Demon Slayer Speed Overhaul

[Epyriel]

Introduction​

As it stands, the speed ratings for Demon Slayer are a bit of a mess. About half the ratings reference removed calcs (Tanjiro Dodges Point Blank Demon Attack and Zenitsu Blitzes Lightning) and the other half are based on a heavily criticized calc (Muichiro Cuts Ten Thousand Fish).

In light of this, I wish to propose a batch of revisions to swap out them out with five other accepted calcs (Mitsuri Dodges Lightning, Tengen Cuts Bombs, Tanjiro Dodges Lightning, Tanjiro’s Flowing Dance, and Tanjiro Dodges Swamp Demon). I will also use the chance to brush up some of the justifications on the existing profiles, the full list of such proposed revisions can be found here.

As it stands, much of the verse stands at Massively Hypersonic derived from Muichiro cutting ten thousand fish in SSV, however this calc has been heavily contested thanks to how many assumptions you need to weigh based on how many cuts he is actually making which depends on assumptions about his reach, the angle of his sweeps, and how fast the fish are moving. To but it simply, it is a little messy.

However, in line with Hantengu’s lightning being accepted as real lightning, we now have a good number of replacements (and even some upgrades) to substitute in its place to maintain the verse’s status as a lightning timer (which does fit nicely with how incredibly frequently its characters are described as fast as lightning, which is now backed up by more substantive calculations).

Demon Slayer Speed Scaling Context​

First, it should be noted is that there is a significant gulf between the travel speed, base combat speed, and breathing technique combat speed of demon slayers. For example, Tanjiro initially struggles against the speed of the temaris when fighting Susamaru, yet then later in the same sequence utterly blitzes them as if they are completely still when using Water Breathing: Flowing Dance. Meanwhile in travel speed even the Hashira are compared merely to the wind, while Tengen is ranked higher than Gyomei despite being relative in combat speed only to UM6 whereas Gyomei could keep up with UM1.

Thus is should be recognized that:
Demon Slayers’ Breathing Technique Speed >> Demons Slayers’ Base Combat Speed >> Demon Slayers’ Travel Speed

So characters who would scale to a given demon slayer’s base combat speed, would in no way necessitate scaling to their maximum speed while in the apex of their breathing technique (as in the Hand Demon, Spider Demon Brother, Susamaru and Kyogai all being relative to base UR demon slayers and then getting blitzed by the same people with a breathing technique). It should be noted that this difference is especially drastic during the Unwavering Resolve Arc where the main characters have not unlocked Total Concentration Breathing: Constant.

Proposed Changes:​

Scaling From Base UR Tanjiro (Mach 0.85):​

Currently all of the UR Demons are scaled from a removed clac. In its place, those that only scale to UR Tanjiro’s base speed and cannot keep up with his technique speed (and thus do not qualify to scale off of the flowing dance calc), must all be downgraded to the next best calc based off of his base speed.

Epyriel/Sandbox

vsbattles.fandom.com

• Hand Demon: Subsonic+ [Note: Current rating is based on a removed calc] speed]
• Swamp Demon: Subsonic+ [Note: Current rating is based on a removed calc]
• Susamaru: Subsonic+ [Note: Current rating is based on a removed calc]
• Yahaba: Subsonic+ [Note: Current rating is based on a removed calc]
• Spider Demon Mother: Subsonic+ [Note: Current rating is based on a removed calc]
• Spider Demon Brother: Subsonic+ [Note: Current rating is based on a removed calc]
• Spider Demon Sister: Subsonic+ [Note: Current rating is based on a removed calc]
• Spider Demon Father: Subsonic+ [Note: Current rating is based on a removed calc]
• Kyogai: Subsonic+ with Transonic Attack Speed [Note: Current rating is based on a removed calc]

