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Bayonetta Discussion Thread

She wasn't downgraded to tier 6 (sort of). Before you joined and revised bayo to 3-A and got the scaling applied to all of her keys, she used to be High 6-A in bayo 1 base, and High 4-C in her left eye and Bayo 2 keys for the longest time after she got upgraded to that point. She was never downgraded to tier 6, she just never went higher than it.
 
Well, her Bayo 2 key did get downgraded from High 4-C to High 6-A at one point, but it was largely insignificant since her Left Eye key stayed at High 4-C and Bayo 2 didn't give her a lot of new abilities anyways.
 
Was that Rodin's planet saving statement? I always thought that 5-B Bayo was from the Gracious and Glorious world destroying statement before world destroying statements got turned into surface destroyers (High 6-A) by default.
 
Comicgyal said:
Lol I don’t get how 😂 what did people think jubileus taking you to those other realms were?
Click to expand...
vsbattles.fandom.com

Bayonetta (Original)

Bayonetta (real name Cereza), is a coquettish, mysterious Umbra Witch and the eponymous protagonist of the Bayonetta series. As suave as she is dangerous, she blasts her way through the armies of Paradiso and Inferno to recover the memories she lost after a five-hundred-year slumber, with her...
vsbattles.fandom.com vsbattles.fandom.com

2015 vbw was wild
 
@Crimson_Shadow101 It IS from gracious and Glorious' statement, but the statement wasn't planet level based, it's life wiping based based off the context, making it High 6-A. Rodin wasn't really a factor due to how vague it was.
 
Theglassman12 said:
@Crimson_Shadow101 It IS from gracious and Glorious' statement, but the statement wasn't planet level based, it's life wiping based based off the context, making it High 6-A. Rodin wasn't really a factor due to how vague it was.
Click to expand...
Oh okay then. Cuz I knew that we auto default world destroying statements as High 6-A without additional context, but I thought we just had a standards change at one point which made it that way.
 
WeeklyBattles said:
vsbattles.fandom.com

Bayonetta (Original)

Bayonetta (real name Cereza), is a coquettish, mysterious Umbra Witch and the eponymous protagonist of the Bayonetta series. As suave as she is dangerous, she blasts her way through the armies of Paradiso and Inferno to recover the memories she lost after a five-hundred-year slumber, with her...
vsbattles.fandom.com vsbattles.fandom.com

2015 vbw was wild
Click to expand...
That page makes me cringe
 
Putting this here so everyone knows, when the hax thread gets made these will be the suggested hax

Empowerment (killing empowerment would fall under this too, but I’m not 100% on that ability)
Resistance to purification type 2
Resistance to elemental manipulation
Resistance to pain manipulation
Resistance to durability negation
Power nullification
Holy manipulation
Transmutation
Alchemy
Astral projection
Barrier manipulation
Cosmic awareness
Sealing
Size manip
Explosion manip
Fate manip
Barrier negation (is that a thing?)
Possible dream manip
Possible darkness manip
That’s all we have so far

Also bumping this
Comicgyal said:
Why possibly 2-C should be likely 2-C

• The eyes of the world are explicitly shown to affect timelines.
This argument is the most obvious to prove, since it actually proves it in the game. After Balder is defeated and Cereza returns to her world, Bayonetta soon activates her left eye. As we know the eyes are sensitive across timelines, which means what happens in one, happens in the other.

Therefore Jubileus merging their main universe, would realistically go for the alternate universe, and every other alternate timeline we know of. This point is pretty hard to deny since it’s shown, which is why I believe it should be likely instead of possibly.

Why anything weakened Jubileus does is incredibly impressive

• Jubileus is much more weakened than you think.
This argument ties into what I’ve been saying in the irenic thread, but jubileus is very weak when she fights Bayonetta. Bayonetta is significantly more powerful than this Jubileus, and this is because of how she’s resurrected. Kamiya explains that Jubileus is supposed to be resurrected in Paradiso, and if she was she would be much stronger.

Kamiya quite literally compares her to a baby, which is why everything Jubileus does is pretty impressive.

Why I think the base eye wielders should be 2-C

• Jubileus and the universe she was creating is more than just a universe

As we already know from the lore, before the universe we know of existed, it was just Jubileus and the multiverse she created. We know that the universe (as kamiya describes) was a multiverse, is because that universe was the basis of the multiverse. Meaning during the cataclysmic event, that (universe) was split into 4 other universes with separate space times.

This is the same universe that Jubileus was creating in Bayonetta 1, which Kamiya himself confirms once more. So this means that wrongly ressurected, right eye Jubileus was replicating her same feat to a degree from when she was at her peak. Mind you, jubileus didn’t have the eyes, she was just that OP. The eyes of the world are the only thing that can restore her to original power, since they’re equally as busted. She needs both eyes to unite the trinity of realities properly, not to unite them at all.

