Introduction
I need to preface this, I have been working on this response for hours, and I will not continue to respond. I am so tired of arguing nonsense like this. There were reasons I left the wiki and I did not come back to constantly keep doing this. I am solely making this response both as the wish of a friend and from the sheer audacity of the claims being made, but this will be the only time.
First things first, I have to point this out, only allowing one or two non-staff members to participate is ludicrous when a majority of Bleach supporters aren’t staff. That is literally silencing the opposition.
Allow 3-5 knowledgeable Bleach regular members to participate. I nominate at least Purgy and AppleLord to join with Arc. Perhaps AnonymousBlank, IMade (If and when is able to appear), and Sigurd_Snake_in_The_Eye as well.
You all don’t seem to realize the nonsense that is a VS Battle Wiki CRT. When 5-15 guys are dogpiling you, it automatically a losing battle of attrition. A legitimate debate is only possible when there is a comparably equal amount of competent members arguing back and forth on a topic.
Otherwise, this just a ******* circlejerk.
Note: I have been writing this response for hours, so if any changes were made on this topic, I apologize for me being both incorrect and coming off as antagonistic, if I do.
Weakened Soul King/Reio (WSK) Stabilization feat
The main thing I want to mention is that this belief that the current rankings are solely based on the Soul King’s stability feat is ludicrous.
And while, I think a good case can be made to argue that the stabilization feat is legitimate, as it is described that it is via Reiatsu or owns power that the worlds are held up as stated by Jugram
here about how without Reio, Yhwach’s power is the only thing that can keep the world standing up.
There are other quotes, I believe, that state the same thing - that the stabilization of the world is done via the person’s power or Reiatsu. But I don’t have the time, resources, or willpower to make the arguments or search for the scans.
For a reminder of the requirements:
Requirement 1: Specify what exactly is being stabilized so that it is made clear what the character's sustainability is doing precisely.
Requirement 2: Prove that the stabilized structure is being directly sustained by the power of the character and not from the character's abilities, life force, existence, magical properties or any unknown connection that is independent of their statistics.
Requirement 3: Prove that the character's stabilization is comparable to the scale of the structure they are stabilizing. Preferably, it should be proven that the character's sustainability is comparable to the destruction of the structure to best show that their power rivals the destructive output of what would destroy the structure in the first place. Please keep in mind that this may vary depending on how the structure's destruction would occur. For example, if a character sustains the existence of a universe that would not be instantly or immediately destroyed when no longer supported, the power of their sustainability would not be comparable to destructive output that completely and immediately destroys a universe, and would not be sufficient enough to be given a 3-A or Low 2-C rating. However, their sustainability could be given either rating if the universe they sustain would be completely destroyed instantly or immediately without support.
Requirement 4: Prove that the power of the character's stabilization consistently scales to their regular statistics, similar to our standards for creation feats.
The Weakened Soul King obtains these requirements by:
Requirement 1: Numerous mentions that all three realms are sustained by the Soul King
Requirement 2: It is mentioned that it is through Reiatsu or power that all three realms are being held up.
Requirement 3: Creation began falling apart as soon as the Soul King died, and nowhere was there any mention that there was any time to try and fix this problem, just the opposite, everyone was shouting that they were going to die. And the CFYOW novel says, the one you showed, that the world will “crumble immediately”. Not “START crumbling immediately”, but crumble immediately. This is a direct statement stating immediate destruction.
Requirement 4: Reiatsu is the pressure of their level of energy, and thus, scales to their strength.
I would argue that this is grounds alone for allowing the Weakened Soul King’s stabilization feat to be legitimate.
There are more scans, proof, and arguments on the matter, but as I said earlier, I am not the one who will force himself to find them, that task should be done by a more passionate and knowledgeable member like the ones I have named above.
At the very worst though, all this would do is make the WSK’s tier Unknown, but again, this character’s tiering doesn’t affect the stronger God Tiers of the verse because they scale to different feats.
Mimihagi Stuff
This Mimihagi argument seems to ignore one crucial aspect of Mimihagi’s existence, and that being that it governs stagnation on that which it touches (This is the reason why Mimihagi wouldn’t scale to the stabilization feat because he isn’t using physical power, but hax, instead).