(0:14) Agree: HelloThere1089, Xaropadob3ta, Ped2018, JnSteHar002, Machmatej, KnyRaizn, Passersby, Digital_Franz, Viott, CloverDragon03, FelpeXDopZ, Assassin, Laitnetop, Kavopaco
(0:0) Disagree:
(0:0) Neutral:

Scaling From UR Tanjiro (Mach 320):​

Epyriel/Sandbox

vsbattles.fandom.com

• Inosuke (Post-Demon Slayer Training): Massively Hypersonic [Note: Current rating based on removed calc]
• Tanjiro (Post-Demon Slayer Training): Massively Hypersonic [Note: Current rating based on removed calc]
• Zenitsu (Post-Demon Slayer Training): Massively Hypersonic [Note: Current rating based on removed calc]
• Rui: Massively Hypersonic [Note: Current rating based on removed calc]
• Nezuko (Base): Massively Hypersonic [Note: Current rating based on removed calc]
• Kyojuro (Gaiden): At least Massively Hypersonic, likely higher [Note: Current rating based on removed calc]
• Enmu: At least Massively Hypersonic, likely higher [Note: Current rating based on removed calc]
• Daki: At least Massively Hypersonic, likely higher [Note: Current rating based on removed calc]
• Inosuke (Post-Rehabilitation Training): At least Massively Hypersonic, likely higher [Note: Current rating based on removed calc]
• Nezuko (Demon Transformation): At least Massively Hypersonic, likely higher [Note: Current rating based on removed calc]
• Zenitsu (Post-Rehabilitation Training): At least Massively Hypersonic, likely higher [Note: Current rating based on removed calc]
• Kanao (Pre-Infinity Castle Arc): At least Massively Hypersonic, likely higher [Note: Current rating based on removed calc]
• Tanjiro (Post-Rehabilitation Training): At least Massively Hypersonic, likely higher [Note: Current rating based on removed calc]

(0:11) Agree: HelloThere1089, Xaropadob3ta, Ped2018, JnSteHar002, Machmatej, KnyRaizn, Passersby, Digital_Franz, Viott, FelpeXDopZ, Kavopaco
(1:5) Disagree: CloverDragon03, LIFE_OF_KING, Armorchompy, Tllmbrg, SunDaGamer, Assassin
(0:1) Neutral: Laitnetop

Scaling From UR Tanjiro (Mach 320) and Base SSV Tanjiro (Mach 208):​

Epyriel/Sandbox

vsbattles.fandom.com

• Genya (Base): Massively Hypersonic [Note: Current rating based on removed calc]
• Genya (Demon Transformation): Massively Hypersonic, [Note: Current rating based on removed calc]
• Genya (After Consuming Zōhakuten): Massively Hypersonic [Note: Current rating based on removed calc]
• Hantengu (Hantengu): At least Massively Hypersonic, likely higher [Note: Current rating based on removed calc]
• Hantengu (Emotion Clones): At least Massively Hypersonic, likely higher with Massively Hypersonic+ Attack Speed [Note: Current rating based on removed calc]
• Tanjiro (Post-Type Zero Training): At least Massively Hypersonic, likely higher [Note: Current rating based on removed calc]

(0:15) Agree: HelloThere1089, Xaropadob3ta, Ped2018, JnSteHar002, Machmatej, KnyRaizn, Passersby, Digital_Franz, Viott, CloverDragon03, SunDaGamer, FelpeXDopZ, Assassin, Laitnetop, Kavopaco
(0:0) Disagree:
(0:0) Neutral:

