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Categorically Verbose and Obnoxiously and Unbelievably Long Powers & Abilities Lists on VsBattles Characters Profiles and How To Perhaps Make Them a L

The problem is, a lot of profiles still have overly huge lists even with that.

Well, we cannot omit important accurate abilities just because the lists turn long, and many members would find it difficult to properly structure tabbers. I think that my suggested system would be much simpler to apply.
 
Therefir said:
What we can do with characters like Hajime Hinata? Only one key have most of his abilities and I don't want to get rid of the detailed explanations for the sake of appearance.
Click to expand...
Agreed. If we offer no explanations, our visitors will easily think that we are making things up.
 
Yeah but then we have things like Kirby.

Even if his P&A could use a little trimming most of his stuff just says

Power (via X) or are generally pretty small explanations.
 
But in the case of that profile, the justifications are all in the profile on the equipments and abilities sections.
 
Ricsi-viragosi said:
I imagine separating them into different tabbers is done more for visuals than anything. A reference to which powers they still posses would be needed, since several characters would have differing abilities for every key.

As far as I understand, this is simply to make it less offputting to look at, much like the title.
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I think this is the point.

It would look much more clean where applied anyways, without the need to ommit abilities.


Tough, since I can't explain it that well, I will make a beta of how one would look and you tell me.
 
Matt, the issue is moving all the stuff to P&A would make the profiles actually bigger, not solving anything. Lets use Oryx, the Taken King. Oryx is one of my profiles, and he has a wall of text P&A.

I gave him a wall of text P&A to clearly outline what he can do and provide links to proof, to avoid what happened last time with the profile.

Under your suggestion, I'd copy all of that into P&A, since a lot of his stuff just goes unnamed, and leave the powers sans their justifications and abilities up top.

This would be a net increase in profile length, and doesn't even solve your issue. The reader is still reading a lot to understand in depth what the character can and cannot do, they're just reading it in a different location.
 
One of the main issues would be characters who have many abilities but don't exactly fit in the notable abilities and techniques section

Like for the I/O characters. They have a variety of abilities through hacking techniques, but you cant exactly do it through a notable powers and abilities section. Sure you could do it for some abilities, but other wise it would end up looking like this:

  • Existence Erasure: Erases the data of the enemy, and thus the rest of their existence
  • electricity manipulation: some hacking techniques take the form of thunder and lightning
  • Fungus Manipulation: Some Hacking Techniques take the form of Rot and Fungal Growth, destroying the enviroment, preventing movement, and destroying the info of the target
  • Insect Manipulation: Many viruses cause insect like creatures to attack the target
  • Creation: Can generate objects from information
  • Server Acquisition: Takes control of the microcosom making it so that everying else is frozen who isnt granted "access." It creates a psuedo time stop effect
  • Time Manipulation: Can reverse the flow of time and use general control over it
  • (Pretend I wrote more. I got lasy and don't actually wanna do the full list)
Etc. Etc. It can end up being even more verbose than just simply listing out that they have Existence Erasure, Electricity Manipulation, Fungus Manipulation, Insect Manipulation, Creation, Psuedo-Time Stop, time manipulation, etc. So while i agree that many characters have a very verbose list, it should be balanced between which is more efficient
 
I can agree to this as well, characters who have like 10 or more keys are like so unreadable it's difficult to take seriously, but that's another issue. But some other big problems with giant lists of powers and abilities is that people don't know what the difference between hax and versatility is. Some characters really only 1 or 2 abilities to truly be considered "overpowered," and a character can have a shitton of abilities and still be considered fairly haxless.

Additionally, other characters who do have giant walls of powers and abilities actually get downplayed a lot in Vs Threads. For example, as much as I dislike bringing it up, but a certain well known HST verse has things like invisibility and intangibility, and the quantity over quality fanbase keep assuming the other character doesn't have abilities to get around that. Despite it actually being listed somewhere in that wall of text. And same with "durability negation with no explanation" despite it being linked to spatial manipulation which character B has resistance to.

So yeah, there's a lot of problems to consider; big walls of text and especially with multiple keys can cause problems on both ends. Better organization is important here.
 
I complety agree with this.

