Alien x 1B debunk to possibly 1B and immesurable speed debunk

[Reiner04]

Quantitatively superior*

Shush, we are discussing 1-A Alien X.

 

[Floxiaaa]

You don't need to see, feel or perceive air yet you know it exists. So a being can be aware of the existence of higher D without perceiving it. Which Asmuth is aware of since atleast knows about the 17D space time dimensions of the Map of infinity.

No it doesn't disregard the logic of HDE. He doesn't need to understand the nature if a 26D structure. He just needs to know it exists.
Prove to me that you need 26D existance to understand how higher dimensions work. Prove it from a valid source with a link or qoute or your committing repetition fallacy.

My friend, you completely misinterpreted it. First of all, the universe is definitely not 26 dimensional. That's why we brought it up. Secondly, 26 dimensional AP is only for destroying or destroying 26 dimensional space, so it doesn't help you figure out its mechanics or how it works or how it exists. Remember, this is an unnecessary comment you made. Thirdly, what you said is against the HDE logic. So why? First of all, destroying something is not enough for you to understand what kind of entity it is, a being with larger axes than you or a being with longer and larger axes than you in the coordinate system, but that doesn't mean you will destroy it. So what I said is 26 dimensional AP≠ understanding the working mechanics of 26 dimensional space.

 

[TheShape03]

With range at that level, you don't need speed. It's how it works. But I ask you, where is it actually stated that it extends to the future and all of existence because of its speed?

Of course it needs speed, it expands through movement like an explosion and it moves through time, what more do you need?

 

[Worthless]

Yes we do that. If done by explosion that goes from one point to another, Alien X had it for recreating the entire Universe, Omnitrix had it coz explosion. So yeah, it's different than wishing things in and out of existence that does not qualify for speed feat.

Covering it with 'It's because it's an explosion' doesn't really deny the fact that it’s range rather than speed. You have it in Ben 10, where we see random aliens reacting to a void that grows larger before it engulfs them, and this same void will eventually engulf their entire universe. By using this argument, this would imply they should have MFTL+ reaction speeds.

 

[Reiner04]

Covering it with 'It's because it's an explosion' doesn't really deny the fact that it’s range rather than speed. You have it in Ben 10, where we see random aliens reacting to a void that grows larger before it engulfs them, and this same void will eventually engulf their entire universe. By using this argument, this would imply they should have MFTL+ reaction speeds.

Yes, Annihilarrgh had infinite speed for that too. We don't account Characters reacting to it coz pis.

 

[Ednaxel2]

This thread feels like it operates on a lot of mental gymnastics. Hard disagree FRA by Celestial

 

[Floxiaaa]

This thread feels like it operates on a lot of mental gymnastics. Hard disagree FRA by Celestial

Are you saying Celestial is right?

 

[Celestial_Scaler25]

My friend, you completely misinterpreted it. First of all, the universe is definitely not 26 dimensional. That's why we brought it up. Secondly, 26 dimensional AP is only for destroying or destroying 26 dimensional space, so it doesn't help you figure out its mechanics or how it works or how it exists. Remember, this is an unnecessary comment you made. Secondly, what you said is against the HDE logic. So why? First of all, destroying something is not enough for you to understand what kind of entity it is, a being with larger axes than you or a being with longer and larger axes than you in the coordinate system, but that doesn't mean you will destroy it. So what I said is 26 dimensional AP≠ understanding the working mechanics of 26 dimensional space.

Nobody ever said that the universe was 26 dimensions. Wtf told you that.

You still aren't giving evidence of needing to be higher dimensional to being able to understand how higher D works. Explain how what I said goes against HDE? Nothing on the HDE page says how you need to be higher dimensional to understand it.
Tell me where on the page does it state that you need to be higher D to understand how higher D works.

Higher-Dimensional Existence

A given object or entity is referred to as being higher-dimensional when they exist as part of a system with a number of coordinates axes greater than our own, or in layman's terms, if they possess more than three dimensions. Speaking in simple terms, a "dimension" can be considered an axis of...

vsbattles.fandom.com

 

[Hellformer]

That should be a range feat rather than a speed feat. With this logic, we could argue that anyone who can bust a universe of infinite size should have infinite speed, and/or that anyone who can destroy the past, present, and future/time itself should have immeasurable speed.

The reasoning is not universe busting, its more like the energy wave being able to traverse accross multiple temporal dimensions with expansion

 

[Floxiaaa]

Nobody ever said that the universe was 26 dimensions. Wtf told you that.

