• This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.

    For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here.
  • We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.

    Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.

    Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page.
  • Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.

Dragon Ball AP Ratings Upgrade

Status
Not open for further replies.
Yeah, Goku was never going all out in his fight with Frieza. Them being "Equals" was just a narrator statement about them looking equal. Goku literally states somewhere down the line that fighting is pointless because "He's too easy." He knows Frieza reached his limit while Goku basically stated the PL he used against Frieza was "Just a warm up" for him. Which it would be if 80% of his power was more than enough against Frieza's 100%. Plus he found Frieza too predictable among other things (Goku could sense energy in that fight but Frieza could not). So I think SSJ Goku being 1.25x stronger/faster is still consistent.
 
Last edited:
DarkDragonMedeus said:
Yeah, Goku was never going all out in his fight with Frieza. Them being "Equals" was just a narrator statement about them looking equal. Goku literally states somewhere down the line that fighting is pointless because "He's too easy." He know Frieza reached his limit while Goku basically stated the PL he used against Frieza was "Just a warm up" for him. Which it would be if 80% of his power was more than enough against Frieza's 100%. Plus he found Frieza too predictable among other things (Goku could sense energy in that fight but Frieza could not). So I think SSJ Goku being 1.25x stronger/faster is still consistent.
Click to expand...
Nullflowerblush said:
Goku and Frieza were never equals throughout their fight. Goku taunted Frieza after receiving a flurry of punches head-on, countered a sneak attack and flung Frieza with such force that he needed to use an energy blast to halt himself, and then proceeded to beat him silly.

The only worthwhile damage Frieza inflicted was with his Nova Strike, which visibly pushed his limits, is explicitly described as his 最大出力 ("maximum output"), and only worked because Goku was preoccupied maintaining his Kamehameha and was caught off-guard.

50% Frieza would scale to Kaio-ken x20 Goku's 8.15140859464 QT, and 16.3028172 QT at 100%, which is slightly below SSJ Goku's 20.3785214866 QT.
Click to expand...
Guess Frieza gets downscaled too
 
I'm gonna point out that Oozaru scaling to their power levels, but the base forms not scaling to 1/10th of the Oozaru's strength is stupid.

Because given Power level's nature of being an inconsistent mess, it implies the Oozaru form itself gives a different boost in power to the base user based on the base user's power level.

Vegeta's 18000 to 180000 is a near 400.000x boost (According to AP calcs) (89.16 Zettatons vs 203.8 Ronnatons)

But Raditz's 1500 to 15000 isn't nearly that much? (4.458 Zetta vs 59.44 Zetta), at only 13.3x?

Why? The form should give the same multiplier to every user.
 
Last edited:
The_Yellow_Topaz said:
I'm gonna point out that Oozaru scaling to their power levels, but the base forms not scaling to 1/10th of the Oozaru's strength is stupid.

Because given Power level's nature of being an inconsistent mess, it implies the Oozaru form itself gives a different boost in power to the base user based on the base user's power level.

Vegeta's 18000 to 180000 is a near 400.000x boost (According to AP calcs) (89.16 Zettatons vs 203.8 Ronnatons)

But Raditz's 1500 to 15000 isn't nearly that much? (4.458 Zetta vs 59.44 Zetta), at only 13.3x?

Why? The form should give the same multiplier to every user.
Click to expand...
Which would mean?
 
omegabronic said:
Since you are proposing that the "it's Super Saiyan on top of SSJG" thing to be not a thing in the manga, due to you also removing the movie as canon to the said manga, would the 10x multiplier apply to speed as well or just power?
Click to expand...
This is about the Oozaru. I didn't remove the movie as canon, my thread wasn't about that. Currently it's 50/50 whether or not the 50x multiplier applies, the thread is very divided.

In case of the Oozaru form, it objectively doesn't apply to speed, as explained by Paragus
 
The_Yellow_Topaz said:
This is about the Oozaru. I didn't remove the movie as canon, my thread wasn't about that. Currently it's 50/50 whether or not the 50x multiplier applies, the thread is very divided.

In case of the Oozaru form, it objectively doesn't apply to speed, as explained by Paragus
Click to expand...
i confused this thread with your's about SSJB, sorry
 
Hey, this exists by the way. I have no idea why this isn't being used as evidence for the Oozaru multiplier.
v1dVYZS.png


I also don't know why THIS isn't used for scaling btw
M61izv1.png


Both from Dragon Ball Forever. Hey so how about we don't have a fluntuated multiplier for the Oozaru form? We can clearly see the 10x would work as a low end.
 
Is there any compromise we can reach where Oozaru Vegeta does not recieve backscaling from the Namek Saga?
 
Damage3245 said:
Is there any compromise we can reach where Oozaru Vegeta does not recieve backscaling from the Namek Saga?
Click to expand...
I've also presented evidence that Saiyan Saga Goku receives backscaling from Namek Saga Goku, so this seems rather inevitable. We lack a reason to disallow the scaling, instead, we rely on skepticism, which is only valid to a certain extent.

