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Captain Atom Revision

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No. Monarch is Low 2-C because he completely destroyed a universe by blowing up, and Prime was in the center of the discharge.

Within the "Countdown" issue itself this was portrayed as a 3-A physical event, but it was later defined as having completely destroyed space-time itself for that universe.
 
Monarch should also possibly scale from Captain Atom's previous Low 2-C feat, but I am not certain.
 
The universe creating feat happened in the Quantum Field, so I'm not sure.

He also has other low 2-C feats, which is killing Jenny Quantum and even the Doctor not being powerful enough to stop him, but thats because of the reaction of the Void
 
Okay. It is probably best to scale from Monarch's own feat then.
 
Also, someone should remove the big bang flight scan from the profile (the second scan which shows captain atom flying with an old man )

that feat was done by n52 Captain Atom
 
Okay. Feel free to remove that feat while cleaning up the page then.
 
Okay. Tell me here when you are done.
 
What are we going to use to justify his MFTL+ speed? scaling to GL and fighting other characters comparable to superman or him intercepting the Black Racer?

So, should we create a new profile for Monarch or just add another key for Monarch in Captain Atoms page?
 
You can probably use both to scale his speed.

Another key for Monarch is likely the best option.
 
I'm just wondering if we can determine Nekro 's tier by scaling him to Captain Atom while he's in the Quantum Field?

Captain Atom defeated Nekron in the Astral Realm, which Atom said that the Astral Realm could be another aspect of the Quantum Field

1

[http:// http://2.bp.blogspot.com/71LnSgQ_j3...AbnuR5wSu5DdP0R1J5YIvAe74lrMbAybWDMHdrw=s1600 2]

3

[http:// http://2.bp.blogspot.com/pxgNarwbJk...rTOkvaV-YdSpnS8mEB24YYU1d46-XwYBaFgLWjQ=s1600 4]

[http:// http://2.bp.blogspot.com/FLQe4VucU9...mUCqBrzz7TaN3isr0aIliv8nyk2rLI3ItO1tF6A=s1600 5]

6
 
@TheSandman31

I don't know. It depends on what Matthew thinks.

@Natse

Have you made any progress?
 
removed the big bang, that stuff happened in N52, and atom didnt even "catalyzed a big bang" in that scan,he only took Megala's conciousness to the edge of the universe.
 
Okay, but the problem is that every time you edit the page, you somehow automatically remove all mentions of his name, which means that I have to revert your edits.
 
Agree with Captain Atom be Massively FTL+ and to be honest it was time for someone to adjust his profile, it was clearly outdated.

And i have always find strange that there was never a profile about Monarch, anyway i agree that he should be put at At least Universe level+ for be much stronger than an Unrestricted Captain Atom.

I'm not really sure about Superboy-Prime get scaled to Monarch himself, since Monarch was having the upper hand in the fight and Prime at that point lost most of his power boost, but then again Prime was able to breach Monarch's armor and survive the universe level explosion.

Antvasima said:
No. Monarch is Low 2-C because he completely destroyed a universe by blowing up, and Prime was in the center of the discharge.
Within the "Countdown" issue itself this was portrayed as a 3-A physical event, but it was later defined as having completely destroyed space-time itself for that universe.
Click to expand...
In what comic it was retconed the universal explosion as a Low 2-C event than a 3-A event?
 
I am not sure, but in previous discussions about Superboy-Prime I was shown a scan that stated that the entire universe had been destroyed in the multiversal collection. I think that it was the Multiversity guidebook, but may remember wrong.
 
Yes, I also remember that.
 
TheSandman31 said:
I remember it being gone from the Monitors collection of Earths in the multiverse
Click to expand...
Orrery
Technically it was never clearify if the entire reality was gone or not, the Monitors only refer to the destruction of Earth-51 as a loss for the Multiversal Orrery.
It does neither prove or dispove if the Big Bang of Monitor was a Low 2-C or just a 3-A event, we can only speculate in this case.
 
Well, I am uncertain how to handle this, but if Captain Atom is Low 2-C, so is the more powerful Monarch, and Monarch scales to Prime.
 
I found this on comicvine, may help to clarify things

https://comicvine.gamespot.com/forums/battles-7/monarch-vs-white-lantern-kyle-1692043/

Credits to MaZeRaIII

Monarch did destroy universe.

