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BAN-KAI! Bleach General Discussion

AppleLord said:
“Then Gerard gets a Bankai level amp on top of a Miracle Amp from all of the damage that Kenpachi inflicted on him.”

No evidence he got as strong as Bankai Kenpachi, and getting a Bankai level amp is vague and unqualified.
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I think gerard does absorbed the power he was inflicted with.

all the damage the gotei 13 put on him made him stronger than them all. Then kenpachi cutts his arm off and he then grows so stronger than base kenpachi kenpachi has to remove his eye patch and still loses.
 
Does the wiki actually treat Vollstandig as a 5x like Bankai? I remember a thread from like a year or two ago talking about it, but the profiles don't seem to reflect that
 
Jo-Smooth said:
Does the wiki actually treat Vollstandig as a 5x like Bankai? I remember a thread from like a year or two ago talking about it, but the profiles don't seem to reflect that
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No, a Vollstandig thread is in the works tho, because as per the Sternritter downgrade thread, we accept that Vollstandig functions just like Bankai. So the Bankai multiplier should apply.
 
Jo-Smooth said:
Wym no evidence he got as strong as him lmao. They were even or Gerard was superior in their previous forms, and they got similar amps. It's simple scaling. Lemme simplify it. If I'm at a 10, and you're at a 10, and then I get a 10x amp and get to 100 and stomp your 10, then you get a 10x amp, the difference between us would be the same as before. Bankai level amp isn't vague. We're not talking about VS Battle wiki standards of profiles here. Bankai is said to be a 5-10x amp, Resurreccion was stated to be similar to Bankai in terms of the amp, and Vollstandig was shown or implied to be superior to Bankai level amps. Before you say 'Bankai doesn't specifically enhance all stats but it varies between users' we saw that Letzt Stil and Vollstandig do enhance all stats and doesn't vary. And we know it also enhances their schrifts. Gerard's schrift is one that increases his strength, speed, dura etc so there's no reason to say why his stats wouldn't be enhanced.

Shikai Kenpachi and God Sized Gerard would be a 1. Kenpachi goes Bankai and gets his 10x amp. So Kenpachi would be a 10. Then he slaps up God Sized Gerard, and now Gerard goes Vollstandig. Vollstandig is said to be a superior version of Letzt Stil, which in itself let Uryu who was weaker than Base Mayuri basically one shot his Bankai. That and the Sternritters said that the shinigami had a better chance fighting the Quincy with their Bankai stolen and used against them than the had with their Bankai reclaimed vs the Vollstandig. So Gerard would be 10+ in Vollstandig. Then the Miracle Amp would boost him even higher than that.

Vollstandig + BanKen Miracle Damage Gerard > Vollstandig Gerard (Hypothetical as he never existed in Vols without the Miracle Amp) >= Bankai Kenpachi >>> God Sized Gerard >= Shikai Kenpachi

This isn't even taking into account the fact that Kenpachi doesn't even get the full 10x amp that a mastered Bankai would have and that his body can't handle his full power. And Yachiru tried to raise Kenpachi to a level where he could fight Vols Gerard, implying that the Kenpachi that just smacked him around wasn't strong enough to handle this version of Gerard. That's also not getting into the argument that Gerard's schirft's potency for damage scaling to power would be increased due to his Vols. Or that Kubo could've made Toshiro and Byakuya fight weaker versions of Gerard first and then had Kenpachi fight the stronger versions of Gerard if he wanted to portray that Kenpachi was stronger than them. He didn't only have them fight the version of Gerard that Kenpachi body couldn't handle trying to match and (potentially) one shotted him, but they also fought a form that was so superior to that form offscreen for a while without dying. And when we were shown the panel, it was just those two fighting him, not Kenpachi. The idea of Kenpachi being stronger than them is more of people's perceptions of him rather than what's been shown in front of us in the last arc. Had Adult Toshiro fought God Sized Gerard and then tapped out due to stamina or his body failing, and then Kenpachi and Byakuya went on to fight the stronger versions of Gerard, I don't think anyone would be arguing that Toshiro would be as strong as Kenpachi or Byakuya. But for some reason people do that for Kenpachi
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Gerard didn’t went Vollstandig until Kenpachi pushed him out of the city and got cut in half. Vollstandig requires to be in Vollstandig form to active and Gerard was not in it in his new body. He deactivated it. Gerard didn’t stomp Kenpachi so that example doesn’t mean anything to the scaling. We already agreed that Base Kenpachi didn’t took Gerard’s leg and was holding him down, so I don’t know where that Toshiro and Byakuya were the only ones fighting him. They should be thankful Kenpachi prevented Gerard from getting up and remain on his knees until Yhwach killed him.
 
Loyd said:
yall still arguing bout this
also any news on that bleach / loki crossover?
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Nothing. Trash picture of American Aizen and fingers cross we get a one shot manga. But I heard Disney was the one to approached SJ to promote Loki in Japan. Nothing serious.
 
Loyd said:
below it, they said thr was a collab happening two days ago on the 7/7 but im not sure what was announced.
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Imagine if they cast Tom Hiddleston as Aizen for the Netflix live action Bleach sequel. That collaboration could also be a one shot manga or maybe nothing else besides this artwork.
 
