• This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.

    For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here.
  • We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.

    Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.

    Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page.
  • Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.

Anti-Monitor Downgrade

Status
Not open for further replies.
431
73
I've been on the comic boards and I've been reading comic books for a long time. One of the more popular characters is the DC Comics Anti-Monitor. Makes sense for him to be so popular after all. He was responsible for one of the most important events of DC Comics, the crisis on infinite lands or COIE in a nutshell that caused a massive change in Detective Comics. However, since the Anti-Monitor was a villain so important to people growing up, people tend to massively overestimate him, claiming it. He might stomp on guys like Infinity Gauntlet wielders or Living Tribunal and even Molecule Man.

For example, people love to claim that Anti-Monitor during COIE was Multiversal because he had destroyed Infinite Universes, but what most people tend to ignore, is that it what he actually did under an unknown amount of time was send waves of Anti-Matter into Universes which took multiple pages to actually destroy them and we know that Anti-Matter and Matter making contact means Instant destruction, and the Universes AM destroyed were later stated multiple times to be weaker than Normal Universes. When you take into account that around the time AM was destroying Universes Supergirl was able to cause him critical damage to the point where he needed to flee and even admitted that Supergirl almost destroyed him. He was also harmed by some of his minions.

People also tend to bring up his fight with Amped Spectre at the Dawn of Time, which seems like a very cool feat, until you look at the context. Anti-Monitor didn't even fight this battle with his own power, he stole the power of Several Heroes because he had exhausted his own travelling to the Dawn of Time. You also have to note that beating Spectre in that time period was no Multiversal feat given how his best feats were Universal and he couldn't even survive the Big Bang and had to flee before it. Presence also stated that Spectre could conceivably beat Anti-Monitor, but didn't use his powers properly.

And then you have Sinestro Corps War Anti-Monitor, I have seen many people make claims like he would stomp Galactus, which really don't need much to debunk, just the fact that after he was hit by the Warworld explosion he was so weak to the point where SBP was able to stomp him which was only stated to be able to destroy the Milky Way Galaxy.



Finally, there is New 52 Anti-Monitor, and although you will hear many people state that he consumes entire Universes, due to scans such as this, what he actually does is consume the Individual Planets, killing all Life and absorbing their residual energy. It's later reinforced that Anti-Monitor consumes "Universes" via consuming Individual Planets. He was also briefly matched by New 52 Darkseid who was Impressive, but still around the likes of Transcendent tiers like Thanos, SBP, Larfleeze etc.



To sum things up, AM is Very Powerful, but not as strong as many make him out to be. Hopefully, this post sheds some light on this.
 
Also according to the guy who wrote Darkseid War Anti-Monitor was actually fighting the real Darkseid in that storyline. But I guess you'll just want to downgrade Darkseid to 5-B.
 
No, Anti Monitor literally has one of the most clear cut 2-A feats in fiction
Said feat is the most iconic moment of the charcter and in general one of the most iconic DC moments, to try and downgrade it is just laugable
I’m pretty sure AM is the definition of a 2-A feat like bear minimum

And way feel like we should ignore this thread is just proof how bias San-Karrot is.
 
although I am against degradation, since AM Incon with his Brother before the Crisis, Mar novu who was empowered by infinite universes while mobius only had the energy of his Universe of anti-matter.

Mobius lost energy to travel before time, so it makes sense that he needed the energy of those heroes to recover the missing energy.

anti monitor is still 2-A

Also according to the guy who wrote Darkseid War Anti-Monitor was actually fighting the real Darkseid in that storyline.

only for curiosity

do you have a scan on this?
 
only for curiosity

do you have a scan on this?
I was on a twitter question. I normally don't hold these in any high regard and Darkseid War completely contradicts how Godhead Darkseid is supposed to work and Multiversity explicitly treats New 52 Darkseid as just an Emanation so I think the author just didn't understand Darkseid and the NEw Gods.
 
I was on a twitter question. I normally don't hold these in any high regard and Darkseid War completely contradicts how Godhead Darkseid is supposed to work and Multiversity explicitly treats New 52 Darkseid as just an Emanation so I think the author just didn't understand Darkseid and the NEw Gods.
Ok
 
I think it's very telling that no one has meaningfully engaged with the evidence or the reasoning in the OP. Being outraged by a suggestion is not a counterargument, people. Accusations of bias are not a counterargument either.
 
I think it's very telling that no one has meaningfully engaged with the evidence or the reasoning in the OP. Being outraged by a suggestion is not a counterargument, people. Accusations of bias are not a counterargument either.
I mean, I was disagreeing due to what was brought up in the Perpetua thread before it was closed. That's where I stand on it, anyways.
 
I think it's very telling that no one has meaningfully engaged with the evidence or the reasoning in the OP. Being outraged by a suggestion is not a counterargument, people. Accusations of bias are not a counterargument either.
Yeah it’s totally not because the OP had a past of complete hating of DC and Marvel and wanting the monitors to be High 3-A lol
 
Yeah it’s totally not because the OP had a past of complete hating of DC and Marvel and wanting the monitors to be High 3-A lol
Again, this is just ad-hominem. Are you able to engage with and debunk the argument and the sources? If you are, then it doesn't matter what his past is, what biases you think he may have. This should be a venue for objectively considering the comic books and what they say, and his sources are pretty thorough (even if they were taken from a reddit thread)
 
Again, this is just ad-hominem. Are you able to engage with and debunk the argument and the sources? If you are, then it doesn't matter what his past is, what biases you think he may have. This should be a venue for objectively considering the comic books and what they say, and his sources are pretty thorough (even if they were taken from a reddit thread)
I have read through it and asked for permission to share it since it is solid and backed with evidence. Saying "He took it from Reddit there before it's all invalid is indeed a genetic fallacy". Btw, have you seen my discord server?
 
Mar novu who was empowered by infinite universes while mobius
I'm just mostly curious. Does that count as a 2-A feat? Cause if not then like a key where he's not at full power might be an idea cause I've heard from other people that he's only 2-C when he fights Wally for instance.

Although then again we could probably scale him to in-universe World Forger who fought 2-A Supes. Although that might give some problems on why he didn't just nuke the multiverse immediately lol. (unless the explanation ties to the Monitor or it's an AoE fallacy?)
 
Last edited:
Pretty sure Anti Monitor was quite literally stated as a universe destroyer here
main-qimg-190c7bfd4b935e4a00935b882575ac95

This is show in CoIE that he can straight up nuke universes, so this statement isn't that far off
 
I'm just mostly curious. Does that count as a 2-A feat? Cause if not then like a key where he's not at full power might be an idea cause I've heard from other people that he's only 2-C when he fights Wally for instance.

Although then again we could probably scale him to in-universe World Forger who fought 2-A Supes.
here
 
Aware. Questioning if being powered by infinite universes is 2-A. Since like you aren't destroying or creating or even affecting these structures. (Ant also said it might not count and I can't really counter him on this)
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top