It becomes impossible to accurately gauge how strong the Oozaru form is when we don't have a set-in-stone multiplier. I believe the evidence presented also proves Battle Power is linear within the 8,000 to 180,000 range.
Base Namek Saga Goku is 10 times stronger than Base Saiyan Saga Goku.
Vegeta is >2x stronger than Base Goku.
Oozaru Vegeta is equal to Kaioken x2 Namek Goku, which is 10x stronger than his previous Kaioken x2 from Saiyan Saga, whom Vegeta was slightly superior to.

This proves it's rather linear.
 
Nullflowerblush said:
Why exclusively that range?
Click to expand...
That's the range that matters for this thread and the range we can prove there is a linear increase without much problem.

Thanks to Kaioken and some other linear statements, we can deduce anywhere between 8000 BP all the way to 900000 BP is linear, if not more. Of course, then 3 million up to 150 million is also linear.

Feels weird to leave this 900,000 BP to 2,999,999 BP range as unknown, but I won't argue for something I can't effectively or relatively prove
 
Veronica said:
Shouldn't DB characters strength scale 1/3 to 1/2.5 from their max Ki attacks?
Click to expand...
Power levels aren't linear except when Kaio-Ken and Super Saiyan is involved

DB characters physicals are scaled to their casual Ki blasts, since they often can block or punch away Ki blasts easily. This includes beams who can be charged in a somewhat short time.

Frieza's planet Vegeta destruction feat (where most of the characters here scale to) is done extremely casually, with just one finger and while laughing on a floating chair. Frieza putting any actual effort when fighting would exceed that blast's power by a significant margin.
 
I think downscaling would be necessary if all the feats came from super charged special attacks, Freeza and piccolos ki attacks are extremely casual and have no reason to be scaled differently from their physical stats specially considering characters outright punch attacks stronger than those on the regular.

Only 4-B characters are the ones that downscale afaik because Cells Solar Kamehamaha is definitely not remotely anything as casual as Freezas death ball, and even then Goku as a SS3 can punch away a kamehameha from fat boo who is vastly superior to Cell meaning characters on that tier have physicals >SS2 Gohan> Cells Solar Kamehameha

If anything most characters should be upscaled higher ie: KHH should be at least 2x base HtH based on it actually requiring effort from Raditz to endure when Goku and Piccolo at the same time were completely outclassed

Following that logic

Kamicolo is 2x >Imperfect Cell for enduring a point blank KHH

Imperfect Cell should be 2x above Kamicolo for walking through his Light Grenade

Super Vegeta should be 2x above Semi Cell for enduring his Garlick Gun

Etc
 
Padaruyos said:
Power levels aren't linear except when Kaio-Ken and Super Saiyan is involved

DB characters physicals are scaled to their casual Ki blasts, since they often can block or punch away Ki blasts easily. This includes beams who can be charged in a somewhat short time.

Frieza's planet Vegeta destruction feat (where most of the characters here scale to) is done extremely casually, with just one finger and while laughing on a floating chair. Frieza putting any actual effort when fighting would exceed that blast's power by a significant margin.
Click to expand...

Can't apply a multiplier to that though.
 
I think there should be another thread regarding the Oozaru multipliers and downscaling the Frieza feat to Saiyan Saga characters
 
Ednaxel2 said:
I think there should be another thread regarding the Oozaru multipliers and downscaling the Frieza feat to Saiyan Saga characters
Click to expand...
The Oozaru multipliers are already accepted and on the profiles, as is backscaling from them, so I don’t see why that would need a new thread.
 
LordTracer said:
The Oozaru multipliers are already accepted and on the profiles, as is backscaling from them, so I don’t see why that would need a new thread.
Click to expand...
Cause some mods disagree with Saiyan Saga characters downscaling from Frieza, getting them to Large Planet level
 
Adem_Warlock69 said:
Ehh, seems kinda in the same boat as Saiyan Saga downscaling really
Click to expand...
Oh yeah you just forgot about the literally uncountable anti-feats and tier 8 feats from that Era that are quadrillions of joules apart from High 6-A, unlike Vegeta who has no real anti-feat other than a vague statement. This isn't even remotely comparable.
 
The_Yellow_Topaz said:
Oh yeah you just forgot about the literally uncountable anti-feats and tier 8 feats from that Era that are quadrillions of joules apart from High 6-A, unlike Vegeta who has no real anti-feat other than a vague statement. This isn't even remotely comparable.
Click to expand...
They're also anti-feats for Pilaf Goku's current rating, so don't think they're really that big of a problem, DB is full of anti-feats even up to the King Piccolo saga anyway
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

DBZ: AP Scaling Update - Namek to Buu arc Saga Scaling Chain
2 3
Replies
80
Views
8K
ArcaneAbyss
Ednaxel2
Dragon Ball: Minor Multiplier Fix
2
Replies
44
Views
3K
Ednaxel2
Ednaxel2
Tom4t0GG789
DRAGON BALL SPEED UPGRADE :O
2
Replies
66
Views
5K
Tom4t0GG789
Tom4t0GG789
Tom4t0GG789
GOTENKS IS WEAK O.o ---> AP Buu Saga Review
Replies
33
Views
2K
Tyri456
Tyri456
Ednaxel2
  • Locked
Dragon Ball AP, sad downgrade (Raditz/Saiyan/Namek Saga Tiers only)
4 5 6
Replies
229
Views
16K
LephyrTheRevanchist
LephyrTheRevanchist
Back
Top