I have constantly complained about people not using the Notable Attacks/Technique section to explain certain abilities, instead of overloading the P/A section with unnecesary wording (Ex Issei Hyoudou).
 
I don't think that saying that this can't be applied to some cases should be a reason to not do so.

Trying to make every profile look clean is honestly a fool's errand, and even the OP aknowledges that there are characters where the wall of text is inevitable.

But where it can be made better, it should be.
 
Adding a references section like most other wikis have would go a long way towards fixing this problem.

To give an example:

Powers & Abilities:

Enhanced Senses[1], Extrasensory Perception[2]

References:

[1] = Can see in the dark easily, Episode 13.

[2] = Etc.

That way the power/ability is explained and has a source for where it comes from, but it doesn't clutter the page.
 
I always felt like using a bullet list split into three or so categories (powers, abilities, techniques) but it's probably to late for that. I agree with the Tabbers solution.
 
Newendigo said:
I complety agree with this.
I have constantly complained about people not using the Notable Attacks/Technique section to explain certain abilities, instead of overloading the P/A section with unnecesary wording (Ex Issei Hyoudou).
Click to expand...
This.

Put the lenghtier explanations on the Notable Attacks/Techniques section, where they'll be broken down into individual topics and paragraphs, and with bolding will actually look pleasing to read.

It doesn't matter if the profile gets even larger in the end, it will be better to understand.
 
References would be significantly more taxing to code correctly when you're writing the page in Source Mode, however, and most people would often mess it up, leading to a significant increase in the staff's clean-up work, so that should probably be discarded.

Plus, unless you're suggesting a "popup" model where a box pops up when you hover your mouse over the reference numbers, we'd need to create reference sections for that as well.
 
Hl3 or bust said:
This seems rather counterproductive considering the fact that a lot of pages will literally become larger by doing this
Click to expand...
What do you mean?

If you mean describing them in notable abilities part, then each one will be separated, which on it's own already makes them cleaner.

If you mean the tabber thing, it will be larger in source, but from what will be seen it be light yyears better.
 
@Damage3245

As Iapitus mentioned, it is a good idea in theory, but not remotely practical to apply at this point. It would be the by far greatest revision in the history of this wiki, and require intimate knowledge of the specifics of every single reference.
 
Damage3245 said:
Adding a references section like most other wikis have would go a long way towards fixing this problem.
To give an example:

Powers & Abilities:

Enhanced Senses[1], Extrasensory Perception[2]

References:

[1] = Can see in the dark easily, Episode 13.

[2] = Etc.

That way the power/ability is explained and has a source for where it comes from, but it doesn't clutter the page.
Click to expand...
I think this is actually a really good idea.
 
I don't consider it as being something necessary to apply to every single profile.

Just for profiles that people want to add them to. In some cases, like the extremely long and ridiculously profiles that exist currently, references would be a real benefit to them in making them look better and be more organized.

But I wasn't suggesting them as a mandatory thing to include on profiles.

You could simply have a group of volunteer moderators that could go around and add references when necessary. I'd do that for all the series I'm interested in for sure.
 
Darkanine said:
I always felt like using a bullet list split into three or so categories (powers, abilities, techniques) but it's probably to late for that. I agree with the Tabbers solution.
Click to expand...
I feel that at some point we could organize a VBW purge. Go through our least edited, least viewed articles and delete the bad ones. I imagine we could take at least a couple thousand pages off fat of our backs
 
If we are to move everything to notable attacks/techniques, what is the point of maintaining a P&A? A long list of powers with nothing even hinting at their potency, applications, reasonings, etc seems pretty pointless.
 
Yeah, personally I've been wanting to get the use of reference tags on the site for a long while myself. Using <p> commands, we can even make pseudo-references for certain powers that links to a power in their Notable attacks list. Only problem is references and tabbers don't work together all that well.
 
Anyway, I do not think that Matthew's suggestions seem realistic to apply either, for reasons outlined by Wokistan, Iapitus, and myself.

We could rewrite the Standard Format for Character Profiles page to tell people to use the "All previous abilities, plus..." format for several keys though, and also write that they should try to not to be overly verbose in their explanations.

It is an in lack of better options solution, but it at least seems to be practically applicable.
 
