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Any idea which databook it's from?
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BAN-KAI! Bleach General Discussion
- Thread starter Zoro21043
- Start date
Any idea which databook it's from?
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Unfortunately no.
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I found it, it's from the Masked databook, the part where it goes over the Turn Back The Pendulum chapters.
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Noice !
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He may be a bastard like John Snow.
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It can be argued that something frozen can be very hard to break depending on the thickness of the ice.
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I never said otherwise
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The way Toshiro describes his flash freeze is akin to AZ. When matter ceases to function akin to AZ, aka when there's no more energy to extract from the system, the durability of said matter basically is equal to zero. And if you were to be frozen to AZ, you'd crumble under your own weight.
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Which we sort of actually see happen with Gerard, Byakuya specifically destroyed Gerard's head, and then Gerard's entire frozen body collapsed
But even then, you could technically argue that Toshiro's ice is relative to himself and Byakuya destroyed it so he'd be High 6-A regardless
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Isn't Gerard resisting the ice to a certain degree though?
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Malekith
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Now that I think about it though, in the color manga it sort of looks like Byakuya destroyed Gerard's head before it was even completely frozen, however it's strange because the ending of chapter 671 shows him only slightly frozen but in the first page of 672 he's entirely frozen solid.
So it's entirely possible Byakuya just literally erased Gerard's head before it was even frozen 
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Byakuya's only attack that could hurt Gerard was Ikka Senjinka, which means Hakuteiken would have as well.
Gerard was literally swatting away the petals with his bare hands in his first transformation that did 0 damage to Gerard's skin.
So Post-RG Bankai Byakuya does not scale to Gerard when using just the petals. It's only with Senkei (Ikka Senjinka is Senkei all at once) and Hakuteiken that Byakuya could damage Gerard.
Reminder, in Chapter 667 we see Byakuya send his petals to stop Gerard's hand from catching Toshiro and all it does is push Gerard's hand up barely... and two pages right after this we see Base Kenpachi carve the hand off like nothing.
Post-RG Byakuya needs to have his ratings separated if he's using just Senbonzakura Kageyoshi or Senkei and Hakuteiken which are higher than the normal petals.
Also, Adult Toshiro carved up Hoffnung like ******* butter, Shikai Kenpachi only nicked the damn thing. Plus, the Gerard that fought Adult Toshiro was stronger or at least equivalent to Bankai Kenpachi due to having been damaged severely by Bankai Kenpachi which means The Miracle turned Bankai Kenpachi's damage into Gerard's power.
Adult Toshiro and Post-RG Byakuya using Senkei and Hakuteiken are equivalent to potentially superior to TYBW Bankai Kenpachi.
Post-RG Byakuya using only Senbonzakura Kageyoshi as the petals is vague with a deliberate showing of Base Kenpachi being superior and unable to even harm the first transformation of Gerard.
Gerard was literally swatting away the petals with his bare hands in his first transformation that did 0 damage to Gerard's skin.
So Post-RG Bankai Byakuya does not scale to Gerard when using just the petals. It's only with Senkei (Ikka Senjinka is Senkei all at once) and Hakuteiken that Byakuya could damage Gerard.
Reminder, in Chapter 667 we see Byakuya send his petals to stop Gerard's hand from catching Toshiro and all it does is push Gerard's hand up barely... and two pages right after this we see Base Kenpachi carve the hand off like nothing.
Post-RG Byakuya needs to have his ratings separated if he's using just Senbonzakura Kageyoshi or Senkei and Hakuteiken which are higher than the normal petals.
Also, Adult Toshiro carved up Hoffnung like ******* butter, Shikai Kenpachi only nicked the damn thing. Plus, the Gerard that fought Adult Toshiro was stronger or at least equivalent to Bankai Kenpachi due to having been damaged severely by Bankai Kenpachi which means The Miracle turned Bankai Kenpachi's damage into Gerard's power.
Adult Toshiro and Post-RG Byakuya using Senkei and Hakuteiken are equivalent to potentially superior to TYBW Bankai Kenpachi.
Post-RG Byakuya using only Senbonzakura Kageyoshi as the petals is vague with a deliberate showing of Base Kenpachi being superior and unable to even harm the first transformation of Gerard.
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Those are some fighting words if I've ever seen.
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Byakuya blocked an attack from final form Gerard with his petals when he sent Rukia and Renji to Ichigo.
Myxenete
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And said petals were still unable to harm him and would fall under barely deflecting his hand like he did when he joined Toshiro, therefore not scaling to Gerard
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Blocking attacks do allow you to scale, if only durability wise, just like we grant Orihime shiled durability.
Byakuya petals durability and defense potential would scale to FF Gerard.
Byakuya petals durability and defense potential would scale to FF Gerard.
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Those are not fighting words, they are the cold hard truth. Adult Hitsu and D0 Byakuya scale higher than any form of TYBW Zaraki based on their feats.
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They're not and you'll lose regardless.
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And Byakuya also failed to even scratch First Transformation Gerard's skin multiple times when Base Kenpachi did.
So what logic are you going to use here to scale Byakuya's Petals to Final Transformation Gerard?