So since Jubileus was essentially creating another multiverse like before, Bayonetta should definitely scale up to this. Bayo and balder would keep their 3-A because that’s confirmed, but could have a possibly / likely added.

This feat isn’t anything new either, looking at the seals created by Aesir. The seals were set in place to guard the doors to realities away from humans, since they would routinely destroy them. The difference is that these seals are said to be able to persist, even after the destruction of their universe, and which is likely referring to the multiverse. We can assume it’s referring to the multiverse, because the only other cataclysmic event that could happen would be Armageddon part 2. Since the balance is so tightly knit, no other god from the other realities could just destroy the human universe.
Click to expand...
 
Following for now, and some abilities look interesting.

But Bayonetta 3 is in the same boat as Metroid Prime 4 at the moment traveling across Purgatory.
 
Thanks DDM, whenever you’re free I’d like for you to look over the 2-A arguments too. Seems blatant to me but I know vs battles is strict with possibilities
 
Bumping it again for anyone to look over, since I do want to bring it up.

• Aesir and infinite possibilities

This argument isn’t as easy to prove, but cyber wasn’t in opposition for possibly 2-A. The reasoning for this was Aesir book entry about infinite possibilities, and how they’re possibly relating to timelines

As we already know, there are multiple timelines in Bayonetta. The main timeline, the alternate timeline with Cereza, the timeline where Balder possibly destroys the universe (seen in the beginning of the game) The alternate timeline that Loptr created when he went back in time, the alternate timeline Bayonetta created when she fought with her mother, etc. since there are so many proved timelines in Bayonetta, I do believe that Aesirs entry was referring to them.

“Existing in a different dimension, watching over the infinite possibilities that layered to form their history, across all time and space.”
It definitely sounds like timelines. The use of the word “History” and over all time and space, proves that it’s not linked to just their main universe. Aesir is watching over history across infinite possibilities, definitely sounds like timelines.

“Aesir saw through reality, and those visions became our world. These observations became Aesir's power. Aesir's eyes were truly the eyes that created the world.”

By this quote we know that what Aesir observes becomes a reality, and we know that it’s referring to universes since Luka stated that his vision become “Our world” the human world, their universe.

In Aesirs book entry it said he “Possessing the power of an overseer He existed in a dimension different than our own, watching the infinite possibilities that layered to form history”

He’s observing these infinite possibilities, overseeing them, and we know his observations become reality. It’s not impossible to say that these infinite possibilities are alternate realities that he’s observing, and can alter.

2-A definition: “Characters who are capable of significantly affecting[1], creating and/or destroying a countably infinite number of space-time continuums.”

Aesir: “Possessing the power of an “Overseer” he existed in a dimension different than our own, watching the infinite possibilities that layered to form history—

(Cont) The power of an “Overseer” is to control the fate of the entire world across all time.”

So he is capable of affecting all of these infinite timelines/realities, if you guys do agree that they’re timelines. They are all separate space time continuum’s.

It can be a possibly 2-A if anything. Glass and weekly said they don’t agree though.
 
I personally don't see how that is 2-A at all, I see it working as cosmic awareness tho and the "controlling the fate of the world..." is in singular so not even controlling the other worlds but you could try and see what it comes out of it
 
True but it did say across all of time, which is why I think they’re referring to the other ones. It probably can’t say multiverse since Aesir specifically governs over universe, so he can’t exactly control what goes on in paradiso
 
the thing is that "all of time" could very well mean just one world and its kinda vague to work out, maybe if it said something of "across all of existence" you could get something better.
 
You think so? When it says he observes possibilities across of all time and space, it would be a bit weird to think just one universe with that description. Since it sounds like it’s including more than one world, which is the infinite possibilities mentioned

It’s not perfect though, just working with an already vague verse anyway
 
Comicgyal said:
Why possibly 2-C should be likely 2-C

• The eyes of the world are explicitly shown to affect timelines.
This argument is the most obvious to prove, since it actually proves it in the game. After Balder is defeated and Cereza returns to her world, Bayonetta soon activates her left eye. As we know the eyes are sensitive across timelines, which means what happens in one, happens in the other.

Therefore Jubileus merging their main universe, would realistically go for the alternate universe, and every other alternate timeline we know of. This point is pretty hard to deny since it’s shown, which is why I believe it should be likely instead of possibly.

Why anything weakened Jubileus does is incredibly impressive

• Jubileus is much more weakened than you think.
This argument ties into what I’ve been saying in the irenic thread, but jubileus is very weak when she fights Bayonetta. Bayonetta is significantly more powerful than this Jubileus, and this is because of how she’s resurrected. Kamiya explains that Jubileus is supposed to be resurrected in Paradiso, and if she was she would be much stronger.

