Downgrade Gru's intelligence

[TheOrangeGuy09]

Also I should note that what is written for EG is merely just examples, the feats should just be higher than real world human maximum levels.

 

[Hixkaryana]

that is an assumption. Gru calls it a real rocket, it takes off, it flies off and even has a cabin inside that we can see. We may not know whether it reached orbit but we do know it is a full on rocket that functions and there's no evidence that it didn't reach orbit.

They work well enough and he made the flying machines by himself, we see at the end of the minions that he already had them.

Yet again, this is a major assumption. We know that he orders stuff to be made by Nefario but beyond the stuff Nefario guaranteed made, you have no evidence that Gru didn't make the rest of them, especially the flying machines which he clearly worked on even before Nefario, meaning that he is the one who most likely maintains them. Additionally when Nefario left in DM2 Gru didn't seem to be worried about it at all, not to mention he had no issues when he got cryofrozen in DM3, meaning that he most likely can manage his own inventions very well.

Seems like a you problem.

5 year old Gru calls his rocket a real rocket, damn that's a very and reliable way of telling me this is a NASA level rocket.

What flying machines are we talking about again?

And again with the "you don't know this, you don't know that" if I don't know then there's a reason I'm saying it can't be applied.

 

[Hixkaryana]

He does not have to exactly compare to their feats at all. The page says clearly his knowledge must be extensive across different fields of science, he qualifies for this.

Extensive doesn't represent his knowledge.

 

[Arkenis]

EG continues to be a misunderstand/undeveloped classification.

Everyone in EG doesn't need to create groundbreaking tech, or measure up to supercomputers. Just knowing a ton in several fields and being smart under pressure is enough.

 

[Hixkaryana]

EG continues to be a misunderstand/undeveloped classification.

Everyone in EG doesn't need to create groundbreaking tech, or measure up to supercomputers. Just knowing a ton in several fields and being smart under pressure is enough.

I'm sorry but I'm using official page definitions..and that's what's mainly done for every Intelligence CRT.

 

[Arceus0x]

5 year old Gru calls his rocket a real rocket, damn that's a very and reliable way of telling me this is a NASA level rocket.

Considering this 5 year old can build a rocket I'd trust his opinion lmfao

What flying machines are we talking about again?

His airship that is capable of space travel and anything that looks like it

And again with the "you don't know this, you don't know that" if I don't know then there's a reason I'm saying it can't be applied.

But then comes the issue that you're the one making claims and you need to prove that they have some credibility. Otherwise we have no evidence that Nefario makes all weapons.

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

I'm sorry but I'm using official page definitions..and that's what's mainly done for every Intelligence CRT.

Also I should note that what is written for EG is merely just examples, the feats should just be higher than real world human maximum levels.

 

[Hixkaryana]

Considering this 5 year old can build a rocket I'd trust his opinion lmfao

His airship that is capable of space travel and anything that looks like it

But then comes the issue that you're the one making claims and you need to prove that they have some credibility. Otherwise we have no evidence that Nefario makes all weapons.

I wouldn't..it was a hypothetical launch, he hasn't shown to be making any calculations so idek how he would be able to assess how far the rocket would go.

We've discussed that and it's not clear whether or not he was the own who came up with these kinds of upgrades, Dr. Nefario played a very big part.

You can just go on the DM wiki, the creator and user of every weapon is listed.

 

[Hixkaryana]

I saw your message thanks, that's why I said "I'm sorry blablabla" @TheOrangeGuy09

 

[Tomfer]

Ford Pines is smarted than Ayanokoji, Iron Man and Batman. Deal with it.

I cringed.

Those are probably outdated tbf. Iron Man and Batman have Tier 2/1 prep feats.

Batman is outdated, Iron Man is difficult because he's super smart (perhaps supergenius?) but updating him would directly upgrade a few people to be above him.

 

[Rayfire]

I wouldn't..it was a hypothetical launch, he hasn't shown to be making any calculations so idek how he would be able to assess how far the rocket would go.

Considering it went perfectly straight and seems a lot more powerful than your average model rocket, i'd think it would have went pretty dang high lol. Plus gru didn't have much to work with either, otherwise he would have made his mock astronaut helmet in that scene something more than a cardboard box

LMAO that wasn't Gru's invention it was Dr. Nefario's so yeah no.

Says who?

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

I saw your message thanks, that's why I said "I'm sorry blablabla" @TheOrangeGuy09

Dude, I used burecraut’s words on how EG works on this website.

