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Alright, again though, you are misreading the text you have repeatedly quoted. Regardless, discussion seems to have come to a halt, and I've already said everything I needed to say.I mean yeah you said that already, i still disagree for my reasons above I just wanted to say that as well.
It happens sometimes ovoWith a name like Comicgyal, I wonder what made you think I was a male
To be fair, we don't know what Quicksilver's power is in the live action moviesAgain, a time slow/stop, and superspeed, would look and function identically. If a character launches an attack while they are under super speed, and then the object immediately slows down or stops till the ability is lifted - it is consistent with that ability being super speed. This is exactly what Quicksilver does with various objects in this scene.
????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????To be fair, we don't know what Quicksilver's power is in the live action movies
They already had a brief fight with both using Witch time. To say that she only lost it at that exact moment, that the truck came flying just then and that Jeanne read that Bayonetta had lost Witch Time immediately requires more assumptions to be valid and can be dismissed via Occam's razorIt's not Jeanne releasing a "Witch Time slow," but actually Bayonetta losing her Witch Time speed boost. Since Temporal Control requires "a sound grasp of the mind," and "pushes one's emotional energy to it's very limits," Bayonetta was so overwhelmed/distracted/dumbfounded in that one moment that it broke her concentration - breaking WT. Remember, this would the first time in her memory that she has seen another Umbra Witch - and she's staring down the barrel of her gun - it's
Stop this. You are trying far to hard to push this downgrade as objective, irrefutable, and absolute. Everyone has their own interpretation, that’s exactly what this site is. Reading something 100 times over will not suddenly make your interpretation more valid than the others. Weekly has his own evidence, you have yours.I beg people to actually read my points, since everything I am stating now, are things I have already said.
It could very well be time slow if Quicksilver's feats are more consistent with that interpretation????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
I myself enjoy arguing so I'm not exactly heated right now lolcalm down. Lets not got heated
Also this, all of this.Stop this. You are trying far to hard to push this downgrade as objective, irrefutable, and absolute. Everyone has their own interpretation, that’s exactly what this site is. Reading something 100 times over will not suddenly make your interpretation more valid than the others. Weekly has his own evidence, you have yours.
I hope you understand that not everyone finds your points to be exactly as conclusive as you do ... Which is the point of a debateI beg people to actually read my points, since everything I am stating now, are things I have already said.
Take as much time as you need weeklySorry its taking longer than expected, i kinda passed out whn i got home. Am working on the econd half of th scans now
The mechanism of Quicksilver's superspeed is never explained in the movie. It could very well just be him slowing down time around him. That would also actually explain him listening to musicRoy, Quicksilver has superspeed, don't try to ignore canon to fit your argument here. Quicksilver has super speed. Other speedsters, and fast characters demonstrate similar things that Quicksilver does. All speedsters break physics. True speedsters cannot exist. Speedsters innately have secondary powers that allow them exist, function, and interact with their world during their superspeed (otherwise they would vaporize everything they move past, and even the smallest of objects would become lethal upon touch, i.e. raindrops becoming lethal due to how fast they are running into them, etc.). Likewise, true "time stops/slows" cannot exist. Time manipulators also innately have secondary powers that allow them to exist, function, and interact with their world during their time slows/stops (otherwise they wouldn't even be able to move since their atoms would be frozen/slowed as well, and if they could move, it would still be impossible due to the air molecules in front of them being unable to, and again even if they could, they would suffocate due to the air becoming a vacuum, they would also be unable to see if it was a timestop, and would be unable to interact with it any objects due to them being frozen in time).
When it comes to these physics/reality breaking powers, they do not make sense.
"If a speedster imparts hypersonic speeds to an object for example, it can't immediately slow down to a much lower speed because drag forces aren't that strong ever. It is however consistent with time manipulation."
Yes, this is true 100%, imparting something with hypersonic speeds wouldn't cause it to immediately slow down. Likewise, in a time slow, imparting something with movement wouldn't cause it to move fast at all.
