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His power was the lowest level for a Saiyan warrior
Raditz is just a lowball for saiyans in general since he is one of the weakest warriors
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Dragon Ball Super Discussion Thread 100
- Thread starter Warren_Valion
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Translations | Saikyō Jump (January 2018): We Asked Akira Toriyama-sensei! - Saiyan Special Q&A
English translation of Akira Toriyama's 'Saiyan Special Q&A' in the January 2018 issue of 'Saikyō Jump'
www.kanzenshuu.com
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He seems to be talking about Raditz being superior to infiltration babies, since they become combatants after dominating the planet while Raditz was a combatant outrightTranslations | Saikyō Jump (January 2018): We Asked Akira Toriyama-sensei! - Saiyan Special Q&A
English translation of Akira Toriyama's 'Saiyan Special Q&A' in the January 2018 issue of 'Saikyō Jump'
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What’s the context of the statement for that?
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While I don't mind canon Bardock not being strong as his Toei counterpart it still kinda hurts he went from being comparable to King Vegeta (Toei) to being just above Radtiz (Canon), though narratively after the DBS Broly movie it makes sense Bardock had to get the Minus nerf since there was no way King Vegeta would allow a low class Saiyan (or Saiyan that isn't a noble blood) to be any where near him in terms of power level.
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This in itself doesn’t make sense, given that when Bardock faces Gas in the Manga Gas comments that Bardock is ABOVE the Low-Class power range (before he even gets the Mid Fight Zenkai), and then Bardock recovers after that fight (logically getting another Zenkai). By all logic Bardock by the time he dies to Frieza should’ve at LEAST been Mid-Class.
Hell, Raditz being “Low-Class” didn’t make sense either when according to Toriyama he shares NAPPA’S rank. Further, he says Saiyans are capable of rank promotions via battle experience, but most of the logic in-verse (such as the beliefs of Vegeta, Nappa, and Raditz himself, just generally speaking), is that your birth rank determines everything. Like, the Saiyan Saga doesn’t make sense if promotions were a thing in Saiyan society.
(This is made especially egregious when you realize Bardock also regained his tail too, which makes Saiyan’s more powerful—Ala OG DB Kid Goku. So he also got a power boost from that as well.) Speaking of, I dunno how he got that back. Allegedly once you lose your tail after a certain level of power development, you don’t regain it because “body adaptations” and you “surpass the Oozaru” (this also doesn’t make sense, it’s a multiplier, but whatever).
Hell, Raditz being “Low-Class” didn’t make sense either when according to Toriyama he shares NAPPA’S rank. Further, he says Saiyans are capable of rank promotions via battle experience, but most of the logic in-verse (such as the beliefs of Vegeta, Nappa, and Raditz himself, just generally speaking), is that your birth rank determines everything. Like, the Saiyan Saga doesn’t make sense if promotions were a thing in Saiyan society.
(This is made especially egregious when you realize Bardock also regained his tail too, which makes Saiyan’s more powerful—Ala OG DB Kid Goku. So he also got a power boost from that as well.) Speaking of, I dunno how he got that back. Allegedly once you lose your tail after a certain level of power development, you don’t regain it because “body adaptations” and you “surpass the Oozaru” (this also doesn’t make sense, it’s a multiplier, but whatever).
Vietthai96
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I mean, Low-Class in Saiyan society isn't just about power, but probably also background. Vegeta default being Elite warrior the moment he was born if i'm not wrong
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Vegeta was one of the most powerful baby saiyans, so his elite-class Saiyan title ins't for nothing
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Yeah it's their birth power that's measured, Goku has a PL of 2 and was marked a low class warrior even after he surpassed all the saiyan ranks
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Toriyama's statement shouldn't be used because it predates all of the Granolah Saga scenes and Bardock's fight against Gas is just like a few days before Freeza blows up Vegeta. Take the two together and you get the interpretation that Bardock was the highest level Low-Class soldier up until he fought Gas, where he broke his limits. And I think that's also shown in resisting Freeza's Supernova with his power briefly (something not even Toei Bardock could do).
NishizumiShiho
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He's well above 10.000, I guess. He temporarily hold Frieza's Supernova, albeit not long, but impressive nonetheless.
Wouldn't this make Canon Bardock stronger than Toei Bardock?
