Controlling the Ying and Yang, Feng Shui, Spiritual World and other questions

[TartaChocholate]

Surprisingly, not related to the Xianxia novels. Well, I was looking into Final Fantasy Tactics and when checking the original Japanese description of some jobs I found some stuff relating to all this. Essentially:

1. Mystics (Onmyoji in Japanese) control the Yin and Yang, described as the principle of creation of all things in the game. Their ability, Onmyodo manipulates the changes in Yin and Yang. Now, in the game, this Job Class focuses mostly on inflicting status ailments, which can easily be classified in different abilities specifically. But I was wondering how would the basic description be classified that's not simply "Magic".
2. Geomancers, in Japanese, are described to know the theory of fortune and misfortune of the land and use Feng Shui to draw the mystical powers of the terrain. This would simply be Elemental Manipulation? Geomancers simply cast different elemental effects depending on the terrain they are standing on in the game. But the whole "fortune and misfortune of the land" bit is what confuses me.
3. Samurais in general are described to draw out the soul of their swords for different effects. Gameplay wise, the command allows the Samurai to use different Katana to unleash different techniques with different effects, that go from attacking, inflicting ailments, healing, buffs, etc. Different katana are specified to house malevolent spirits, souls attaining liberation and all that. What would "Draw Out" be? Soul Manipulation? I don't think it's Ectoplasm Manipulation given its not using the substance of the soul. Most descriptions of the techniques also refer to the souls as entities rather than a spark of life or "stuff that keeps people alive" sort of way.
4. Black Mages and White Mages: Black Mages control the physical aspects of the world with their magic, while White Mages control the spiritual ones to tap into the divine. Both use Magic, of course, White Mages also have Holy Manipulation. I considered Black Mages simply to be Elemental Manipulation, but is that correct? What about the White Mages controlling the spiritual aspects, does that fall into any ability?

Sorry for the long ass post, but I really did look hard into what it could and could not be and came short. Thanks in advance.

 

[TheGreatJedi13]

I played fftactics and fftactics wotl. (And wotv)

For Mystics im not really sure about the inner workings of yin and yang.

For Geomancer. Fengsui is related to positioning and the direction of north east south west. from where objects are positioned which if done correctly can bring out the most fortune etc. If the description is to be followed it would be similar to using luck or the formation of objects around a set area to draw out mystical luck and perform their geomancy. since Geomancer literally perform their special ability base on the terrain or ground they stood their ground on it would still be Earth manip/plant manip(tanglevine) since they arent directly manipulating luck Simply drawing power from it .

Samurai iiado is at least NPi with sword/katana spirit and would be classified as magic. Iirc it can also cause afflictions seeing how its basically the sword spirit being used it could be status affliction via affecting soul. I dont remember if it relies on the Faith of the user for the damage someone can take from it or the healing.

Black mage would be elemental manipulation yeah. As for white mage. Healing is the best i can say which can also heal spiritual aspect since they haven't been shown to directly capable of manipulating spirit/soul. But iirc holy/healing magic works well against ghost/undead/demon. So it could be a spiritual based attack

 

[XXKINGXX69]

Surprisingly, not related to the Xianxia novels. Well, I was looking into Final Fantasy Tactics and when checking the original Japanese description of some jobs I found some stuff relating to all this. Essentially:

1. Mystics (Onmyoji in Japanese) control the Yin and Yang, described as the principle of creation of all things in the game. Their ability, Onmyodo manipulates the changes in Yin and Yang. Now, in the game, this Job Class focuses mostly on inflicting status ailments, which can easily be classified in different abilities specifically. But I was wondering how would the basic description be classified that's not simply "Magic".
2. Geomancers, in Japanese, are described to know the theory of fortune and misfortune of the land and use Feng Shui to draw the mystical powers of the terrain. This would simply be Elemental Manipulation? Geomancers simply cast different elemental effects depending on the terrain they are standing on in the game. But the whole "fortune and misfortune of the land" bit is what confuses me.
3. Samurais in general are described to draw out the soul of their swords for different effects. Gameplay wise, the command allows the Samurai to use different Katana to unleash different techniques with different effects, that go from attacking, inflicting ailments, healing, buffs, etc. Different katana are specified to house malevolent spirits, souls attaining liberation and all that. What would "Draw Out" be? Soul Manipulation? I don't think it's Ectoplasm Manipulation given its not using the substance of the soul. Most descriptions of the techniques also refer to the souls as entities rather than a spark of life or "stuff that keeps people alive" sort of way.
4. Black Mages and White Mages: Black Mages control the physical aspects of the world with their magic, while White Mages control the spiritual ones to tap into the divine. Both use Magic, of course, White Mages also have Holy Manipulation. I considered Black Mages simply to be Elemental Manipulation, but is that correct? What about the White Mages controlling the spiritual aspects, does that fall into any ability?