The reasons why Jushiro was alive all these years? It’s because Mimihagi was within him, keeping his illness at bay.
Mimihagi leaving Jushiro means that Jushiro is giving up his life so that he can succumb to this illness to allow the Soul King to be stagnated instead.
By Utikate’s life, they are referring to Mimihagi, as that is how he describes himself, saying that his life is Mimihagi.
Touching the Soul King just means that, instead of being in a state of dying, Mimihagi is forcing him to be within a state of life and death, allowing reality to not crumble away. Allowing his energy to still hold up the world.
Let me explain, in Bleach, there is explicitly described to be a state between Life and Death. It is stated that the Weakened Soul King already exists like this, and it was stated that Yhwach’s existence was made like this as well, this is why and how Yhwach was used to stabilize the worlds even after being “killed” by Ichigo in their fight, if you were wondering that.
Mimihagi isn’t “temporarily becoming the lynchpin”, nothing states this or even implies it, and in fact, the opposite is implied.
Mimihagi is explicitly stated that he is alive, that he is “Ukitake’s life”. This goes in direct contrast to the state of existence that the WSK and Yhwach are in when they are the lynchpin. They exist in such a state of being that completely goes against the idea that a “lifeforce” is what is required to stabilize the worlds.
All that is said is that Mimihagi is stabilizing the worlds in the WSK’s place.
And from what we know about his existence and his powers, the most reasonable assumption to make is to say that he is using his stagnation powers to make it so that Reio doesn’t transition to being fully dead, but maintains that state between Life and Death that he has. In other words, he is simply maintaining the already existing lynchpin, not becoming the next one.
And case and point, after Yhwach absorbed the two of them, guess what didn’t happen? The world wasn’t destroyed.
And it was directly stated to be via his power that he is doing this.
You might argue that this is done because he absorbed the Soul King, who was the lynchpin already, making him the lynchpin.
But if that is the case, then why would Yhwach, after he was defeated, be “made into the lynchpin” despite him already having absorbed the WSK and Mimihagi?
The implication is clear, being “made into the lynchpin” isn’t some special circumstance that is required that allows a person to maintain all the worlds. And it has nothing to do with Lifeforce.
What being “made into the lynchpin” means is having the person’s body be thrown into the
crystal seal which keeps them locked in place, forcing them to do nothing and directing their power to be the thing to hold up the worlds.
Still Silver Stuff
Are you ******* serious?
Well for one, the Still Silver is a Deus Ex Machina, not Plot Induced Stupidity. It was very clearly explained to do a specific function and it does that function. The only way for this to be PIS is if you think that Uryu is physically scaled to any of the God tiers in Bleach.
Anyway, there is a reason as to why the Still Silver works if you go throughout the arc and pay attention to the crumbs that are left throughout it.
Uryu is explicitly stated, by Yhwach himself, to have “
some kind of power” that is superior to Yhwach’s power. Note, this is not physical power, as shown when Uryu gets his ass destroyed by Jugram, Yhwach’s subordinate and inferior.
Still Silver is explicitly
stated to nullify Yhwach’s powers momentarily.
Uryu’s Schrift, the Anti-thesis, was stated, by a user of the Almighty, to be
the only viable counter to it.
And the arrow is piercing Yhwach from behind him and is pointing either leveled with Yhwach or even downwards (which would be an impossible angle from that difference in height), despite the fact that Uryu is in front of Yhwach, as shown when Yhwach looks down and the panel focus on him, Ichigo looking to his right side, showing the Uryu is next to him, and Ichigo is
shown that he is facing the front of Yhwach (Zoom in to see the white of Yhwach’s clothes under his cape). Further proving that Uryu making that shot from his positioning, doesn’t make any sense at all if he was
just shooting his bow, there is only one clear way for this to make sense.
With all this information, it is clear that Uryu used the Anti-thesis to send the arrow into Yhwach’s body (Which is hax, not AP), and that the Still Silver head’s nullifying powers are what didn’t allow Yhwach to retaliate as Jugram did, and what allowed Ichigo to kill him.
Ergo, this isn’t an anti-feat.
The Real Scaling
As I mentioned a long time ago in this post, the Stabilization stuff, while I feel an argument can be made for its legitimacy, is 100% irrelevant to the important feats that the God tiers scale too.
