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Doom Eternal Revision Thread Part 4

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The barges would bring it into 8-A yes.
The titans moving at Supersonic speed is completely wrong, that's just simply not the case, if they were Supersonic they'd be travelling their own height, probably more in around a second. Which clearly isn't the case.
Almost certain they'd get into Subsonic through their size though, but it'd have to be fully calculated. I still don't agree with KE scaling anyway tho so...
 
KieranH10 said:
The barges would bring it into 8-A yes.
The titans moving at Supersonic speed is completely wrong, that's just simply not the case, if they were Supersonic they'd be travelling their own height, probably more in around a second. Which clearly isn't the case.
Almost certain they'd get into Subsonic through their size though, but it'd have to be fully calculated. I still don't agree with KE scaling anyway tho so...
Click to expand...
ok so the titans are 8-A since they can support their own weight + that of the hell barges which would at at least 2-3 million more tons
 
I haven't played the DLC and haven't even looked at it yet to avoid any major spoilers. If what you say is true though, and it is around 3x larger than the Icon, then it's safe to assume it's the same size as the other Titans, and should logically scale.
 
Hellbeast said:
He's big buy we never see anyone scale to him
Click to expand...
According to Doom Devs, Maligog is a Titan God and was chosen to guard the Father and the Dark Lords life sphere. Considering that, He would be superior to most titans we've seen or at least any titans at the Dark Lords disposal. In sense of size, Maligog is tall enough to actually reach above cloud level.
 
Hellbeast said:
No it shouldn't because literally nothing implies they're supersonic (List a feat that isn't just vaguely "was killed by Slayer" and even then that's sort of against our rules

We encounter many Titans in the game and lore so I don't see why you're arguing in favour of this
Click to expand...
I don’t see why we shouldn’t scale, not seeing them move at those speeds isn’t a reason because that’s not a feasible thing to do animation wise, we never actually see that happen. We just scale the speed of the real life objects we see in game like rockets, meteors and lightning. We have all the other demons who were stomped by doomguy scale to his speed why should this be any different?
 
We still have the argent tower explosion and the absorption that was stated to make him stronger.
 
DTG499 said:
I don’t see why we shouldn’t scale, not seeing them move at those speeds isn’t a reason because that’s not a feasible thing to do animation wise, we never actually see that happen. We just scale the speed of the real life objects we see in game like rockets, meteors and lightning. We have all the other demons who were stomped by doomguy scale to his speed why should this be any different?
Click to expand...
They shouldn't because there's no reason to scale them as they don't have any evidence or statements that they're as fast
STOP THE WANK
Lumbering Titans aren't comparable to the reanimated Knight Sentinels or stuff that we have scientific or canonical velocities for (Including lightning) and imo the lesser demons have no reason to scale to Slayer

The Argent Tower is also meaningless for reasons we've already provided so I'd appreciate if you stop going with that same argument

The absorption also proves he was growing stronger but not to the point where he becomes dozens of times more powerful each kill so, once again, this means nothing and you're just repeating tired arguments

Also while I'm here. Slayer should not have a Sentinel key. Not only is it a period of time in the lore that gets no coverage with the exception of some guide entries and cutscenes, Doomguy has an incredibly small pool of actual feats from the old games
 
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Because as we explained

Slayer absorbs Argent and is empowered by it

We have no idea how big the explosion was, it could be 8-C to 7-C and that's ignoring the caveats of inverse square law or surface area (both of which significantly impact the final rating)
This ignores the fact Heat is getting revised so he may not even scale to the whole explosion regardless

Also didn't the explosion send him to Hell, thus implying he didn't tank it at all?
 
He didn't absorb the Argent Energy of the explosion into his system. The explosion causes the portal. You would need to tank the explosion before you could pass through the portal. That's why no other demons or objects passed through the portal with Doom Slayer to Hell.
 
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But he absorbs Argent Energy and is hit by a blast of Argent Energy

Also you've kind of ignored the other points regarding how close to the explosion he was or how heat kind of lessens the feat's impressiveness, meaning he may not be 8-A - 7-C based upon the feat

And yet again, we have no idea how large the explosion actually is so the feat is basically worthless

It also helps the other two 8-A feats that apply to 2016 are:
1) The Titan which may or may not be his physical stats
2) The Megakelvin laser the Suit withstands which will itself be worse after the Heat Revisions and could be explained by a high resistance to heat based
damage

Even the Ion Cannon is dodgy because while it has an 8-A feat, that is with it's optimal ammunition and the improvised blast Slayer survives was, by your own calculation, 9-A so it's doubtful whether or not he scales to the weapon fully
 
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What indication do we have that supports he absorbed the explosion like that? It's a physical explosion.

The Slayer is in the same room as the explosion, able to stand next to the epicenter. What heat?

We do know the amount. An Argent Accumulator was used as the source.
 
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The fact the explosion was produced by an Argent Energy power source and we have several sources for Slayer growing stronger based upon absorbing Argent Energy

Except 1) even a difference of several inches or feet can have a huge impact as shown with this calc Spino did and 2) If you account for surface area the amount drops even further as seen in this calc

The Heat he is sustaining from the explosion which Dragon claims won;t mean he scales to the full force behind the explosion

And there's a reason to assume Slayer was not only hit by the full force of the explosion but that every iota of Argent Energy found itself embedded within that explosion?