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Toei has more absurd scaling so no. But if we're looking purely at them against the Supernova w/o scaling then:
Canon Bardock held up against Canon Freeza's Supernova way better than Toei Bardock did against Toei Freeza's Supernova.
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If you wanna say in terms of Battle Power (or inverse) yes Canon Bardock would be superior to Base Toei Bardock (At the very very worst he's under 500,000 as a SSJ, so he'd still be superior at full power even if Canon Bardock was an Oozaru)
But in terms of scaling them crossverse...Canon DBZ reaches Dwarf Star level+ by First Form Frieza while Toei reaches it before Raditz arrives, that should say enough
NishizumiShiho
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Hmmmm, I guess so.
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In short, Pilaf Gang Tier 0
NishizumiShiho
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NishizumiShiho
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Ummm, I recently look into both Porunga and Shenlong page and noticed Porunga only has Self-Sustenance Type 1 & 2, while Shenlong has all Types, why is that?
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Anyone to respond?
Chrono, what did you think of the soul manipulation of destruction energy thing?
Another thing I thought was that Aura can be used to crush enemies, and generally gods of destruction use the aura of destruction energy when they are serious (Toppo and that fight to test the arena). And kind of the guys who resist the energy aren't affected by the aura.
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They can destroy a 2c structure with it, meaning it's 4d at minimum, ofcourse it also erased Dr mashirito, who had 5d EE resistance, but it's currently 4d right now
Yea, but it would just be scaling, rather than layering, unless someone resisted a lesser version and was affected by a higher one.
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I mean, that is just my interpretation but everything regarding Saiyan Ranking is a mess
Toriyama's statement is about Minus, which is after the battle against Gas, but It could have been retconned. In Minus, Bardock already has his tail back so likely several months have passed since then
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I like the ideas, i have to search more about Power of Destruction in the animeAnyone to respond?
Chrono, what did you think of the soul manipulation of destruction energy thing?
Another thing I thought was that Aura can be used to crush enemies, and generally gods of destruction use the aura of destruction energy when they are serious (Toppo and that fight to test the arena). And kind of the guys who resist the energy aren't affected by the aura.
Hakai Crush
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He also already has his tail back in the In-DBS Manga Flashback. It also seems like he had at least one mission without his tail in between those, as well as covering Goku’s growth in his incubator. So it definitely was at least months. Likely a closer to a year when you consider it usually takes that long (if not longer) for Saiyan Tails to regrow (OG DB Kid Goku and Z Kid Gohan). This time table fits with Goku’s physical growth, (as he goes from incubation to a fully capable of walking child), and the fact Raditz had got assigned to Vegeta’s squad waaaay later (as he can be been with Gine here.)
Spinoirr
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Also I assume goku was born a while ago I the Granolah arc flash back and when planet Vegeta was destroyed goku was 3
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This is the DB thread
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It's certainly interesting
Mearex
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it'll be our turn when Daima drops
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We can't talk about other threads ?
Also I was gonna ask if it effects DB if it gets accepted , mostly Heros
Having a Hyperverse level Goku would be dope
ZetaMarishi
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Why would that do anything for Dragon Ball? It's its very own specific case that Dragon Ball doesn't really meet the requirements for
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Idk Heros Cosmology like that hence why I was gonna ask I just know they was in the same tier.
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3-2 isnt poor, iirc if its 3-3 then it becomes a possibly
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I don't think 3-3 isn't a possibly, he'd need like 2 more to agree to that possibly rating, a distance of 2 or 3 mods in his favour is needed to get it accepted iitc
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The MLP 5D thread had 3 Agrees on a Full on and 3 Disagrees, and it was settled on a possibly 5D
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Because those who disagreed eventual compromised or new mode cane and agreed for a possibly?
I am pretty sure a 3-3 can't just be passed off as a possibly without either those against it agreeing to the compromising or more mods coming in
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I'm not sure there's much more to the anime.
Maybe energy manipulation/energy projection, since the page is not linked to ki. And hakai, well it's a type of energy.
And maybe non-existent erasure if you try the thing where two gods of destruction fighting destroys their universe, and has that energy of destruction coming out of them passively in the fight, which could imply that the energy of destruction would destroy the universe.
Also has explosion manipulation.
I don't think there's much left after that.
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Hakai can affect the spacetime of a separate timeline, according to Beerus.
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Daishinkan