Kamiya quite literally compares her to a baby, which is why everything Jubileus does is pretty impressive.

Why I think the base eye wielders should be 2-C

• Jubileus and the universe she was creating is more than just a universe

As we already know from the lore, before the universe we know of existed, it was just Jubileus and the multiverse she created. We know that the universe (as kamiya describes) was a multiverse, is because that universe was the basis of the multiverse. Meaning during the cataclysmic event, that (universe) was split into 4 other universes with separate space times.

This is the same universe that Jubileus was creating in Bayonetta 1, which Kamiya himself confirms once more. So this means that wrongly ressurected, right eye Jubileus was replicating her same feat to a degree from when she was at her peak. Mind you, jubileus didn’t have the eyes, she was just that OP. The eyes of the world are the only thing that can restore her to original power, since they’re equally as busted. She needs both eyes to unite the trinity of realities properly, not to unite them at all.

So since Jubileus was essentially creating another multiverse like before, Bayonetta should definitely scale up to this. Bayo and balder would keep their 3-A because that’s confirmed, but could have a possibly / likely added.

This feat isn’t anything new either, looking at the seals created by Aesir. The seals were set in place to guard the doors to realities away from humans, since they would routinely destroy them. The difference is that these seals are said to be able to persist, even after the destruction of their universe, and which is likely referring to the multiverse. We can assume it’s referring to the multiverse, because the only other cataclysmic event that could happen would be Armageddon part 2. Since the balance is so tightly knit, no other god from the other realities could just destroy the human universe.

Possibly 2-A?

• Aesir and infinite possibilities

This argument isn’t as easy to prove, but cyber wasn’t in opposition for possibly 2-A. The reasoning for this was Aesir book entry about infinite possibilities, and how they’re possibly relating to timelines.

As we already know, there are multiple timelines in Bayonetta. The main timeline, the alternate timeline with Cereza, the timeline where Balder possibly destroys the universe (seen in the beginning of the game) The alternate timeline that Loptr created when he went back in time, the alternate timeline Bayonetta created when she fought with her mother, etc. since there are so many proved timelines in Bayonetta, I do believe that Aesirs entry was referring to them.

Existing in a different dimension, watching over the infinite possibilities that layered to form their history, across all time and space? It definitely sounds like timelines. The use of the word “History” and over all time and space, proves that it’s not linked to just their main universe. Aesir is watching over history across infinite possibilities, definitely sounds like timelines.

2-A definition: “Characters who are capable of significantly affecting[1], creating and/or destroying a countably infinite number of space-time continuums.”

Aesir: “Possessing the power of an “Overseer” he existed in a dimension different than our own, watching the infinite possibilities that layered to form history—

(Cont) The power of an “Overseer” is to control the fate of the entire world across all time.”

So he is capable of affecting all of these infinite timelines, if you guys do agree that they’re timelines. They are all separate space time continuum’s.

Here’s how the keys would look for Jubileus for example
3-A when weakened, likely 2-C, possibly 2-A with full power
Click to expand...
Quoting so everyone in the last page can see it
 
If I'm being completely honest I don't see the 4 space-time continuums there and checking the profile she scales to 2 universes while I guess the Trinity of realities is all a single Space-time continuum? Idk, im not knowledgeable enough to check that but I trust Glass so I'll probably run with whatever he thinks of that.
 
Comicgyal said:
Putting this here so everyone knows, when the hax thread gets made these will be the suggested hax

Empowerment (killing empowerment would fall under this too, but I’m not 100% on that ability)
Resistance to purification type 2
Resistance to elemental manipulation
Resistance to pain manipulation
Resistance to durability negation
Power nullification
Holy manipulation
Transmutation
Alchemy
Astral projection
Barrier manipulation
Cosmic awareness
Sealing
Size manip
Explosion manip
Fate manip
Barrier negation (is that a thing?)
Possible dream manip
Possible darkness manip
That’s all we have so far
Click to expand...
A few things.

Could you please put abbreviations next to these abilities so we know who gets them? Also, Enpowerment isn't an ability we have on the wiki and at best it's statistics amplification which bayo already has through 5,000,000,000,000 different means. Barrier negation is also not a thing. Could you also please elaborate just a little on a few of these things so that we're better prepared to defend this and understand where these come from when a CRT gets made?
 
A few things.
Crimson_Shadow101 said:
Could you please put abbreviations next to these abilities so we know who gets them? Also, Enpowerment isn't an ability we have on the wiki and at best it's statistics amplification which bayo already has through 5,000,000,000,000 different means. Barrier negation is also not a thing. Could you also please elaborate just a little on a few of these things so that we're better prepared to defend this and understand where these come from when a CRT gets made?
Click to expand...
yeah of course, I’ll send info in a bit
 
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