References could partially work, but only for specific and popular profiles where it'd be easy to keep the hiccups in check because they're being constantly moderated.
 
It is pretty easy to apply to lenghtier profiles. It doesn't need to be an organized revision, Ant, just something that Content Moderators could keep in mind when editing profiles.
 
Who said long Powers and Abilities lists!?

To minimize the affect of the ugliness of longevity a reworking of how lists would look will be needed. It requires the changes of the key conceptions as well. Without the key rework my list may work like this:

Gender: Male

Age: 22

Classification: Human, Ultimate Hope

Powers and Abilities:

- Hajime Hinata
- Izuru Kamukura
As the Ultimate Martial Artist, he can flawlessly utilize any number of martial arts at once to create a mixed martial arts style.
As the Ultimate Analyst, Izuru's analytical skills are so high that he practically has Precognition and is able to read and analyze anything virtually instantaneously, being able to determine the personality, abilities, thoughts, and history of his foes with a mere glance, because of this, he's able to predict future events casually and he can use others' weaknesses that he got from analyzing them to make them fall in despair.
As the Ultimate Detective, he's a master detective and good at analyzing situations and mysteries even if most actions were contradictory or if evidences are greatly lacking.

As the Ultimate Clairvoyant, should have at least above thirty percent or higher chance of successfully predicting the future, Ultimate Analyst may also add up to the chance.
As the Ultimate Programmer, Izuru should be capable of hacking as shown that Taichi Fujisaki was able to hack an elevator with newest security system or Izuru should be able to hack into a school's main computer system just like Alter Ego did and Izuru would presumably require less outside help due to being the best programmer.
As the Ultimate Lucky Student, Izuru can cause implausible series of events like entire landslides by kicking a pebble or completely surviving a destruction of a building while standing still and without sustaining any injuries or scratch.
As the Ultimate Secret Agent, Izuru is capable of completely masking his own presence to the point of being completely imperceptible.
Even uglier, huh?
That's where the tabbers come into work!

Origin: Danganronpa

Gender: Male

Age: 22

Classification: Human, Ultimate Hope

Powers and Abilities:

Attack Potency:

  • Small Building level by himself
Should be comparable to Chiaki Nanami. Nekomaru Nidai noted Hajime to be surprisingly muscular and strong with incredible potential to become an athlete if he so desired.
Origin: Danganronpa

Gender: Male

Age: 22

Classification: Human, Ultimate Hope

Powers and Abilities:

As the Ultimate Martial Artist, he can flawlessly utilize any number of martial arts at once to create a mixed martial arts style.
As the Ultimate Analyst, Izuru's analytical skills are so high that he practically has Precognition and is able to read and analyze anything virtually instantaneously, being able to determine the personality, abilities, thoughts, and history of his foes with a mere glance, because of this, he's able to predict future events casually and he can use others' weaknesses that he got from analyzing them to make them fall in despair.
As the Ultimate Detective, he's a master detective and good at analyzing situations and mysteries even if most actions were contradictory or if evidences are greatly lacking.

As the Ultimate Clairvoyant, should have at least above thirty percent or higher chance of successfully predicting the future, Ultimate Analyst may also add up to the chance.
As the Ultimate Programmer, Izuru should be capable of hacking as shown that Taichi Fujisaki was able to hack an elevator with newest security system or Izuru should be able to hack into a school's main computer system just like Alter Ego did and Izuru would presumably require less outside help due to being the best programmer.
As the Ultimate Lucky Student, Izuru can cause implausible series of events like entire landslides by kicking a pebble or completely surviving a destruction of a building while standing still and without sustaining any injuries or scratch.
As the Ultimate Secret Agent, Izuru is capable of completely masking his own presence to the point of being completely imperceptible.
Attack Potency:

  • At least Large Building level, likely higher by himself
Far superior to Mukuro Ikusaba, casually sent her flying with a simple backhand. Mukuro is capable of overwhelming hundreds of Monokumas. All of Izuru's showings were performed extremely casually with little motivation.
  • Unknow with his luck
His luck is vastly superior to that of Nagito Komaeda.
The list is much bigger now, but it's more pleasant to see.
 