During Superboy-Prime's entire fight with Monarch, taken From Countdown to Final Crisis, is shown here:

imgur.com/a/4UA5A#1

First off, Scan 4 does include a panel in which Monarch managed to hurt Prime with a Quantum"Nuke", but this Nuke had possessed a unknown yield - we don't know how strong the force of the Quantum blast was and, in fact, Panel 6 actually shows Monarch mention that his Quantum-based power is "like the Big Bang itself". That being said, this so-called "Nuke" would've obviously been leagues above any man-made Nuclear bomb.

In the same issue, we also see that Earth-51's Monitor, Nix Uotan, had still managed to survive the Earth-51 Universe's destruction. His personal shields didn't only save him and the surrounding radius, but also saved a Plant that had been nearby:

static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/10/102593/2801798-countdown13p21.jpg

Now, a lot of people try to debunk this feat due to the fact that not only did a minuscule part of it survived, but that there was some Light available to illuminate it, suggesting that the Sun was still there. This, however, shows a blatant ignorance of Astronomy as it takes 8.7 Minutes for Light to travel from the Sun to Earth - the Light in the panel had only been there due to being in the middle of travelling from the Sun to Earth, similar to how we can see long-dead Stars as if they were still lit up in Space. The Stars themselves are long dead, but the Light leaving those Stars actually takes thousands and thousands of years to reach Earth:

www.slate.com/blogs/bad_astronomy/2013/08/13/are_the_stars_you_see_in_the_sky_already_dead.html

Some of that Light was also likely from Monarch's Quantum explosion itself, but not necessarily all of it.

Despite the destruction, though, the Multiversal "Orrery of Worlds"survived the destruction of Earth-51, and repairs were immediately started, as was shown and stated in Final Crisis #1:

images.sequart.org/images/Orrery.jpg

"The Multiversal Orrery has survived repair after the loss of moving part: Universe 51"

Solomon, the Monitor of Earth-8, actually confirms In Countdown to Final Crisis that the Earth-51 Universe had been completely destroyed and "reconstituted" afterwards by the Monitors - it makes reference to the "Morticoccus", as well, an adaptive strain of the OMAC Virus that ravaged the newly-reconstituted Earth-51 Universeafter it was destroyed and repaired from Monarch's explosion:

static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/8/89194/3044871-countdown4p13.jpg

"Even though I've wrested the great disaster from him...allowing the Morticoccus to thrive in Nix Uotan's reconstituted Fifty-First Universe instead of that original Universe--essentially destroying the same Monitor's domain twice..."

dc.wikia.com/wiki/Morticoccus_Virus

A panel taken from Final Crisis #7 elaborates further on this point, fully describing how Earth-51 had been repaired by taking pieces of other Universes (Moons, Planets, Stars, ect...) and adding them to the Earth-51 Universe - this had been just after Darkseid died in Final Crisis:

i.imgur.com/uwgjcky.jpg

"I saw the World remade with my own eyes. With pieces from other times, other places. All in a vision that came to me in Command-D"

That being said, after Earth-51 was repaired and then ravaged again by the Morticoccus, the entire Universe had been barren by the time that Superman and the Ultraman of the Anti-Matter Universe arrived there in "Final Crisis: Superman Beyond #1":

static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/6/60791/3015699-1216813080-42154.jpg
 
Okay. Thank you for the help. So should we interpret that as destroying the entire universal continuum?
 
That pretty much looks like it. The monitor for Earth-51 was only able to rebuild that universe by taking things from other universes. And considering that monitors can probably time travel, that implies that there's nothing left in that universe even in the past or present. That combined with the other monitors observations about the destruction of Earth-51 makes Monarch's feat of completely destroying that universe's space-time legitimate enough.

But what about Multiversity's statement of Prime's destruction of Earth-15?
 
Maybe the writers or editors accidentally mixed up the numbers 15 and 51?
 
Anyway, are you willing to update the Captain Atom and Superboy-Prime pages?
 
Well, it seems safest to simply scale Prime from withstanding sufficient power to destroy a universal space-time continuum point blank.
 
Natse said:
Antvasima said:
Maybe the writers or editors accidentally mixed up the numbers 15 and 51?
Click to expand...
Doesn't sound like it according to Multiversity's page on Earth-51.
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/4c/dc/1a/4cdc1a9d46e3d6097fc9cf83a77041c2.jpg

I'm just asking for your opinion before I edit Prime's page and probably give him a Low 2-C feat of his own.
Click to expand...
That Earth came after the Monitors rebuily reality after Monarch's suit went nuclear, the Great Disaster is probably referring to the Morticoccus virus
 
Edited Prime's page. Gonna need that Captain Atom page edited to include stuff about Monarch. What were the images again that supported his fight with Monarch destroying the space-time of Earth-51? It's the Final Crisis page, right?
 
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