Scaling From Unmarked SSV Mitsuri (Mach 2201) and ED Tengen (Mach 1762):​

Epyriel/Sandbox

vsbattles.fandom.com

• Genya (After Consuming Kokushibo): Likely Massively Hypersonic+
• Inosuke (Post-Hashira Training): Likely Massively Hypersonic+
• Nezuko (Sun Immunity): Massively Hypersonic+
• Kaigaku: Massively Hypersonic+
• Zenitsu (Post-Hashira Training): Massively Hypersonic+
• Kanao (Infinity Castle Arc): Massively Hypersonic+
• Tengen: Massively Hypersonic+
• Gyutaro: Massively Hypersonic+
• Gyokko: Massively Hypersonic+
• Hantengu (Zōhakuten): Massively Hypersonic+
• Kyojuro: Massively Hypersonic+
• Mitsuri: Massively Hypersonic+
• Nakime: Massively Hypersonic+
• Muichiro: Massively Hypersonic+ [Note: Current justification references contested calc]
• Obanai: Massively Hypersonic+
• Giyu: Massively Hypersonic+ [Note: Current justification references contested calc]
• Akaza (Demon): At least Massively Hypersonic+, likely higher [Note: ‘likely higher’ added to compensate for significant speed gap from Tengen and Mitsuri]
• Tanjiro (Post-Hashira Training): At least Massively Hypersonic+, likely higher [Note: ‘likely higher’ added to compensate for significant speed gap from Tengen and Mitsuri]
• Doma: At least Massively Hypersonic+, likely higher [Note: ‘likely higher’ added to compensate for significant speed gap from Tengen and Mitsuri]
• Shinobu: At least Massively Hypersonic+, likely higher [Note: Current justification references removed calc; ‘likely higher’ added to compensate for significant speed gap from Tengen and Mitsuri]
• Sanemi: At least Massively Hypersonic+, likely higher [Note: Current justification references removed calc; ‘likely higher’ added to compensate for significant speed gap from Tengen and Mitsuri]
• Gyomei: At least Massively Hypersonic+, likely higher [Note: ‘likely higher’ added to compensate for significant speed gap from Tengen and Mitsuri]
• Tanjiro (Post-Sun Breathing Mastery): At least Massively Hypersonic+, likely higher
• Tanjiro (Demon Form): At least Massively Hypersonic+, likely higher [This is based on the existing page which assumes DKT is superior to his human form which I don’t necessarily agree with, but I will leave that contention for a different CRT in order to stick to adjusting the current speed ratings]
• Kokushibo: At least Massively Hypersonic+, likely far higher
• Muzan: At least Massively Hypersonic+, likely far higher [Note: ‘likely far higher’ added to compensate for being faster than Kokushibo]
• Yoriichi: At least Massively Hypersonic+, likely far higher [Note: Current justification references removed calc]

(0:15) Agree: HelloThere1089, Xaropadob3ta, Ped2018, JnSteHar002, Machmatej, KnyRaizn, Passersby, Digital_Franz, Viott, CloverDragon03, SunDaGamer, FelpeXDopZ, Assassin, Laitnetop, Kavopaco
(0:0) Disagree:
(0:0) Neutral:

Note: Except where designated, these ratings are based on existing accepted scaling chains in order to narrow the scope of this thread. Please save discussions of changing the relative scaling between characters contrary to what is currently accepted for a different thread.

 

[HelloThere1089]

Makes sense for now. Good work. And following.

 

[Xaropadob3ta]

Up, agreeing with everything.

 

[Ped2018]

Damn, this is way better than i expected It to be, and If you're not changing any scaling in this thread then i have no contentions, 100% agree

 

[JnSteHar002]

Agree; open to discussion but this all makes sense to me

 

[Machmatej]

Agree with everything. Good job.

 

[KnyRaizn]

yh, this seems good for me.

 

[Passersby]

This is beautiful, some far highers are needed but I will work that out in another CRT

 

[Digital_Franz]

Looks good. Agree.

 

[Viott]

I agree.

 

[CloverDragon03]

Is there any reason why the Flowing Dance calc wouldn't be considered an outlier? Especially because it's at a point in time when the speed of sound is still relevant

 

[LIFE_OF_KING]

The Flowing Dance calc method was already used long time ago and it wasn't accepted since Tanjiro isn't massively faster than these demons and its seen just as a perspective effect of the anime

And how they being MHS is consistent when even Upper Moons can get shot and use sound attacks?