It would function as an overview of what to exept. No-one wants to read 50,000 words to find the one ability that makes the fight a stomp.


They can instead look at an ability that might make it a stomp, and then read it's description
 
Skalt711, you'd need to break up the different forms by tabber to make that more bearable.
 
I think that there a lot of good stuff being said here. Personally, I think walls of text are inevitable for some characters but using tabs would go quite a way to help with that.

My biggest problem with reading a wall of text is that it's a lot of times, it's just a smaller part of an even bigger wall of text and it can become a little disorienting trying to find exactly what I'm looking for in it. Tabs would help with such matters.

The Notable Attacks & Techniques should be reserved for the more iconic abilities of a character. What they're known for, what they like to use or is majorly important for how they fight.

References could be used for the more obscure and/or trivia based things, like explaining what Enhanced Senses a character has or the nature of their Soul Manipulation. You know, small things that they have that might not be that important.
 
Matthew Schroeder said:
I feel that at some point we could organize a VBW purge. Go through our least edited, least viewed articles and delete the bad ones. I imagine we could take at least a couple thousand pages off fat of our backs
Click to expand...
This is sorta off topic but I feel like this could happen as like a summer project, if there's a way to specifically search for those parameters.
 
Damage3245 said:
Skalt711, you'd need to break up the different forms by tabber to make that more bearable.
Click to expand...
I thought that tabbers would work. Usually they work.
 
Kepekley23 said:
References could partially work, but only for specific and popular profiles where it'd be easy to keep the hiccups in check because they're being constantly moderated.
Click to expand...
If we could do a trial run with a couple profiles and see if they're improved, I think it's worth giving a chance.
 
Matthew Schroeder said:
I feel that at some point we could organize a VBW purge. Go through our least edited, least viewed articles and delete the bad ones. I imagine we could take at least a couple thousand pages off fat of our backs
Click to expand...
It is better to do that gradually with the profile deletion request thread, rather than do a chaotic rush job which would easily delete more profiles than warranted.
 
WUUUUUUUUUT, I forgot to close the tabbers code. That's so lame for me.

Origin: Danganronpa

Gender: Male

Age: 22

Classification: Human, Ultimate Hope

Powers and Abilities:

Attack Potency:

  • Small Building level by himself
Should be comparable to Chiaki Nanami. Nekomaru Nidai noted Hajime to be surprisingly muscular and strong with incredible potential to become an athlete if he so desired.
Origin: Danganronpa

Gender: Male

Age: 22

Classification: Human, Ultimate Hope

Powers and Abilities:

As the Ultimate Martial Artist, he can flawlessly utilize any number of martial arts at once to create a mixed martial arts style.
As the Ultimate Analyst, Izuru's analytical skills are so high that he practically has Precognition and is able to read and analyze anything virtually instantaneously, being able to determine the personality, abilities, thoughts, and history of his foes with a mere glance, because of this, he's able to predict future events casually and he can use others' weaknesses that he got from analyzing them to make them fall in despair.
As the Ultimate Detective, he's a master detective and good at analyzing situations and mysteries even if most actions were contradictory or if evidences are greatly lacking.

As the Ultimate Clairvoyant, should have at least above thirty percent or higher chance of successfully predicting the future, Ultimate Analyst may also add up to the chance.
As the Ultimate Programmer, Izuru should be capable of hacking as shown that Taichi Fujisaki was able to hack an elevator with newest security system or Izuru should be able to hack into a school's main computer system just like Alter Ego did and Izuru would presumably require less outside help due to being the best programmer.
As the Ultimate Lucky Student, Izuru can cause implausible series of events like entire landslides by kicking a pebble or completely surviving a destruction of a building while standing still and without sustaining any injuries or scratch.
As the Ultimate Secret Agent, Izuru is capable of completely masking his own presence to the point of being completely imperceptible.
Attack Potency:

  • At least Large Building level, likely higher by himself
Far superior to Mukuro Ikusaba, casually sent her flying with a simple backhand. Mukuro is capable of overwhelming hundreds of Monokumas. All of Izuru's showings were performed extremely casually with little motivation.
  • Unknow with his luck
His luck is vastly superior to that of Nagito Komaeda.
 
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