 

[Arceus0x]

I wouldn't..it was a hypothetical launch, he hasn't shown to be making any calculations so idek how he would be able to assess how far the rocket would go.

lmao that seems like a you problem. To build something like that and have it launch and not blow up you need comperhensive knowledge of rocket science, mechanics, fuel, aerodynamics and more. He had to have learned all that for something like this andhe made it using scrap. If he can confidently say he made a real rocket then that means that he had to have learnt what would constitute a real rocket.

We've discussed that and it's not clear whether or not he was the own who came up with these kinds of upgrades, Dr. Nefario played a very big part.

And yet again there's no evidence it was all Dr. Nefario considering Gru is confident in managing everything by himself and has been working on those specific machines himself since childhood, which means he is more likely to be the one working on them

You can just go on the DM wiki, the creator and user of every weapon is listed.

First off, we never rely on wikis around these parts unless it is like a list of game equipment or sth.
Second, I did see it and all it says is what we see on the screen. Freeze ray? Fart gun? Sure, Nefario made them. But there's no evidence he had a hand in the flying machines, the grumobile, the plasma cannon or anything else.

 

[Hixkaryana]

Considering it went perfectly straight and seems a lot more powerful than your average model rocket, i'd think it would have went pretty dang high lol. Plus gru didn't have much to work with either, otherwise he would have made his mock astronaut helmet in that scene something more than a cardboard box

Says who?

A firework flies straight, and yet it doesn't reach outer space.
And there.

 

[Arceus0x]

Says who?

there's a moment in Minions when we see Gru eyeing Nefario's stand at villain con where he is promoting his freeze ray.

 

[Hixkaryana]

lmao that seems like a you problem. To build something like that and have it launch and not blow up you need comperhensive knowledge of rocket science, mechanics, fuel, aerodynamics and more. He had to have learned all that for something like this andhe made it using scrap. If he can confidently say he made a real rocket then that means that he had to have learnt what would constitute a real rocket.

And yet again there's no evidence it was all Dr. Nefario considering Gru is confident in managing everything by himself and has been working on those specific machines himself since childhood, which means he is more likely to be the one working on them

First off, we never rely on wikis around these parts unless it is like a list of game equipment or sth.
Second, I did see it and all it says is what we see on the screen. Freeze ray? Fart gun? Sure, Nefario made them. But there's no evidence he had a hand in the flying machines, the grumobile, the plasma cannon or anything else.

Again with the assumptions.

And again with the assumptions.

And yes, there's no evidence of either of them having a hand on a single one of these creations.

 

[Rayfire]

A firework flies straight, and yet it doesn't reach outer space.
And there.

Gru's rocket was way bigger than a firework

there's a moment in Minions when we see Gru eyeing Nefario's stand at villain con where he is promoting his freeze ray.

Ah, okay

Still though, Hasn't gru infiltrated high-security places with minimal equipment before? Pretty sure there's something like that in despicable me 4 judging from what others are saying. Thats under extraordinary genius criteria

 

[Hixkaryana]

Gru's rocket was way bigger than a firework

Ah, okay

Still though, Hasn't gru infiltrated high-security places with minimal equipment before? Pretty sure there's something like that in despicable me 4 judging from what others are saying. Thats under extraordinary genius criteria

I was just saying that the fact it was going straight doesn't indicate that it wouldn't fall down at one point. Who knows if he put enough fuel? Who knows if the components didn't fly off during the flight? These are all factors we don't know and as such we can't rely on, we should stick to the feats we are sure of.

And yes, I agreed with that criteria.

 

[Arceus0x]

Again with the assumptions.

Assumptions? LMFAO ok bro go build a 15 foot tall metal rocket with a cabin with functioning engines that can propel it perfectly straight and is activated via remote control. Let's see if it works and if you can compare it to a firework after that.

And again with the assumptions.

You're the one making more and more assumptions. I am making deductions from what we've seen.

And yes, there's no evidence of either of them having a hand on a single one of these creations.

Gru made the prototype for his airship all the way back in the minions. It is more than enough evidence that he was the one working on the vehicles.

 

[Arceus0x]

Anyways,

-

Any final thoughts here?
The thread is basically universally disagreed with by everyone, if you think the recent arguments make the CRT sensible I'd like to hear you. If not, then there's no point in continuing.

 

[Arkenis]

Extensive doesn't represent his knowledge.