 

[Epyriel]

Is there any reason why the Flowing Dance calc wouldn't be considered an outlier? Especially because it's at a point in time when the speed of sound is still relevant

Tanjiro could dodge Kyogai’s sound speed attacks without a breathing technique while both severely injured and heavily disoriented by the spinning room. He then proceeded to blitz him (despite still being injured and disoriented) with a breathing technique.

Remember this is still during the time where Tanjiro still hasn’t unlocked Total Concentration Breathing: Constant, meaning the difference between his base speed and breathing technique speed is even more drastic.

Considering the incredibly vast difference between his technique speed and his base speed (as shown in almost every UR fight where demon slayers are relative to demons without breathing techniques, yet blitz those same demons when given the chance to use their breathing technique), this gulf in speed seems entirely consistent for the arc.

 

[Passersby]

And how they being MHS is consistent when even Upper Moons can get shot?

This feels nostalgic for some reason

Anyways, here

there wasn't really much use to dodging the bullet when it won't do much given a demon's physiology, well, either that or he couldn't given the range was pretty close, these guys aren't really the top of the food chain since they get blitzed by marked tanjiro who himself gets blitzed by any unmarked pillar


altough i've always had issues with it, low tiers are already more than capable of handling transonic speeds to begin with, even the databook mentions that Kyogai's attacks are as fast as sound, i have no idea what people have against narrative based arguments but it would do well to consider the shotgun is made of nichirin (which has been demonstrated to induce supernatural properties when being used by a breath weilding swordsman when Giyuu, who was looking for a sword to use in the final fight, specifically looked for a water breathing swordsmen's sword instead of picking a random one off the ground despite the gravity of the situation(they were fighting muzan and all))

the concept of special gun power also exists (it was used against uppermoon 6) , so there is no reason to treat genya's shot gun like a regular weapon,since it was specifically built to kill demons if it was then the entire setting falls apart since the demon hunter crop may as well supply everyone with regular guns because appearenly a "regular" shot gun can pulverise lower moons's necks (the standard for becoming a hashira is killing lower moons, Why go through training so intense that it made him you puke blood and put you on the verge of death if all you need is a gun?), even if we take Rui's statement his body is harder than steel then regular bullets would literally just bounce off of him, and Upper Moons are that much tougher, hell, regular guns would even struggle against mook tier demons like the Hands Demon, a normal shotgun wouldn't even make some dents on his neck, Genya's shotgun is not a regular weapon, given the data book descriptions about it like "it contains the power of sun light" and that "it's a gun that can defeat demons," aka, a super gun, and considering the whole message of the rengoku prequal is that guns are useless as rengoku proved when hairo said "you can never beat a gun with a sword" and we all know rengoku proceeds to win that fight



...the hotlinks ain't working, ah whatever

I will hotlink it later if I bother at all

 

[CloverDragon03]

I still disagree. You're using Flowing Dance as the evidence for why Breathing Techniques are much faster, when Flowing Dance being MHS is what's being argued for. That doesn't line up. As LIFE_OF_KING brought up, too, Tanjiro is by no means massively faster than these demons. I don't think the evidence is enough for the extraordinary claim of MHS beginning of series characters, so I would disagree with the use of that calc. The rest seems fine, though, as it's consistent later on

 

[LIFE_OF_KING]

altough i've always had issues with it, low tiers are already more than capable of handling transonic speeds to begin with,

This doesn't mean anything at all

even the databook mentions that Kyogai's attacks are as fast as sound

I have calced most of the feats of Tanjiro dodging Kyogay's attacks, and most are just Subsonic, not even Subsonic+

the concept of special gun power also exists (it was used against uppermoon 6) , so there is no reason to treat genya's shot gun like a regular weapon

Yes, the bullets are made out of nichirin, which is irrelevant. The speed of a bullet comes from the explosive force of gunpowder, not the material of the bullet. You would need a lot of proof to assume that these bullets can move at mach 100 and above