Those being the Creation and Destruction of Bleach’s cosmology.
First off, the Creation of almost everything from the Soul King is an explicit creation feat. The fact that this wasn’t brought up at all in this CRT is genuinely baffling. Again, if you want the scans of this, bring in the members that I suggested and they will do as such.
Second off, and more importantly, Yhwach’s destruction/creation feat/statement was briefly mentioned, but the arguments against it are absurd.
Your first point, about how it is “logically impossible” is 100% an
Argument from Incredulity and nothing more.
Yhwach is already stronger than both Mimihagi and the WSK.
He directly states this to Mimihagi’s face, and he was casually throwing around Ichigo in their brief fight, even tanking a few of his attacks, who was explicitly stated to have
reobtained his transcendent power for the purpose of killing the Soul King. And even if you want to argue that Yhwach’s Reiatsu was what allowed Ichigo to do that, that makes it a more direct showing that Almighty Yhwach is > than WSK.
Please explain how absorbing people that he is already stronger than makes him logically incapable of performing a great feat? Absorbing the strength of those you are stronger than doesn’t make you weaker than them initially or dependent on them for a significant boost in power. This is like saying, since Yhwach absorbed Jugram and Gerad’s power, that means that he should scale to their level of strength, no, not everyone is Majin Buu - just because he is absorbing another's power, does not mean that is because they are stronger than he is.
This argument you are making doesn’t make any sense. There is nothing here that even remotely suggest a limit to Yhwach’s power that would make scaling Yhwach to his Tier 3/2 statements/feats inconsistent or “logically impossible”, the only thing here that would suggest that is your own lack of belief that Yhwach could be that strong, and that is a fallacy, not an argument.
Yhwach was explicitly stated to desire
to create a world without the fear of Death which was stopped
due to Ichigo killing him. Essentially he would reverse what the Soul King originally did; At first,
he was going to do this by letting Ichigo kill the Soul King who was stabilizing the three worlds and everything connected to them, and then in the aftermath, create his own world. But instead,
Yhwach decided to “
take everything from” Reio, absorbing both him and Mimihagi, preferring to
fuse the worlds together with his power instead, which was said that
no one besides Yhwach had the power to do such a thing (Askin stating this shows that this was Yhwach’s plan all along and he didn’t make up this shit as he went along), and we even see him using his Reiatsu (Yes, that black energy is confirmed to be
Yhwach’s Reiatsu) and begin to do just that before his power
is nulled by the Still Silver in the very next page for
a brief moment,
which Yhwach then considers inconsequential as it is only a temporary buffer that was already
vanishing by the time Ichigo reached him
to cut him down.
Showing that yes, the “villain trope” is what is happening here exactly.
To argue that this character’s entire goal and motivation that were meticulously planned for a thousand years, and the thing he was doing before having his power nulled for a moment, which even he found a pointless victory, wasn’t going to actually happen despite everything in the series saying as such is pure unadulterated headcanon, and I cannot believe it is being argued otherwise.
Miscellaneous Stuff
Why would a character’s power level, or them being physically fodder, mean their statements are inaccurate?
Ganju is a Shiba, a member of one of the five clans that are descendants of the five people who helped the Soul King create the world. It is very possible that he knows a bit about the Soul King and the importance of his destruction.
What even is this point?
And whether he was referring to Reio or Yhwach is irrelevant, because Yhwach's goals are for everything that Reio built to be reversed, to create his own world where Death doesn't exist. Originally he was going to have Reio's death be the catalyst of everything's destruction, and then remake his own world out of that.
Obviously, when he decides to do it himself with his own power, he would still try and destroy the same stuff. Thinking otherwise makes no sense.
Yhwach wanted to destroy everything Reio created, which yes, includes the Dangai and Garganta.
Conclusion
To wrap this up, I heavily disagree with a lot of the claims being made here, I find a majority of them to be baseless and clearly indicative of a lack of proper understanding of the source material.
I highly disapprove, and I once again implore you to allow a handful of non-staff Bleach experts into this thread for discussion as they will provide the will, arguments, and scans that I do not possess.
Thank you and goodbye.
Do not call me back here.