You still aren't giving evidence of needing to be higher dimensional to being able to understand how higher D works. Explain how what I said goes against HDE? Nothing on the HDE page says how you need to be higher dimensional to understand it.
Tell me where on the page does it state that you need to be higher D to understand how higher D works.

Higher-Dimensional Existence

A given object or entity is referred to as being higher-dimensional when they exist as part of a system with a number of coordinates axes greater than our own, or in layman's terms, if they possess more than three dimensions. Speaking in simple terms, a "dimension" can be considered an axis of...

vsbattles.fandom.com

First of all, I can say that he never knew dimensional mechanics. The 3D human mind has 3 axes and does not understand the structure of 26 dimensions. This is why most string theories are like this. The 3D structure of the human mind cannot make a clear interpretation of 26 dimensional space. Therefore, the expression 'probably' should come back.

 

[Worthless]

Yes, Annihilarrgh had infinite speed for that too. We don't account Characters reacting to it coz pis.

The site lists it as Immeasurable. My bad. It should be "this would imply they should have Immeasurable reaction speeds," using the same reasoning that people applied to the Omnitrix for reacting to the creation of the time stream. There is no difference except that it expands not only to the present. And what really stops me from saying it's PIS for the Omnitrix as well? I could say the same thing about them reacting to it because the plot allows them to.

 

[Ednaxel2]

Are you saying Celestial is right?

Yes

 

[Celestial_Scaler25]

First of all, I can say that he never knew dimensional mechanics. The 3D human mind has 3 axes and does not understand the structure of 26 dimensions. This is why most string theories are like this. The 3D structure of the human mind cannot make a clear interpretation of 26 dimensional space. Therefore, the expression 'probably' should come back.

I asked for proof of this multiple times now. We you humans can't perceive them but we know they exist based off how the world works around us. The same goes here. Asmuth might not be able to perceive higher but he knows they exist.

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

Since you are the one in charge, I will answer you, there are 26 known dimensions, in the words of the Nalgians, but we only assume and do not prove that there is a qualitative superiority in the nature of these dimensions or that there is a hierarchy, so alien X should Possibly be 1B, not 1B contrary to the current profile.

Qualitive superiority has no bearing for tiers under 1-A.

 

[Celestial_Scaler25]

This thread feels like it operates on a lot of mental gymnastics. Hard disagree FRA by Celestial

Are you saying Celestial is right?

Yes

Ednaxel2=

 

[Floxiaaa]

I asked for proof of this multiple times now. We you humans can't perceive them but we know they exist based off how the world works around us. The same goes here. Asmuth might not be able to perceive higher but he knows they exist.

I don't need to prove it. If you ask me why, I'll explain. Can you prove to me that a 3D is an interpretation of 26D space and that this interpretation is correct? Of course, these are just theories. It can't go beyond the theory. The pictures you sent are also just theories. And there is no limitation. Does it mean that it can visualize the 26th dimension because it can visualize the 6th dimension? As I said. In your opinion, the things you think are evidence are not evidence.

 

[Floxiaaa]

Qualitive superiority has no bearing for tiers under 1-A.

Quantitative hierarchy must be proven for this situation.

 

[TheShape03]

Are you still with that thing about Azmuth not being able to understand higher dimensions because he is not a higher-dimensional being? xdd.

First of all, I can say that he never knew dimensional mechanics. The 3D human mind has 3 axes and does not understand the structure of 26 dimensions. This is why most string theories are like this. The 3D structure of the human mind cannot make a clear interpretation of 26 dimensional space. Therefore, the expression 'probably' should come back.

Except for the fact that this is a ******* cartoon where the same guy created an artifact that transforms a human into a alien whose body is a 4D dimension. To say that he doesn't understand higher dimensions is to ignore all the things that have been shown in the series, there is a lot of 4D technology created by 3-dimensional beings. What prevents a three-dimensional character from properly understanding higher dimensions, in a cartoon?

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

Quantitative hierarchy must be proven for this situation.

Not really. The mention that 26 dimensional axes is enough.

 

[Celestial_Scaler25]

I don't need to prove it. If you ask me why, I'll explain. Can you prove to me that a 3D is an interpretation of 26D space and that this interpretation is correct? Of course, these are just theories. It can't go beyond the theory. The pictures you sent are also just theories. And there is no limitation. Does it mean that it can visualize the 26th dimension because it can visualize the 6th dimension? As I said. In your opinion, the things you think are evidence are not evidence.