And this ignores the idea of Slayer being able to draw upon their power as stated by Samuel himself in the very scene you linked which thus means it's not entirely applicable to Slayer as a durability feat.

Speaking of you're assuming he was hit by the full 2.4 Terawatts that empowers Vega despite the fact there's no concrete reason or evidence to assume this in that very same blog you did the Argent Accumulator calc

And since Slayer's Tier 8 stuff either

  1. Doesn't entirely scale thanks to hax
  2. Is from a canonically strongest weapon which is shown splattering demons Slayer fights with no evidence for the contrary scaling
  3. Straight up doesn't work with heat based revisions staff are championing
 
If Doom Slayer's absorption worked like that, he would basically be immune to Demonic/Argent energy attacks in general.

I didn't say anything about the calc not needing to use inverse square law. Yes, both calcs need some revising. I'm just saying that the explosions, in general, can be used as a feat.
 
I'm not saying in general

I'm saying it's queationable how applicable it is given his suit's resistance to heat and his own empowerment from Argent, which your calc implies is relevant given your scaling the explosion we never see to the Argent Tower's capacity to power

Not really for the above reasons

You're assuming the explosion is = the Argent Tower's power capacity for no good reason and in the latter completely making up the idea all of the 2.4 Terawatts Vega is powered by went into that electrical calc

It's not just that the calc needs revisions; it's that the assumptions therein are completely arbitrary with no regard to how the actual feat (Explosion) is presented in the game

If there is a good scan that shows the explosion in full and how much hit Slayer then use that
 
It's directly stated how much energy the Argent Accumulator that exploded contains.

"What used to take a nuclear reactor 12 months to produce can be generated in a few seconds by the Argent Tower and packaged into an Argent Accumulator no larger than Samuel Hayden's hand."
 
And I'm not disputing that

I'm saying why are you assuming every ounce of that was transferred to the explosion at all since I can find no such statement of that being a thing?

Or why the Tier 7 feat is more consistent since the other one barely exists and th Tier 8 stuff may not be genuine
 
How would they even incorporate the accumulator's energy distribution during an explosion into the game? At the very least, the energy distribution would be comparable to a nuke with 50% going to the air burst and 35% going to heat.

I'm not talking about the final tiering. I'm just talking about the feat calculation.
 
I'm not asking for an incorporation

I'm asking for evidence of this occuring at all considering Argent Energy is an entirely fictionlised plasma borne from Human Souls

As am I mostly
 
also can we just drop the argent tower calc even if it was not made up of argent energy and worked like a new(unlikely looking at the fact that the tower didn't collapse completly after the explosion went off) the slayer would only get hit by 8-C to maybe if you push it high 8-C levels of energy due to serfece area and distance and most people here agree that slayer scales to titans who are 8-A randering the arget tower explosion moot
 
@Sir_sun_man

If we have the Slayer being 10 meters away from the epicenter and 50% energy used for the air burst, the result would be Low 7-C.
 
Hellbeast said:
They shouldn't because there's no reason to scale them as they don't have any evidence or statements that they're as fast
STOP THE WANK
Lumbering Titans aren't comparable to the reanimated Knight Sentinels or stuff that we have scientific or canonical velocities for (Including lightning) and imo the lesser demons have no reason to scale to Slayer

The Argent Tower is also meaningless for reasons we've already provided so I'd appreciate if you stop going with that same argument

The absorption also proves he was growing stronger but not to the point where he becomes dozens of times more powerful each kill so, once again, this means nothing and you're just repeating tired arguments

Also while I'm here. Slayer should not have a Sentinel key. Not only is it a period of time in the lore that gets no coverage with the exception of some guide entries and cutscenes, Doomguy has an incredibly small pool of actual feats from the old games
Click to expand...
The evidence for the titans moving at that speed is the fact that the a titan was able to kill an entire brigade of night sentinels when the demons invaded argent d nur, who for A FACT scale to doomguy’s speed. If a titan was only able to move at the speed as we see them in game how would they possibly be able to hit a single supersonic night sentinel? And again, the champ titan fought doomguy. So the titans are supersonic, you are prioritizing down play over the facts of the story and you reasoning is founded upon your own idea of how things could have gone in the story instead of what is actually laid out for us.

I am also still lost on the reasoning as to why absorbing 7-C energy doesn’t make you a 7-C.
 
The titans very clearly don't move as Supersonic speeds. They could fight the Night Sentinels either due to their enormous size, completely removing the ability to avoid their attacks. Sure, the Sentinels could react to a Supersonic projectile or punch by moving to the side, but try to avoid an over 100 metre long arm getting swung at you at Subsonic speeds. Yes, the Champion Titan did fight Doomguy, but it lost, and we never saw the fight, so assuming a speed based on that is pointless.

Because Absorption is an ability, not a durability feat.
 