You realize you make a never-ending scaling error?
Byakuya's Petals = to Final Transformation Gerard > Bankai Kenpachi
BUT Base Kenpachi cutting off Gerard's hand > Byakuya's Petals not even scratching Gerard's hands.
Don't make this mistake.
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Adult Toshiro dogwalks both TYBW Bankai Kenpachi and Post-Royal Guard Training Byakuka.
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Never lose when I never concede.
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You can argue it wasn't a all out blow because he was aiming for rukai and renji,he probably didn't think he need that much force. We also see Gerard slap away baykuyas petals in his first form and one shot him like it was nothing.
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Lets talk about those ComicVine concessions lol
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No, the attack i'm talking about was aimed at Byakuya.
He save them before from an attack aimed at them by snatching them and shunpo awaay . They then stand behind Byakuya,talk a bit and he easily block a second attack from Gerard.
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There is no scaling error when the feat happen on panel.
Yes, Byakuya's bankai petal easily scale to the strongest form of gerard, at least defensively. Just like Orihime have a better defense than ofense, so does byakuya.
After all, Byakuya say himself against ichigo that senkei is him abbandonning all defenses to explosively increase his petals's attack power, implying the first bankai petals sea is for defense mainly.
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Gerard slicing off an almost unconscious BanKen's arm =/= cutting off an on guard BanKen's arm. At best Gerard scales to BanKen's passive durability, which is below his "active" stats. So no, Byakuya and Toshiro are not "at least" BanKen level. They're probably all roughly comparable with their strongest forms/techniques in the TYBW. Although, not like TYBW BanKen can even release his full power without tearing himself apart anyhow, so L for Kenpachi.
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Byakuya easily blocking Final Form Gerard mean he no sell all of TYBW BanKen's attacks with negative diff.
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Not inherently there’s no connection between the two
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BanKen best feats are far below FF Gerard wich Byakuya blocked. Implying he is remotely on FF Gerard's level is fanfiction
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They aren’t… they’re unquantifiably above the Gerard he was fighting. You can’t make a claim on what its limits are. All we know is he was massively above the Gerard he fought. As is FF Gerard, to what degree each are stronger, who knows.
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He ripped himself appart and K.O'd himself trying to attack Viking Gerard...and have no feats fighting this form or higher. Hitsu and Byakuya do have feats fighting Viking Gerard and even defeated him.
Byakuya and Toshiro have actual feats. Banken only have "Maybe".
Myxenete
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BanKen blew off his arm in response to 1st form Vollstandig Gerard's power, who had directly gotten miracle amps from his previous strikes making this version of Gerard > BanKen's available power pretty consistent, this level of logic is like saying we haven't seen anything stop Renji's Zagga Teppo and therefore he would incinerate Schutzstaffel tier fighters
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It’s all unquantifiable amps is my point.
Both BanKen, Byakuya’s Shukei Hakuteiken, and Adult Toshiro are all unquantifiably stronger than that giant Gerard.
Strictly speaking, Byakuya’s Gokei (or however it’s spelled) has the best feat since it destroys the strongest form of Gerard’s head that they were able to beat (since they didn’t beat V2). But Byakuya required set up and for Gerard to be held still, so that really wouldn’t help him against Adult Toshiro or BanKen, especially since his regular self got smacked around by pre V1 giant Gerard. For Adult Shiro he cuts the sword of a stronger Gerard than BanKen (not to mention that could be because his ice hax, since while it didn’t work on Gerard, I don’t believe his sword has any indication of getting that resistance), but BanKen does drastically more damage to the unquantifiably weaker Gerard. So it’s like one damaged an unquantifiably stronger Gerard but the other did more damage to an unquantifiably weaker Gerard. No real concrete comparison. Although, I’d argue Toshiro’s hax would enable him to beat both anyhow.
Also, iirc the colored manga doesn’t show Byakuya blocked V2 Gerard before people bring up that wildly inconsistent misinterpretation. The colored version shows grey dust being kicked up, not pink petals blocking. There’s also base Kenpachi knocking down Gerard, but that’s off guard for Gerard at best.
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No, that's wrong.
Second Form Gerard is equal to Bankai Kenpachi due to Miracle converting the damage and power that Bankai Kenpachi dealt to "kill" the First Transformation (cutting it in half with Bankai). This directly means that Adult Toshiro and Byakuya with Senkei and Hakuteiken scale to or above Bankai Kenpachi.
Also, we can't ignore Second Form Gerard cutting off Bankai Kenpachi's arm off. Nothing dictates nor states that Kenpachi's durability was lowered, being injured from his arm tearing off doesn't lower his overall durability, Bleach character's lose their arms every day.
So yes, Adult Toshiro and Senkei/Hakuteiken Byakuya scale to or above Bankai Kenpachi.
Excellence616
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But Kenpachi could match Hikone.
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That's CFYOW Kenpachi, not TYBW Kenpachi.
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Kenny blew off his elbow but when Gerard slams him into the ground with Hoffnung, his arm is cut off at the shoulder along with the sleeve of his shihakusho.