 

[CloverDragon03]

Also narratively there's no reason for Breathing Techniques to be faster considering they're legitimately just swords swings but done in different motions. All the fancy effects aren't actually there. This just seems to me like jumping through too many hoops for this to be legitimate

 

[Passersby]

This doesn't mean anything at all

What wonderfully made counterarguments, how fun was it to separate multiple connected premises that were used to soldify a single conclusion while using a step by step analysis of the series itself as evidence

And not even providing any counterarguments, but the equivalent of 'Nah uh it doesn't count for me" to Handwave it, how about, yk, taking it into consideration?
Shouldn't be too hard if you're not disingenuous

I have calced most of the feats of Tanjiro dodging Kyogay's attacks, and most are just Subsonic, not even Subsonic+

More than enough to dodge bullets, isn't that nice?

Injured season 1 tanjiro >>> uppermoons confirmed

Yes, the bullets are made out of nichirin, which is irrelevant. The speed of a bullet is from the explosive force of gunpowder, not the material of the bullet

The gun itself is made out of nichirin, why did you skip and handwave most of the stuff while separating the premises that lead to the conclusion LOK?
Idk, let me bring the points you seem to have not seen back

there wasn't really much use to dodging the bullet when it won't do much given a demon's physiology, well, either that or he couldn't given the range was pretty close, these guys aren't really the top of the food chain since they get blitzed by marked tanjiro who himself gets blitzed by any unmarked pillar


altough i've always had issues with it, low tiers are already more than capable of handling transonic speeds to begin with, even the databook mentions that Kyogai's attacks are as fast as sound, i have no idea what people have against narrative based arguments but it would do well to consider the shotgun is made of nichirin (which has been demonstrated to induce supernatural properties when being used by a breath weilding swordsman when Giyuu, who was looking for a sword to use in the final fight, specifically looked for a water breathing swordsmen's sword instead of picking a random one off the ground despite the gravity of the situation(they were fighting muzan and all))

the concept of special gun power also exists (it was used against uppermoon 6) , so there is no reason to treat genya's shot gun like a regular weapon,since it was specifically built to kill demons if it was then the entire setting falls apart since the demon hunter crop may as well supply everyone with regular guns because appearenly a "regular" shot gun can pulverise lower moons's necks (the standard for becoming a hashira is killing lower moons, Why go through training so intense that it made him you puke blood and put you on the verge of death if all you need is a gun?), even if we take Rui's statement his body is harder than steel then regular bullets would literally just bounce off of him, and Upper Moons are that much tougher, hell, regular guns would even struggle against mook tier demons like the Hands Demon, a normal shotgun wouldn't even make some dents on his neck, Genya's shotgun is not a regular weapon, given the data book descriptions about it like "it contains the power of sun light" and that "it's a gun that can defeat demons," aka, a super gun, and considering the whole message of the rengoku prequal is that guns are useless as rengoku proved when hairo said "you can never beat a gun with a sword" and we all know rengoku proceeds to win that fight

Yeah basically you ignored everything, I'd highlight the important stuff but that would need a PC

Also narratively there's no reason for Breathing Techniques to be faster considering they're legitimately just swords swings but done in different motions. All the fancy effects aren't actually there. This just seems to me like jumping through too many hoops for this to be legitimate

This 2, I will continue this argument later

 

[LIFE_OF_KING]

More than enough to dodge bullets, isn't that nice?

Yes, facts brotha, but its better than MHS+. A hypersonic or even hypersonic+ character can get hit by bullets easily, but no bullet should ever dream to hit a MHS+. The difference between the speed of sound and a MHS+ is BIGGER than the difference between a dying snail and a car at full speed. Any uppermoon, or even any demon from the begin of the series, would never get hit by bullets if the values in this thread were consistent.

The gun itself is made out of nichirin

is the gunpowder made out of nichirin?