If there was a time slow, and someone tried to throw a baseball, the baseball wouldn't come out of their hand fast or at relative rate to them. As soon as they let go of the ball, it would move in slow motion. The only reason the baseball would be able to move fast after they threw it, is if the object became relative to their time when they touched it, and retained some relative rate after they threw it. In a "true time stop or slow," these knives wouldn't move fast at all, they would simply stop immediately when they left DIO's hand. And you can say, "all timestops/timeslows operate under similar rules in fiction, so true physics not apply." Yes, that is true, and you can also say, "all speedsters operate under similar rules in fiction, so true physics not apply."
When Quicksilver or Bayonetta touch/interact with certain objects, those objects briefly become relative to them, and move faster - they then lose their "relative speed," and return to their own "respective speed," which is why they appear to stop/slow. Like wise, when DIO touches/interacts with certain objects, those objects briefly become relative to him, and therefore are able to move briefly in his stopped time. The object flies for a moment, and then becomes relative to it's own time once more. And all objects in these scenes, still retain their momentum, since they are still moving - which is why they still fly after the "speedboost," or "time slow/stop" is released.
The best way to put it would be like this:
Time manipulators can make objects they interact with relative to their time. Time slowers/stoppers manipulative time.
Speedsters can make objects they interact with relative to their speed. Speedsters manipulate speed.
Fundamentally, both of these fictional powers, have extremely similar innate "secondary powers," which is why they act they way they do in fiction, and is part of the reason why they behave extremely similarly. The visual similarities between a time slow and speed boost are obvious, the "physics" may be less so, because they literally do not make sense in either case, without "secondary powers."
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"They already had a brief fight with both using Witch time. To say that she only lost it at that exact moment, that the truck came flying just then and that Jeanne read that Bayonetta had lost Witch Time immediately requires more assumptions to be valid and can be dismissed via Occam's razor"
Jeanne and Bayonetta were not fighting each other when they were using WT, they were fighting a group of angels. She loses WT in that moment, because Jeanne turned to face her, and points a gun at her head. Again, this is the first time Bayonetta has seen another Umbra Witch in her entire memory - this is a very intense moment for her. Jeanne "reads" that Bayonetta lost Witch Time, because Bayonetta is now obviously much slower than her. Jeanne then escapes, which is why she "vanishes" almost instantly after the truck passes - she moves faster than Bayonetta can see.
And please, use the same logic and analyze your own argument, with your "Occam's razor." If Witch Time was a time slow, and Jeanne did release it, why wouldn't Bayonetta just enable it again immediately? And if Jeanne released Witch Time, why would it stop Bayonetta's Witch Time at all? Jeanne would just be changing her "time" to her "environment's time." The only way for Jeanne releasing her Witch Time, to also release Bayonetta's WT, is that there is only one "plane" of Witch Time. Bayonetta activates WT in the beginning of the fight, and then you claim Jeanne removes it; again, this would suggest that there is only one plane of WT. If this was the case, are you telling me Jeanne didn't use Witch Time for over 20 years? Because if she did, Bayonetta would surely have recognized time slowing down during random moments. And again, if WT was a time slow, then during the era of the clans, whenever a single Witch or Lumen used Temporal Control, time slowed down for everyone? And not instead, Witch Time just increasing their own "time" against their "environment's time" (superspeed)?
The only way it would be possible for Jeanne to drop her Witch Time, and have it also drop for Bayonetta, is if Witch Time was universal for all Witches - when one Witch uses it, another Witch experiences it. So again, you're telling me Jeanne never uses Witch Time over 20 years, or over the course of the entire game, because time never slows down randomly. And if Witch Time was a time slow, we would know that it's range would be extremely high, just based off various scenes in the game. Every time Bayonetta uses Witch Time in this fight, the flying rocks surronding them slow down. And in this other fight, whenever Bayonetta uses Witch Time, the angels in the far distance slow down. Again, another scene, where this supposed time slow is slowing things everywhere. And once more, in this scene. Pay attention to the sky/clouds in the background, the clouds are moving extremely quickly, yet when Bayonetta uses Witch Time, they slow to a halt.