DTG499 said:
The evidence for the titans moving at that speed is the fact that the a titan was able to kill an entire brigade of night sentinels when the demons invaded argent d nur, who for A FACT scale to doomguy’s speed. If a titan was only able to move at the speed as we see them in game how would they possibly be able to hit a single supersonic night sentinel? And again, the champ titan fought doomguy. So the titans are supersonic, you are prioritizing down play over the facts of the story and you reasoning is founded upon your own idea of how things could have gone in the story instead of what is actually laid out for us.

I am also still lost on the reasoning as to why absorbing 7-C energy doesn’t make you a 7-C.
Click to expand...
1) you realise that we have no idea how he killed those Sentinels or how the fight with Slayer right?

I’m prioritising reason over just saying that not only are the Titans Supersonic, we should totally base their tiering off KE

It’s wank, plain and simple and I’m ******* ashamed of the actual staff in this thread not pointing that it out to you

2) because drawing upon a power source doesn’t mean you’re comparable
To said power source
It’s basic stuff on the wiki and I have no idea why you’re pushing so hard for this

Get a new argument and we’ll talk

@Forestorm ngl I doubt that.
 
KieranH10 said:
The titans very clearly don't move as Supersonic speeds. They could fight the Night Sentinels either due to their enormous size, completely removing the ability to avoid their attacks. Sure, the Sentinels could react to a Supersonic projectile or punch by moving to the side, but try to avoid an over 100 metre long arm getting swung at you at Subsonic speeds. Yes, the Champion Titan did fight Doomguy, but it lost, and we never saw the fight, so assuming a speed based on that is pointless.

Because Absorption is an ability, not a durability feat.
Click to expand...
Doomguy has supersonic movement speed the night sentinels scale to his movement speed. Doomguy’s reactions are massively hypersonic do to scaling to the lighting from the khan makyr and the meteors from the icon of sin.


I’m not saying it’s a durability feat I’m saying since he gets stronger from absorbing a 7-C argent cell why wouldn’t his tier be the same as the energy he is using to boost his power?
 
Hellbeast said:
1) you realise that we have no idea how he killed those Sentinels or how the fight with Slayer right?
2) because drawing upon a power source doesn’t mean you’re comparable
To said power source
Click to expand...
1) yeah the titan killed them by hitting them, which he would need to have the same level of speed in order to do so.
2) explain why.
 
Firestorm808 said:
@Sir_sun_man

If we have the Slayer being 10 meters away from the epicenter and 50% energy used for the air burst, the result would be Low 7-C.
Click to expand...
he was more then 10 meters away when the explosion whent of and doom slayer isn't big enough to get the full low 7-C as most of that energy would be realased around the blast and his surfice area is small and would only get hit by a small amount of that energy
 
Sir_sun_man said:
he was more then 10 meters away when the explosion whent of and doom slayer isn't big enough to get the full low 7-C as most of that energy would be realased around the blast and his surfice area is small and would only get hit by a small amount of that energy
Click to expand...
Previous calculations put the effective durability needed to survive a 7-B nuke or an explosion similar to be High 7-C, when very close or point blank to the initial blast. So low 7-C from being ten meters away sounds about right. And he’s the calculation guy of this thread so I would take his word for it.
 
You can stand close to the epicenter when the explosion goes off.

 
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DTG499 said:
Doomguy has supersonic movement speed the night sentinels scale to his movement speed. Doomguy’s reactions are massively hypersonic do to scaling to the lighting from the khan makyr and the meteors from the icon of sin.


I’m not saying it’s a durability feat I’m saying since he gets stronger from absorbing a 7-C argent cell why wouldn’t his tier be the same as the energy he is using to boost his power?
Click to expand...
Ignoring the fact he doesn’t even dodge the Khan Makyr’s sttacks in cutscenes

Even when Supersonic it’s entirely possible to be smacked by a gigantic arm moving slower (especially if it’s by surprise). The Titans night have that in reactions but no indication they’re supersonic and just never do anything but walk
 
ok I’m just asking why the level of power increase wouldn’t be equal to the energy he is absorbing. There must be a good reason. It isn’t unquantifiable either we know the argent cell is 7-C. Why is the default assumption that he is only using a little bit of the energy or not at all?

A surprise attack from a 5000 foot tall titan.......OK BUD. These are battle hardened warriors that fought the hordes of demons with doomguy a surprise attack is not possible at all. Look if the titans are moving a slow as you say they are the sentinels would literally have enough time to go make some coffee, drink it and piss it out before the titan lands his punch on them.
 
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360-380 feet (that titan was no meligog)
plus hell can teleport beings in and out of dimensions so it might have teleproted in and pulvorized a good portion of the city killing dozens of night sentinals or it might have been a titan in the lines of champion titan or icon that could use magic and summon faster then sound fire balls or summon meteors out of obit like the icon
also we don't actually know how the absorption works in doom we know it makes doomslayer stronger but by how much? Say in prototype for example another verse that uses absorption and it is said that everything you absorb makes you stronger and we still don't use absorption in such a way were it stack onto the charaters power directly(or the verse would be at least high 8C instead of 8C) there it is an unidentified amount strength gained through absorption much like in doom
 
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