 

[Epyriel]

The Flowing Dance calc method was already used long time ago and it wasn't accepted since Tanjiro isn't massively faster than these demons and its seen just as a perspective effect of the anime

I still disagree. You're using Flowing Dance as the evidence for why Breathing Techniques are much faster, when Flowing Dance being MHS is what's being argued for. That doesn't line up. As LIFE_OF_KING brought up, too, Tanjiro is by no means massively faster than these demons. I don't think the evidence is enough for the extraordinary claim of MHS beginning of series characters, so I would disagree with the use of that calc. The rest seems fine, though, as it's consistent later on

Pretty much all the UR demons are relative to Tanjiro’s base speed yet all seem to get blitzed by his breathing technique speed. This remains consistent with the above.

Hand demon is relative to Tanjiro’s base speed, gets blitzed by a breathing technique.

Susumaru is relative to Tanjiro’s base speed, gets blitzed by a breathing technique.

Spider Demon Brother is relative to Zenitsu’s base speed, gets blitzed by a breathing technique.

Kyogai’s sound speed attacks are relative to an injured and disoriented Tanjiro, gets blitzed by the breathing technique of a disoriented and injured Tanjiro.

And how they being MHS is consistent when even Upper Moons can get shot and use sound attacks?

Guns made from the Demon Slayer Corps who are known to possess a special explosive powder for exactly this kind of purpose. And even assuming Hantengu’s clone screams are purely sound waves and not a magical effect of unknown speed (from a blood demon art from a literal demon), literally no one ever gets hit by such except when their movement is restricted (either mid air and propelled into the AOE like Mitsuri or grappled like Tanjiro).

Also narratively there's no reason for Breathing Techniques to be faster considering they're legitimately just swords swings but done in different motions. All the fancy effects aren't actually there. This just seems to me like jumping through too many hoops for this to be legitimate

This ignores pretty much the entire basis for the powers of Demon Slayers. It has nothing to do with fancy effects, and everything to do with the fact that their breathing techniques are meant to hyper-oxygenate their blood and bodies to become effectively magical superhumans. And at this point of the story, nobody has unlocked Total Concentration Breathing: Constant, meaning everyone isn’t getting much use of their source of power while not constantly using a breathing technique.

I wrote the entire Speed Scaling Context section for exactly this purpose. The whole point of breathing technique is to get a momentary burst of speed and power, something that is incredibly consistent and shown in frankly every battle. The only one jumping through hoops would be the ones trying to deny that.

 

[HelloThere1089]

The gun argument is giving me flashbacks to "Naruto is sword lvl" arguments. Good times.

 

[LIFE_OF_KING]

Guns made from the Demon Slayer core who are known to possess a special explosive powder for exactly this kind of purpose.

I'm busy right now so I won't go deep in your comment, but if this is true, send the scan and proof pls. This may change everything

 

[JnSteHar002]

Also narratively there's no reason for Breathing Techniques to be faster considering they're legitimately just swords swings but done in different motions. All the fancy effects aren't actually there. This just seems to me like jumping through too many hoops for this to be legitimate

Following @Epyriel, technique can drastically improve your performance while cutting off drawbacks in real life so it could/should apply here

 

[CloverDragon03]

Following @Epyriel, technique can drastically improve your performance while cutting off drawbacks in real life so it could/should apply here

That's not the same as jumping from Mach 0.85 to Mach 200, no

 

[LIFE_OF_KING]

The gun argument is giving me flashbacks to "Naruto is sword lvl" arguments. Good times.

This thread reminds me of when I argued that Muzan could beat Goku SSJB

 

[HelloThere1089]

This thread reminds me of when I argued that Muzan could beat Goku SSJB

He can beat that bullet lvl fodder.

 

[Nehz_XZX]

And how they being MHS is consistent when even Upper Moons can get shot and use sound attacks?

Given that Hantengu is accepted as having access to real lightning, multiple characters manage to avoid getting hit by his lightning and that we also have Daki reacting to Tengen's explosions I don't think you'll be able to successfully argue for Supersonic or below.

