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Biscuit Oliva vs Steven Armstrong

Both are dependent on stamina, which Armstrong presumably only has a few hours' worth of. Oliva was nearly on par with Baki, who considers 12 hours of strenuous exercise a warm-up, survived with little if any effective medical attention a toxin with a near-100% fatality rate, and could tank whip strikes that could kill just about anyone else from shock in one or two strikes. Downscaling from Baki, Biscuit has superior stamina to Armstrong and will outlast him as long as the fight stays within a few city blocks to keep Armstrong from leeching too much electricity
 
I'd say it'd be a different story for tanky af characters who won't start showing any signs of wear and tear until they start getting gassed out, and both of said characters have significant (1hr+ of fighting) amounts of stamina.
 
Mother of all omelettes FRA

He could fight and actually overwhelm a guy who has the most ridiculous stamina reserves in entire Metal Gear verse and can easily generate massive explosions and tissues of fire on the ground, also amp his strength and speed with nanomachines, so gotta be him.
 
What is the AP gap? If it's not conducive to a short fight in Armstrong's favor, I'll really have to think about this. Armstrong is like a slightly better version of Oliva in every way (assuming he's stronger). Oliva's muscles can be moved to certain parts of his body as extra defense, but Armstrong does it better with nanomachines. His amps in the forms of The Orb and Hand Pocket will help, but not enough, so the only thing I see giving Oliva the win is his massive intellect. In terms of martial arts, his intelligence is only above average, but his academic intellect may very well allow Oliva to devise strategies to effectively defeat Armstrong. I'll reserve my vote for now, but I'm leaning more toward Armstrong mid dif, maybe Oliva high dif
 
Just checked AP. Oliva scales to SOO Baki (~15 kilos at the time). Armstrong scales to 1.15 kilos, but then fought Ripper mode Jack (10x amp), so 11.5 kilos, so I believe Oliva has the advantage
 
SpookyShadow said:
Mother of all omelettes FRA

He could fight and actually overwhelm a guy who has the most ridiculous stamina reserves in entire Metal Gear verse and can easily generate massive explosions and tissues of fire on the ground, also amp his strength and speed with nanomachines, so gotta be him.
Click to expand...
In Raiden's case, while yeah he does have really good stamina, honestly I'd say his cyborgization oughta give him at least a limited form of Type 2 Immortality instead of speaking to his stamina, cuz the wounds he receives that would be lethal to humans (such as being stabbed straight through the abdomen with the blade coming out) aren't just being shrugged off, they simply aren't important enough to matter. In addition, in his fights with the Winds of Destruction, they remain alive long enough to have a full conversation with Raiden before succumbing to their wounds, these wounds almost always being something to the effective or being dismembered to the point of being gibbed.
 
SpookyShadow said:
Ripper Mode Jack is almost 15 kilotons due to that Monsoon calc. Also Armstrong got 20 kiloton calc.
Click to expand...
Ah okay, if that's the case, then Armstrong likely does have the AP advantage and Oliva's best chances are his amps and intellect. Without the amps, Oliva tanked a hit vastly above 15 kilos to the face, so with his The Orb defense amp, he should be relatively okay. Hand Pocket is solely a speed amp, so that may be useful, but Oliva's best chance is playing defense with his muscles and The Orb
 
I mean, it's because he can't bleed at all and he has pain inhibitors (already has a damn good pain tolerance without that, as he had his inhibitors turned off during Armstrong fight). He already had incredible stamina and willpower in MGS 2 and 4.
 
I'm not sure if Armstrong can actually out-stamina Oliva, but if Armstrong can end the fight within, say, 5 hits, Oliva wouldn't have enough time to formulate a proper plan of action
 
They spar for a while, Armstrong starts talking about his ideals and offers Oliva to join his cause, Oliva accepts and they go off to take over the USA. The end. The best part here is that it would 100% go like this, it's entirely in-character for Armstrong to try and convince his opponent to join him and Oliva would likely agree with him.
 
yeah, either incon because Armstrong talks him into joining him or Armstrong because if he isn't trying to convince you to join him it means he's bloodlusted, which means that he's just gonna cook Oliva alive with one of his fissures
 
I do wonder if that's actually a valid match condition, convincing the opponent to join your side.
 
Shouldn't Amrstrong have Social Influencing on his profile for convincing people to join him that were previously trying to murder him?
 
I'd like to switch my vote to incon. Upon further reflection, Oliva playing defensive is just gunna stonewall both of them. They're close in AP, but Armstrong is Armstronger than Oliva, so every fight would end with Oliva doing The Orb, and Armstrong can't do any significant damage. Due to the position Oliva is in, this would likely just rinse and repeat, leading to an incon
 
Armstrong can burn him alive and it would be 100% in character for him to do so, also Armstrong has a massive lifting strength advantage, he could just grab Oliva by his arms and overpower him, opening the sphere
 
Assuming convincing someone to join your side isn't a win con Armstrong has Higher AP and Durability, Regen, lifting strength to open the orb and plenty others.

Besides Oliva nearly died to two 15 Kiloton attacks.
 
My vote is for Armstrong, there is simply no scenario in which Oliva wins, Armstrong is stronger, more durable, can regenerate, has a massive lifting strength advantage and can completely demolish Oliva with his fire manip
 
Schnee One said:
Assuming convincing someone to join your side isn't a win con Armstrong has Higher AP and Durability, Regen, lifting strength to open the orb and plenty others.
Besides Oliva nearly died to two 15 Kiloton attacks.
Click to expand...
No, Oliva is 15KT, Yujiro's rating of "vastly above 15KT" is actually from likely being able to twoshot Oliva, that's exact fight which you are referencing

Armstrong's AP is only slightly higher, and Oliva's durability in The Orb is slightly higher than Armstrong's AP. Oliva is a blunt force trauma fighter, so Armstrong's limbs won't be separated to begin with, and if he attempts to open The Orb, Oliva is gunna get a free shot to punch him in the face due to equalized speed.
 
BakiHanma18 said:
Schnee One said:
Assuming convincing someone to join your side isn't a win con Armstrong has Higher AP and Durability, Regen, lifting strength to open the orb and plenty others.
Besides Oliva nearly died to two 15 Kiloton attacks.
Click to expand...
No, Oliva is 15KT, Yujiro's rating of "vastly above 15KT" is actually from likely being able to twoshot Oliva, that's exact fight which you are referencing
Armstrong's AP is only slightly higher, and Oliva's durability in The Orb is slightly higher than Armstrong's AP. Oliva is a blunt force trauma fighter, so Armstrong's limbs won't be separated to begin with, and if he attempts to open The Orb, Oliva is gunna get a free shot to punch him in the face due to equalized speed.
Click to expand...
Yeah, and Armstrong can no-sell 20KT explosions, Oliva isn't going to put a single dent on him. And again, fire manip FTW
 
Schnee One said:
I do wonder if that's actually a valid match condition, convincing the opponent to join your side.
Click to expand...
I mean, it probably would be honestly. Steven Universe vs Thunder McQueen was a win for Steven for pretty much those exact reasons.
 
According to his profile, he scales up from 1.15KT. Raiden in Ripper mode would be 20x that, so 23 KT, and Armstrong is stronger than him. That's still only roughly 2x stronger. Oliva can still hurt him, and he'd be fine against damage with The Orb
 
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