Sorry for the long ass post, but I really did look hard into what it could and could not be and came short. Thanks in advance.

1) Conceptual manipulation type 1
2) Utilising the surroundings to achieve probability manipulation. We don't have an ability for this, its not directly manipulating it. I think psuedo probability manipulation and supernatural luck should work
3) Soul manipulation
4) Soul manipulation, and in the context of FF, memory, emotion, chaos (see paradox ending of XIII-2) and mind manipulation

 

[TartaChocholate]

Okay, so, got the direct scans from the Japanese version of the game (translations are at the bottom)

Mystic
Geomancer

This page (the list on the left are the jobs) here compiles all the descriptions from the game. Initially I was iffy on it because I though it could just be the webmaster writting down what they thought the classes did in the game, but actually seems to be a literal transcription given is the same as the game directly for Geomancers and Mystics and looking around the web for those descriptions shows that all sites compiling said info have the same Job descriptions.

@TheGreatJedi13: So like KING says, the Geomancer could work as Probability Manipulation in a way, since it involves luck all in all. The Samurai NPE is clear cut, but IIRC no abilities target souls directly, some did bring out spirits that attacked in their stead like Muramasa or Chirijiraden. Iaido is a magick attack so it relies on faith as well. White Mages do target souls with Raise to an extent, but that's the sole case I could find. They do deal highly effective damage against unholy and undead enemies. The spiritual seems to be a source.

Yeah I think Black Mages being elemental manipulation seems the way to go, since it means the physical elements and all.

@King: Concept 1... huh, dang. Probability Manipulation to perform elemental manipulation and other stuff seems reasonable? I'm sure I've seen characters that can alter probability in their favour and stuff like that, so maybe checks out. Yeah, soul manip for Samurais may work, not in the sense they target or affect souls, but at least in that they use them as part of their attacks. Soul Manip for White Mages could be a thing as well, in general Soul, Mind and Heart being connected seems to be a constant in the franchise, I mean the Lucavi are described to attack on those three ends as well in Tactics as well.

 

[TheGreatJedi13]

I mean yeah after some thinking soul manipulation for white mage works. It could also be purification since they have abilities to remove status ailments.

Healing and purifying souls and with holy as something that would actually destroy probably on soul level as well.

Samurai being faith based makes sense for it to have soul manip too then. Manipulating the spirit of the blade to perform feat is still soul manip so it checks out

Fair enough for probability manip for geomancer.

 

[TartaChocholate]

The only missing thing would be what to make out of Mystics. I initially had it as Reality Warping and Law Manipulation, but that was trying to interpret the pretty vague english description that said "controls the mystic weave of the universe".

King mentions that controlling the Yin and Yang is actually Type 1 Concept Manip. That checks out?

 

[TheGreatJedi13]

i have no idea about yin and yang. but we can't really assume it to be concept type 1 without any explanation on what it refers to as yin and yang

 

[TartaChocholate]

Well, it is defined as "the principle of creation of all things" in the Job's description and the Mystic Arts description says it that the Yin and Yang "creates and controls all things".

 

[TheGreatJedi13]

I can only conclude Type 2 from that. maybe wait for another person to answer

 

[XXKINGXX69]

Well, it is defined as "the principle of creation of all things" in the Job's description and the Mystic Arts description says it that the Yin and Yang "creates and controls all things".

Google what yin and yang means, its like dualities

 

[Setsuna_tenma]

Well, it is defined as "the principle of creation of all things" in the Job's description and the Mystic Arts description says it that the Yin and Yang "creates and controls all things".

ki manipulation

 

[XXKINGXX69]

ki manipulation

Yeah controlling the dualities that maintain all creation is totally ki manip

 

[Setsuna_tenma]

Yeah controlling the dualities that maintain all creation is totally ki manip

they control the energy of yin and yang not dualities directly

 

[XXKINGXX69]

they control the energy of yin and yang not dualities directly

Yin and yang are dualities

 

[TartaChocholate]

they control the energy of yin and yang not dualities directly

Thing is, the Chi Manipulation page specifies that it refers to vital energy coursing through the living organism themselves not any energy that's labelled as ki, qi or such.

The text uses the kanji 気 (read as ki), but which can also mean spirit or essence... and a frigton of other things.

There's also that the Mystic Arts mentions they control the chi of Yin and Yang, but the description of the Mystic Job itself mentions they control the Yin and Yang outright. And afaik, the nature or origin of energy can also have implications of what said energy can do beyond Energy or Chi Manip.

Gonna take it to the translation requests thread to verify the translation to be safe.