Quick question, idk if anyone has anything planned for Bleach’s speed, but shouldn’t we be able to upscale like A LOT of people to MHS+ From what I understand every character post time skip is scaling to like Mach 930 and that starts as far back as Post visord training Ichigo and HM Byakuya.

I feel like there are a lot of characters that scale faster than that and it’s only a 1.07 difference to the next tier

like take Byakuya himself for example. In his HM key he’s MHS, MHS+ when controlling his bankai, then same with post time skip even though Tsukishima stated he got faster. Then his post royal guard training key is the exact same. I feel he’s trained far to much to not gain a 1.07 increase in speed
 
Arc7Kuroi said:
Light speed TYBW thread upcoming don’t worry
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Ok sweet lol. Is it just gonna effect like the high and top tiers? If it is can you include the speed calc of the soul king creatures traveling the distance? And how people like Ikkaku could react to them. I’m pretty sure that comes out to MHS+ as well
 
Gin's Bankai is no longer a question. Speeds are divided into travel, combat, and reactions speeds. And Gin said that Mach 500 was the speed of his blade (not his speed) and he lied about it. Databook says is Mach 1000. X2.
 
AppleLord said:
Gin's Bankai is no longer a question. Speeds are divided into travel, combat, and reactions speeds. And Gin said that Mach 500 was the speed of his blade (not his speed) and he lied about it. Databook says is Mach 1000. X2.
Click to expand...
The Mach 1000 is for a specific technique with his Bankai.
 
You know in the novels it's stated is above a superficial bankai like kenpachis and toshiros. Which suggest hes more powerful than both bankai kenpachi and toshiro
 
AppleLord said:
Gerard didn’t went Vollstandig until Kenpachi pushed him out of the city and got cut in half. Vollstandig requires to be in Vollstandig form to active and Gerard was not in it in his new body. He deactivated it. Gerard didn’t stomp Kenpachi so that example doesn’t mean anything to the scaling. We already agreed that Base Kenpachi didn’t took Gerard’s leg and was holding him down, so I don’t know where that Toshiro and Byakuya were the only ones fighting him. They should be thankful Kenpachi prevented Gerard from getting up and remain on his knees until Yhwach killed him.
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What Kenpachi did was trip Vollstandig Gerard when he wasn't paying attention. It didn't really help them all that much since he was already gonna get frozen down to the bone just from touching Toshiro. And you forgot that Gerard came back to life after that in another form that was considered on a different level than the previous. That's the one that the duo fought off screen. Kenpachi wasn't holding him down at that point.

Though I've presented everything I needed for the scaling between the 4 of them, we can agree to disagree.
 
Jo-Smooth said:
What Kenpachi did was trip Vollstandig Gerard when he wasn't paying attention. It didn't really help them all that much since he was already gonna get frozen down to the bone just from touching Toshiro. And you forgot that Gerard came back to life after that in another form that was considered on a different level than the previous. That's the one that the duo fought off screen. Kenpachi wasn't holding him down at that point.

Though I've presented everything I needed for the scaling between the 4 of them, we can agree to disagree.
Click to expand...
I agree . Toshiro and Byakuya just have better showings than TYBW kenny in this fight .

Especially Byakuya, who blocked an attack from the strongest gerard ( seemingly casually ?), stated to be much stronger than anyof his previous forms.
Now , CFYOW kenny is a different story altogether.
 
byakuya also outpaced gerald to save rukia and renji didnt he? ya know for a man whos zanpakuto dont give him a buff in stats hes rather strong
 
Jo-Smooth said:
What Kenpachi did was trip Vollstandig Gerard when he wasn't paying attention. It didn't really help them all that much since he was already gonna get frozen down to the bone just from touching Toshiro. And you forgot that Gerard came back to life after that in another form that was considered on a different level than the previous. That's the one that the duo fought off screen. Kenpachi wasn't holding him down at that point.

Though I've presented everything I needed for the scaling between the 4 of them, we can agree to disagree.
Click to expand...
The last time we saw Kenpachi he was up again, holding Gerard down. That new form of Gerard was on his knees and couldn't move. So unless he couldn't regenerate his legs after Kenpachi remove them, Kenpachi was still holding him in place. He was in the same condition he went against Pernida and he was still able to fight. It makes no sense for Kenpachi to drop out of the fight off-camera without a reason that contradicts his previous showings.
 
Last edited:
If you're not paying attention you can get tripped by a small dog or child, do you think that means 1 year old timmy scales to a grown ass man?
 
Naw I’ve been table topped by a small dog before.

I was at my ex’s lake house in the south, took a step backwards doing sumn stupid prolly, her friend’s little doggo was there, I wiped out. It was quite comical
 
Arc7Kuroi said:
Naw I’ve been table topped by a small dog before.

I was at my ex’s lake house in the south, took a step backwards doing sumn stupid prolly, her friend’s little doggo was there, I wiped out. It was quite comical
Click to expand...
Don't compare a mountain and lion to a dude and a dog. The disrespect can't get any worse? Chill...
 
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