It kinda does. The guy's a worldwide known villain who participates in several big events in the history of villains. Being a villain in the movie requires complex understanding of crimes, what works best in doing their "villainy" and also fighting against other villains. This is like telling a seasoned boxer his knowledge isn't extensive when he's been boxing for three decades AND has done crazy stuff. Then we get into his history when he was in Lycee Pas Bon School, I could be mistaken but he was famous in the school for stealing the principals dog something which we see was even more complex in DM4 when he had several things to worry about and had little tools to work with.

I am unaware of his technologic creations, but considering the minions help in creating stuff, I'd assume Gru informs them on how to do stuff, which again is an intelligence feat on its own since the minions don't speak english, are incredibly clumsy and hard to manage as workers.

 

[Hixkaryana]

Assumptions? LMFAO ok bro go build a 15 foot tall metal rocket with a cabin with functioning engines that can propel it perfectly straight and is activated via remote control. Let's see if it works and if you can compare it to a firework after that.

You're the one making more and more assumptions. I am making deductions from what we've seen.

Gru made the prototype for his airship all the way back in the minions. It is more than enough evidence that he was the one working on the vehicles.

I've literally been FIGHTING these assumptions, and deductions aren't any better than assumptions, you're basically creating a false reality of what you wish happened.
Yes he made the prototype, the design, all the assets, but you need a manufacturer to create it, and again we're not sure if it was him or Dr. Iforgothisname.

 

[Qawsedf234]

Anyways,

Any final thoughts here?
The thread is basically universally disagreed with by everyone, if you think the recent arguments make the CRT sensible I'd like to hear you. If not, then there's no point in continuing.

Its just a 0-1 vote afaik. If the OP wants to keep it open, then it's not rejected until a second mod weighs in.

 

[Arceus0x]

I've literally been FIGHTING these assumptions, and deductions aren't any better than assumptions, you're basically creating a false reality of what you wish happened.
Yes he made the prototype, the design, all the assets, but you need a manufacturer to create it, and again we're not sure if it was him or Dr. Iforgothisname.

we're not sure but it was one of them and since we never see Nefario work on a single vehicle throughout the series while Gru has been shown to create vehicles, it means that he is the one most likely responsible for the airship that can fly to mars.
Additionally we do know he has made weapons of his own, ones that don't exist in our world, meaning at least some of the futuristic weapons we see would be statistically his creation.

 

[Hixkaryana]

It kinda does. The guy's a worldwide known villain who participates in several big events in the history of villains. Being a villain in the movie requires complex understanding of crimes, what works best in doing their "villainy" and also fighting against other villains. This is like telling a seasoned boxer his knowledge isn't extensive when he's been boxing for three decades AND has done crazy stuff. Then we get into his history when he was in Lycee Pas Bon School, I could be mistaken but he was famous in the school for stealing the principals dog something which we see was even more complex in DM4 when he had several things to worry about and had little tools to work with.

I am unaware of his technologic creations, but considering the minions help in creating stuff, I'd assume Gru informs them on how to do stuff, which again is an intelligence feat on its own since the minions don't speak english, are incredibly clumsy and hard to manage as workers.

Oh, I get it, being a top villain sounds impressive, but it doesn’t mean Gru's a scientific genius. Managing clumsy Minions isn’t exactly high-level tech innovation, and his past antics are more about sneaky tricks than deep scientific knowledge. So, impressive villain? Sure. Extraordinary genius? Not quite.

 

[Arceus0x]

Its just a 0-1 vote afaik. If the OP wants to keep it open, then it's not rejected until a second mod weighs in.

could you ping some knowledgeable people then?

 

[Rayfire]

Assumptions? LMFAO ok bro go build a 15 foot tall metal rocket with a cabin with functioning engines that can propel it perfectly straight and is activated via remote control. Let's see if it works and if you can compare it to a firework after that.

^^^^^^^^^^

I was just saying that the fact it was going straight doesn't indicate that it wouldn't fall down at one point. Who knows if he put enough fuel? Who knows if the components didn't fly off during the flight? These are all factors we don't know and as such we can't rely on, we should stick to the feats we are sure of.

And yes, I agreed with that criteria.

If it's to impress his mother and he can already make that rocket out of almost nothing without it immediately exploding i doubt that would happen. Plus, YOU'RE the one making "assumptions" by saying that it could have failed even though there's no evidence of it not failing either. That likely wasn't the intent of the scene to begin with.