Also narratively there's no reason for Breathing Techniques to be faster considering they're legitimately just swords swings but done in different motions. All the fancy effects aren't actually there. This just seems to me like jumping through too many hoops for this to be legitimate

Full Concentration Breathing does canonically boost stats but the suggested difference of Subsonic+ and Massively Hypersonic is indeed really huge. The Spider Demon Sister was able to see butterflies from Shinobu's attack and Murata has been described as having faint water for his techniques, so it seems that at the very least the effects are something that can be observed in-universe even if they aren't real.

 

[KnyRaizn]

The Flowing Dance calc method was already used long time ago and it wasn't accepted since Tanjiro isn't massively faster than these demons and its seen just as a perspective effect of the anime

And how they being MHS is consistent when even Upper Moons can get shot and use sound attacks?

Tanjiro is in base form, at that time he still had the non-constant breathing amp. He could only use it when performing a technique, and this greatly improved Tanjiro's speed.

1 2 3

So what? I don't see the problem lol. Literally their strength is not based on combat speed but on the abilities that they can launch, they can still perceive and react even if they don't dodge with their body. Except for the wing demon who can do so because he is literally a demon that also focuses on movement ability, and in fact he manages to stay on par with Tanjiro, if not surpass him at times. And then I still have to understand the logic according to which this would debunk what was said in the thread.

 

[KnyRaizn]

I'm busy right now so I won't go deep in your comment, but if this is true, send the scan and proof pls. This may change everything

here's

 

[LIFE_OF_KING]

here's

We are not talking about Uzui and his SPECIAL gunpownder. If Genya were using this his gun would explode in the first shot

 

[Passersby]

That's not the same as jumping from Mach 0.85 to Mach 200, no

Hence why he literally statued his opponent using that form

It's a speed value that can only be reached using it, and it seems like most breath amps get toned down after mastering total concentration breathing constant exepet for the sun breath's amps

We are not talking about Uzui and his SPECIAL gunpownder. If Genya were using this his gun would explode in the first shot

That already establishes the existence of special gun powder, making the claim about the one genya was using a regular one pretty much null and void, best you can argue for is unkown and giving the context I provided, it more likely than not isn't

Edit

And well, everything else I said about this topic

the concept of special gun power also exists (it was used against uppermoon 6) , so there is no reason to treat genya's shot gun like a regular weapon,since it was specifically built to kill demons if it was then the entire setting falls apart since the demon hunter crop may as well supply everyone with regular guns because appearenly a "regular" shot gun can pulverise lower moons's necks (the standard for becoming a hashira is killing lower moons, Why go through training so intense that it made him you puke blood and put you on the verge of death if all you need is a gun?), even if we take Rui's statement his body is harder than steel then regular bullets would literally just bounce off of him, and Upper Moons are that much tougher, hell, regular guns would even struggle against mook tier demons like the Hands Demon, a normal shotgun wouldn't even make some dents on his neck, Genya's shotgun is not a regular weapon, given the data book descriptions about it like "it contains the power of sun light" and that "it's a gun that can defeat demons," aka, a super gun, and considering the whole message of the rengoku prequal is that guns are useless as rengoku proved when hairo said "you can never beat a gun with a sword" and we all know rengoku proceeds to win that fight

 

[CloverDragon03]

Hence why he literally statued his opponent using that form

It's a speed value that can only be reached using it, and it seems like most breath amps get toned down after mastering total concentration breathing constant exepet for the sun breath's amps

He should have the reaction time, then, to view all her attacks as if they're this stationary, no? Or do Breathing Techniques magically amp reaction times too?