What is the range of Witch Time if it is a time slow? Is it a city wide slow? Wouldn't people outside the range of Witch Time notice then? Since it would be obvious that some people would be moving slower than others once you reach the max range of this ability. Is Witch Time a global slow then? Wouldn't this screw with the planetary movement, and be devastating to Earth's natural rotation and oceans? Is Witch Time a solar system slow? Wouldn't people recognize the consolations and stars moving at irregular rates? Or is Witch Time a universal slow? Bayonetta can slow down the entire universe? And if we say Bayonetta can simply change the range of her time slow, why does she slow everything in all those above scenes regardless? Wouldn't it just make more sense to say that Bayonetta is just moving faster, and not slowing down everything?
Because Witch Times are stackable ... If Jeanne disables her ability, the environment suddenly becomes a lot faster than immediately before. Which is exactly what happened ... Bayonetta's ability wasn't stopped but her perception of events was suddenly changedIf Witch Time was a time slow, and Jeanne did release it, why wouldn't Bayonetta just enable it again immediately? And if Jeanne released Witch Time, why would it stop Bayonetta's Witch Time at all?
This entire wall of text is just deliberate obfuscation and derailmentAnd please, use the same logic and analyze your own argument, with your "Occam's razor." If Witch Time was a time slow, and Jeanne did release it, why wouldn't Bayonetta just enable it again immediately? And if Jeanne released Witch Time, why would it stop Bayonetta's Witch Time at all? Jeanne would just be changing her "time" to her "environment's time." The only way for Jeanne releasing her Witch Time, to also release Bayonetta's WT, is that there is only one "plane" of Witch Time. Bayonetta activates WT in the beginning of the fight, and then you claim Jeanne removes it; again, this would suggest that there is only one plane of WT. If this was the case, are you telling me Jeanne didn't use Witch Time for over 20 years? Because if she did, Bayonetta would surely have recognized time slowing down during random moments. And again, if WT was a time slow, then during the era of the clans, whenever a single Witch or Lumen used Temporal Control, time slowed down for everyone? And not instead, Witch Time just increasing their own "time" against their "environment's time" (superspeed)?
The only way it would be possible for Jeanne to drop her Witch Time, and have it also drop for Bayonetta, is if Witch Time was universal for all Witches - when one Witch uses it, another Witch experiences it. So again, you're telling me Jeanne never uses Witch Time over 20 years, or over the course of the entire game, because time never slows down randomly. And if Witch Time was a time slow, we would know that it's range would be extremely high, just based off various scenes in the game. Every time Bayonetta uses Witch Time in this fight, the flying rocks surronding them slow down. And in this other fight, whenever Bayonetta uses Witch Time, the angels in the far distance slow down. Again, another scene, where this supposed time slow is slowing things everywhere. And once more, in this scene. Pay attention to the sky/clouds in the background, the clouds are moving extremely quickly, yet when Bayonetta uses Witch Time, they slow to a halt.
What is the range of Witch Time if it is a time slow? Is it a city wide slow? Wouldn't people outside the range of Witch Time notice then? Since it would be obvious that some people would be moving slower than others once you reach the max range of this ability. Is Witch Time a global slow then? Wouldn't this screw with the planetary movement, and be devastating to Earth's natural rotation and oceans? Is Witch Time a solar system slow? Wouldn't people recognize the consolations and stars moving at irregular rates? Or is Witch Time a universal slow? Bayonetta can slow down the entire universe? And if we say Bayonetta can simply change the range of her time slow, why does she slow everything in all those above scenes regardless? Wouldn't it just make more sense to say that Bayonetta is just moving faster, and not slowing down everything?