu 2 that says that Goku "Drew out the power of Super Saiyan to its limit". Make of that what you will.
Killerdrone123
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Ah i don't want to jump in but grade 4 is stronger than grade 1 vegeta got molly woped by 18 in his grade 1 but later he beat the shit out in super his super vegeta or grade 2 form same goes for grade 4 when goku was atleast contending with cell when vegeta got his ass kicked in grade 2 I dont think it has to do anything with stamina
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If grade 4 remains simply about stamina issues, it would be better to just use grade 2 and end the fight immediately tbh, since anyone who can be matched with grade 4 would technically be a grade 1 level opponent with better stamina , which wouldn't mean anything if he just gets oneshotted in grade 2, grade 2 makes you both stronger and faster
I usually held the belief that grade 4 drew out the full limit of the super Saiyan form without drawbacks (a guide for the anime said this is believe, but I don't really remember), but the show introduced it as a stamina conservative form, so, I guess not, it's weird tho, it would be better to introduce grade 4 as having all the powers of 3 without any debuff since it has been mastered imo
I usually held the belief that grade 4 drew out the full limit of the super Saiyan form without drawbacks (a guide for the anime said this is believe, but I don't really remember), but the show introduced it as a stamina conservative form, so, I guess not, it's weird tho, it would be better to introduce grade 4 as having all the powers of 3 without any debuff since it has been mastered imo
Nullflowerblush
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And statements that Second and Third Grade draw the power of Super Saiyan beyond its limits.
There's this statement in Daizenshuu 2 that says that Goku "Drew out the power of Super Saiyan to its limit". Make of that what you will.
Nullflowerblush
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Third Grade and "mastered" are oxymoronic; the Power Stressed variants are explicitly an unnecessary physical power-up stack atop the original Super Saiyan form. For the form to be optimized, the excess fat needed to be removed.
The_Yellow_Topaz
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Goku's Base Form was stronger than Vegeta's, and Vegeta's Base Form was LEAGUES above his own Base Form when he fought 18.
In fact, even Trunks before he was Grade 2 was considered a threat to Cell. You ignore the fact their base power increases every time they train like crazy, it's not stationary.
MSSJ Goku > 2x > Grade 3 Post-HTC SSJ Trunks > 10x > Grade 2 Post-HTC SSJ Trunks = Grade 2 Post-HTC SSJ Vegeta > Semi-Perfect Cell => Grade 1 Post-HTC SSJ Vegeta => Grade 1 Post-HTC SSJ Trunks >>> Imperfect Cell (Humans Absorbed) = 16 > 17 = Kami-Piccolo => 18 => Grade 1 SSJ Vegeta > SSJ Goku => Future 17 > 2x > SSJ Future Gohan ~ SSJ Future Trunks > Mecha Frieza > SSJ Namek Goku > 1.25x > Final Form Frieza > 40x > Base Post-Zenkai Goku > Third Form Frieza > Nail-Piccolo = Second Form Frieza ~ Kaioken x10 Pre-Zenkai Goku > First Form Frieza > Kaioken x2 Pre-Zenkai Goku = Oozaru Vegeta > 2x > Base Pre-Zenkai Goku > 5x > Saiyan Saga Vegeta > Kaioken x2 Goku > 2x > Base Goku > Nappa > Piccolo > Gohan > Tien > Krillin > Yamcha > Saibamen > Chiaotzu > Raditz > 4yo Gohan (FP) > 3x > BoZ Goku (1/20th of Base Goku) > BoZ Piccolo > 23rd Budokai Goku ~ Piccolo Jr > 2x > King Piccolo Arc Goku = King Piccolo > 2x > 22nd Budokai Goku = 22nd Budokai Tien > Yamcha > 22nd Budokai Jackie Chun > Post-Korin Son Goku > 20x > BoS Kid Goku > x2 > Human
.... I think I went a bit overboard here. SO, MSSJ GOKU IS AT LEAST 1.280.000.000x STRONGER THAN A HUMAN's PL.... Oh wait, that's useless.
Killerdrone123
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"Nuh uh"
The_Yellow_Topaz
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Killerdrone123
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Never"Nuh u-"
SHUT IT!
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Uh.....
I never said anything about third grade being mastered, I said I wished 4th grade was introduced as having the full powers of 3rd grade without the debuff
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It's difficult to gauge a power level for that, but the weakest possible character is SSG Goku (pre-SSG Ritual absorption) as his base form right at the end of the fight is >2x his previous SSG self
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Is there any blog explaining the power levels?
The_Yellow_Topaz
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Given Goku's "sort of canonical" power level is 40 million by the time the Buu Arc starts, and thus his SSJ3 Power Level is 16 billion, it's probably somewhere above that value.
We have Golden Frieza's Power level, which is 500 Quintillion. Blue Goku's Power Level is around that, thus his God Form is 10 Quintillion.
Killerdrone123
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Some mad lads do scale mui goku power level to 14.5 septillion iirc
The_Yellow_Topaz
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That wouldn't be far fetched.
Killerdrone123
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New arc meteor mission is going on in manga
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I see thanks.
The_Yellow_Topaz
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But 40 million is low-key canon.
That is if you don't consider Base Goku > Kaioshin >>> Frieza, who is 120 million
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From where?
The_Yellow_Topaz
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Killerdrone123
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Base goku just having 40 million battle power is just wrong
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Should Cell have Black hole creation because of this?
The_Yellow_Topaz
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Why? It's likely even higher
Killerdrone123
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Yeah I meant that it should be way higher
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Zeref dragneel against Son goku
Zeref Dragneel vs. Standard War Assumptions Both at equal speed They are in the same region Zeref Dragneel; @Chardee.wl @chosen @Kazuma_kuwabara @Zeinx1 @Mertullah @CloverDragon03 @Robo432343 @Amon.vl @Rolgoat @Quantu @Köfteekmek @Shadowwwqwe @BaranDragneel @Gorkyss @Animus-sama...
I don't know if this topic has been posted here, but maybe there is someone among you who would like to discuss it.
Killerdrone123
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Nah the whole thing had become a mess
The_Yellow_Topaz
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^ But you said this.
Killerdrone123
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different people
The_Yellow_Topaz
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SORRY, I'M DYSLEXIC
Killerdrone123
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Dragon ball fan moment
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It's in our nature
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This was already discussed here, the original japanese version doesnt says that Cell Max created a Black hole
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What did it say
Has anyone translated the super hero novel
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