The more this goes on, the more things start to be created out of thin air to try and create some kind of consistency here - when the simpler solution is that the MHS calc is an outlier and/or has a flawed basis

 

[KnyRaizn]

We are not talking about Uzui and his SPECIAL gunpownder. If Genya were using this his gun would explode in the first shot

Regarding Genya's gun I've already said my piece. It's completely useless, it's only used a few times against Demons that don't base their speed on their physique, except for a demon, who dodges the shots. And then the gun becomes completely useless in the verse.

 

[KnyRaizn]

He should have the reaction time, then, to view all her attacks as if they're this stationary, no? Or do Breathing Techniques magically amp reaction times too?

The more this goes on, the more things start to be created out of thin air to try and create some kind of consistency here - when the simpler solution is that the MHS calc is an outlier and/or has a flawed basis

1 2 3.

Outlier based on what lol, prove is the simple solution. I don't see why it would be when they constantly outspeed and dodge lightnings.

 

[LIFE_OF_KING]

This is the size of the explosions that Uzui's gunpownder create. Theres no way that Genya's gun can hold this inside of them

I wont reply further for a while.

 

[Epyriel]

That's not the same as jumping from Mach 0.85 to Mach 200, no

That would be where the fictional breathing technique which magically hyper-oxygenates your body comes in.

He should have the reaction time, then, to view all her attacks as if they're this stationary, no? Or do Breathing Techniques magically amp reaction times too?

The more this goes on, the more things start to be created out of thin air to try and create some kind of consistency here - when the simpler solution is that the MHS calc is an outlier and/or has a flawed basis

Sure, why wouldn’t it also amp reaction time? That works perfectly in line with how Demon Slayer become so fast and strong, and are even able to clot their own wounds - by the magical power of their breathing technique hyper-amplifying the abilities of their body. Huge swaths of other fast characters work similarly, being able to increase their reaction speed in line with their super speed abilities.

We are not talking about Uzui and his SPECIAL gunpownder. If Genya were using this his gun would explode in the first shot

Do you think Uzui is a prodigal chemist on top of a Demon Slayer and Shinobi? Demon slayers don’t make their own weapons, the Corps handles that. It would only make sense for Genya to use a similar powder (in a smaller dose like real world early 1900s guns).

Not to mention the fact the emotion clones can and have blocked these bullets regardless at close range.

 

[KnyRaizn]

This is the size of the explosions that Uzui's gunpownder create. Theres no way that Genya's gun can hold this

I wont reply further for a while.

Okay but, what would be the problem with this?

 

[CloverDragon03]

1 2 3.

Outlier based on what lol, prove is the simple solution. I don't see why it would be when they constantly outspeed and dodge lightnings.

Only one of these says "physical abilities" while the other two explicitly mention strength

Also, I'm not saying MHS/MHS+ is wrong for later on, with the lightning dodging feats. Those are valid. What I don't consider valid is the MHS speed for Flowing Dance at the beginning of the series, when even the speed of sound is relevant

 

[Epyriel]

This is the size of the explosions that Uzui's gunpownder create. Theres no way that Genya's gun can hold this inside of them

I wont reply further for a while.

You do realize how real world powder weapons work, yes? You use a far smaller controlled dose of explosive power in an encased reinforced chamber.

This is like saying because a MOAB can level a city block IRL any kind of powder weapons are impossible.

 

[CloverDragon03]

That would be where the fictional breathing technique which magically hyper-oxygenates your body comes in.

And that's why Tanjiro, having the reaction speed to do Flowing Dance, is always statuing Susamaru and Yahaba and their attacks right?

Oh wait...

(Let's upgrade them to MHS too since Tanjiro comments on their sheer speed actually)

Sure, why wouldn’t it also amp reaction time? That works perfectly in line with how Demon Slayer become so fast and power, or even clot their own wounds - by the magical power of their breathing technique hyper-amplifying the abilities of their body. Huge swaths of other fast characters work similarly, being able to increase their reaction speed in line with their super speed abilities.

So... We are just creating things in an attempt to create some form of internal consistency when the simple solution is that the MHS Flowing Dance calc shouldn't be used.

Yeah no...