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Bill vs. Dante

@Cal No one's saying Bill doesn't use hax. People are saying he doesn't use some of the particular abilities that were brought up.

@Unoriginal Memes More does not mean better. That's amateur level debating, what matters is how effective those abilities are and how likely he is to use them.
 
I'm going with Bill. Dante could seal but he doesn't lead with it and I'm not sure that Dante's resistance to petrification stops something like being turned into tapestry. Even if he doesn't nothing is stopping Bill make Dante dance for eternity andBill would notice fairly quickly that sheer AP isn't enough pretty quickly whereas Dante is far more unlikely to seal quickly

If I'm debunked then so be it but yeah I'm agreeing with Cal and going with Bill
 
Let me just clarify the whole thing about Dante's sealing.

The main argument most people use as to why he wouldn't use it in-character is that he has only used it once in the entire franchise; when he sealed away Mundus in DMC1. Problem is, there are just so, so many problems with this argument.

1: Sealing requires he has the Sparda Sword, which he has only wielded twice in the entire franchise; at the end of DMC1 (when he used his sealing) and near-ish the end of DMC5, meaning that in "the entire franchise of 5 full games" there have, at most, been a few in-game hours/days where he's actually had access to the ability.

2: He's had no reason to use it apart from those two occasions. Even if he used the Sparda Sword in the other instalments, he was so powerful post-DMC1 that he would never need to rely on sealing. The only exception is that Urizen was a threat in DMC5, but in between getting the Sparda Sword and reaching Urizen again he had gotten his SDT and proceeded to stomp Urizen even in his final form. So again, no need to rely on it.

3: In DMC1, he used sealing against Mundus almost instantly after getting the Sparda Sword back because he realised that he could not defeat him alone. Again, this was almost instantly after realising he would not win against Mundus.

So to put it bluntly, yes, in this situation, he'd be willing to use sealing. Once he sees that nothing he could do could truly defeat Bill, and that Bill was at all a potential threat, he'd rely on sealing to finish him for good.

Keeping my vote for Dante here.
 
Yeah it's unlikely that Dante needs The Sparda to seal, but everything else was accurate.

The argument that "Dante never uses Sealing in character" is extrememly weak because we've only ever seen one enemy that Dante had to seal. The rest of the things Dante has faced he was either too powerful to justify using it or, in the case of Urizen, he was defeated too fast for Dante to actual start sealing. By the time Dante was back and facing Urizen, he was exponentially more powerful and wouldn't need to use it.

It's not "Dante never uses Sealing", more than it is "Dante never has to use Sealing". Whenever there's a character he cannot defeat or overpower he will use sealing.
 
Durability Negation, Disintegration, Matter Manipulation, Sleep Inducement, Perception Manipulation, Memory Manipulation, Data Manipulation, Death Manipulation.

In short, Dante really only has sealing while Bill has a plethora of moves that can give him the win. And I'm pretty sure the only time Dante has relied on Sealing was when he faced a being more powerful than him.
 
Except Bill isn't an idiot. If he tries hitting or blast Dante and it isn't doing anything, he can just use his haxes like sleep manipulation to win. It's not like Dante will start with sealing anyway because he has to find out how powerful Bill is first to even consider doing it
 
Schnee One said:
Dante doesn't need to lead with sealing though
Click to expand...
Neither does Bill with a snap. Plus putting troublesome opponents to sleep is something Bill does which Bill will to know to do when sheer AP won't cut it
 
As I said before, Bill uses Sleep Inducement almost as many times as he does transmutation.

And Bill probably does Sleep Inducement straight after or before transmutation.
 
MYHERO said:
Damn Dante has a hit video game that returned to form, got two universal upgrades, and is racking up a good win record. Is it safe to say 2019 is the year of Dante?
Click to expand...
Now it's all downhill from here. Probably gonna get downgraded to building level or something.
 
Neither does Bill with a snap. Plus putting troublesome opponents to sleep is something Bill does which Bill will to know to do when sheer AP won't cut it

Bill using transmutation tesults in him getting utterly obliterated by AP

In that time, since Bill can't do anything without a physical body, Dante kills him before he regens or seals him

He doesn't need to lead with sealing, he's perfectly fine if he doesn't
 
ShadowWarrior1999 said:
He only used it on Mabel.
Probably meaning that it's probably just headcanon.
Click to expand...
Wow, great comeback.

Is that really your only argument?

Billl still has more ways to beat Dante, and he will likely use his wincons first.
 
I have. Or can you not read for some reason?

Bill puts Dante to sleep, tries to transmutate, sees it doesn't work, and disintegrates Dante.

Bill has led with Sleep Inducement far more often than Dante has with Sealing.
 
Wasn't Bill able to influence the 3rd dimension whilst trapped in the 2nd? If so he can move around without a body I'm pretty sure he didn't have a body for most of the series but was able to use hax.
 
yea Bill has some degree of influence in the 3rd dimension without an actual body

voting for Bill btw
 
ShadowWarrior1999 said:
Yeah he used sleep manipulation once on Mabel.
He didn't use it when fighting the Shacktron or after that point.
Click to expand...
Bill can't affect people inside Shacktron
 
People first say soul hax is in character, then transmutation is in character and now sleep hax is un character and the first thing he uses.

Can ya'all decide what he really uses? Because from what I saw in the show he never uses hax, only sheer AP (time baby, shacktron, therr are more?) The only say for hax is the first thing is Pacifica's dad who got haxed and could still act/move.
 
he transmuted the zodiac into banners with a snap of his fingers

he also put Mabel to sleep with a snap of his fingers, and would have killed her with one as well

Bill snaps and stuff happens

also Bill knows how life tasted like so idk what that gives him
 
EmperorRorepme said:
If Dante kills Bill and Bill is alive as a soul won't Dante see it?

But doesn't Bill regen like instantly or something?
Click to expand...
Not even close

Took him a few minutes
 
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