So gru is EG then if he fits that requirement

 

[Hixkaryana]

Its just a 0-1 vote afaik. If the OP wants to keep it open, then it's not rejected until a second mod weighs in.

I made this CRT because it quite literally shocked me that he was en EG, but apparently people are hellbent over the fact that he is, so if people wanna keep it that way sure, just update his proofs.

 

[Hixkaryana]

^^^^^^^^^^

If it's to impress his mother and he can already make that rocket out of almost nothing without it immediately exploding i doubt that would happen. Plus, YOU'RE the one making "assumptions" by saying that it could have failed even though there's no evidence of it not failing either. That likely wasn't the intent of the scene to begin with.

So gru is EG then if he fits that requirement

1 single requirement isn't enough I'm pretty sure.
This is a game of who's gonna make the best assumption, and it's never gonna end so..

 

[Rayfire]

1 single requirement isn't enough I'm pretty sure.
This is a game of who's gonna make the best assumption, and it's never gonna end so..

Even if it wasn't, you're blatantly ignoring things like the rocket feat to back that up as well. I doubt any irl person has done anything like that at the age of 5, and the cognitive difference between a 5 year old and 9 year old is pretty vast.You grow very quickly in a lot of area's when you're that old, and intelligence is no exception.

 

[Hixkaryana]

Even if it wasn't, you're blatantly ignoring things like the rocket feat to back that up as well. I doubt any irl person has done anything like that at the age of 5, and the cognitive difference between a 5 year old and 9 year old is pretty vast.You grow very quickly in a lot of area's when you're that old, and intelligence is no exception.

I would put that feat in the high-end Genius area, not EG. I just don't see how it would fit into EG anyways.

 

[Arceus0x]

Anyways I won't continue entertaining this thread. I've stated my piece already. I have no reason to continue arguing with "its all assumptions" "no its not assumptions".

I would like to add that around the same time he made the model rocket he also made this flying machine, meaning that he very much knew what he was doing.

I am going to sleep. Good night.

 

[Rayfire]

I would put that feat in the high-end Genius area, not EG. I just don't see how it would fit into EG anyways.

Does this look like something a prodigy 9 year old irl could make?

 

[Arkenis]

Oh, I get it, being a top villain sounds impressive, but it doesn’t mean Gru's a scientific genius. Managing clumsy Minions isn’t exactly high-level tech innovation, and his past antics are more about sneaky tricks than deep scientific knowledge. So, impressive villain? Sure. Extraordinary genius? Not quite.

Again, again, again, again, again! Being a scientific genius isn't what's needed for EG. Being several things qualifies for EG, especially when he's one of the top scientist and villains in his verse.

 

[Hixkaryana]

Anyways I won't continue entertaining this thread. I've stated my piece already. I have no reason to continue arguing with "its all assumptions" "no its not assumptions".

I would like to add that around the same time he made the model rocket he also made this flying machine, meaning that he very much knew what he was doing.

I am going to sleep. Good night.

Oh so that's what you were talking about! He hasn't been shown to actually make it but good night! Sleep well.

 

[Hixkaryana]

Again, again, again, again, again! Being a scientific genius isn't what's needed for EG. Being several things qualifies for EG, especially when he's one of the top scientist and villains in his verse.

His verse is relatively weak in terms of villains, let's not lie now...

 

[Rayfire]

Oh so that's what you were talking about! He hasn't been shown to actually make it but good night! Sleep well.

The only other person gru had in his life at the time was his mom and she was very uninterested in anything he did. I doubt he made it with someones help.

 

[Hixkaryana]

The only other person gru had in his life at the time was his mom and she was very uninterested in anything he did. I doubt he made it with someones help.

That's right, but I'm gonna use the A-word.
This was fun, but I've gotta sleep too, I hope that when I wake up this thread will be done

 

[Rayfire]

That's right, but I'm gonna use the A-word.
This was fun, but I've gotta sleep too, I hope that when I wake up this thread will be done

Does this look like something a prodigy 9 year old irl could make all on their own?

Sleep well, but you didn't answer the question A 5 year old making something like the machine in the clip by themselves and with most likely only the resources of whatever's in his house is definitely unheard of in the real world, and this is what entails extraordinary genius. No dr nefario or anything to help him out.

I stand by my position of disagreeing with the CRT.

 

[Arkenis]

His verse is relatively weak in terms of villains, let's not lie now...

You're lying... But that's fine. goodnight