Higher-Dimensional Existence

A given object or entity is referred to as being higher-dimensional when they exist as part of a system with a number of coordinates axes greater than our own, or in layman's terms, if they possess more than three dimensions. Speaking in simple terms, a "dimension" can be considered an axis of...

vsbattles.fandom.com

Where on this HDE page does it state that a lower D being can't know about the existence of higher D or is limited in perception based of their dimensionality. Where? Asmuth doesn't need to perceive higher D to be able know of it's existence. As us humans. We know that higher D exists but we can't perceive it or know what it looks like but we know it exists. Asmuth might not be able to perceive higher D but we knows of it's existence.

 

[Floxiaaa]

Are you still with that thing about Azmuth not being able to understand higher dimensions because he is not a higher-dimensional being? xdd.

Except for the fact that this is a ******* cartoon where the same guy created an artifact that transforms a human into a alien whose body is a 4D dimension. To say that he doesn't understand higher dimensions is to ignore all the things that have been shown in the series, there is a lot of 4D technology created by 3-dimensional beings. What prevents a three-dimensional character from properly understanding higher dimensions, in a cartoon?

Bro this is No limits Fallacy

 

[Floxiaaa]

Higher-Dimensional Existence

A given object or entity is referred to as being higher-dimensional when they exist as part of a system with a number of coordinates axes greater than our own, or in layman's terms, if they possess more than three dimensions. Speaking in simple terms, a "dimension" can be considered an axis of...

vsbattles.fandom.com

Where on this HDE page does it state that a lower D being can't know about the existence of higher D or is limited in perception based of their dimensionality. Where? Asmuth doesn't need to perceive higher D to be able know of it's existence. As us humans. We know that higher D exists but we can't perceive it or know what it looks like but we know it exists. Asmuth might not be able to perceive higher D but we knows of it's existence.

All of this will remain theoretical, my friend. A 26-dimensional being or higher can perceive the exact mechanism of a 26-dimensional structure.

 

[Celestial_Scaler25]

Quantitative hierarchy must be proven for this situation.

No. Just higher dimensional qualitative superiority via size.
Tier 1: Higher Infinity
Characters whose degree of power extends to cosmological constructs beyond those above. This varies from higher-dimensional constructs infinitely exceeding those of 4 dimensions, to characters who transcend the conventional notion of numerical dimensions, both countably and uncountably infinite, up to characters who wholly surpass quantitative differences in size.

Low 1-C: Low Complex Multiverse level
Characters or objects who can significantly affect, create and/or destroy higher-dimensional structures that are one uncountably infinite level[note 2] above Low 2-C structures. In ordinary distribution, this corresponds to R^5 (5-dimensional real coordinate space).

Equivalently, this tier can be reached by affecting/creating/destroying/embodying an uncountably infinite number of universes (More specifically, as many universes as there are real numbers)

1-C: Complex Multiverse level
Characters or objects who can significantly affect, create and/or destroy higher-dimensional structures that are two to five uncountably levels above Low 2-C structures. In ordinary distribution, this corresponds to R^6 to R^9 (6 to 9-dimensional real coordinate space)

High 1-C: High Complex Multiverse level
Characters or objects who can significantly affect, create and/or destroy higher-dimensional structures that are six to seven uncountably infinite levels above Low 2-C structures. In ordinary distribution, this corresponds to R^10 to R^11 (10 to 11-dimensional real coordinate space)

1-B: Hyperverse level
Characters or objects who can significantly affect, create and/or destroy higher-dimensional structures that are at least 8 uncountably infinite levels above Low 2-C structures (12-dimensional real coordinate space, in ordinary distribution), up to any higher finite number of dimensions.

High 1-B: High Hyperverse level
Characters or objects who can significantly affect, create and/or destroy infinite-dimensional space. Characters who can meddle with spaces whose number of dimensions is uncountably infinite should have a "+" modifier in their Attack Potency section (High Hyperverse level+).

 

[TheShape03]

Bro this is No limits Fallacy

I didn't say that they can understand higher dimensions to infinite limits or any such nonsense. I SAID that the 3D beings comprehend higher dimensions in the series, because they create technology capable of affecting multiple 4D dimensions. Azmuth himself creates technology capable of turning a 3D human into a 4D alien that literally has a dimension inside of it.

 

[Celestial_Scaler25]

Are you still with that thing about Azmuth not being able to understand higher dimensions because he is not a higher-dimensional being? xdd.

Except for the fact that this is a ******* cartoon where the same guy created an artifact that transforms a human into a alien whose body is a 4D dimension. To say that he doesn't understand higher dimensions is to ignore all the things that have been shown in the series, there is a lot of 4D technology created by 3-dimensional beings. What prevents a three-dimensional character from properly understanding higher dimensions, in a cartoon?

Bro this is No limits Fallacy

No it's not a NLF indicates that a character has no limit based of not showing any limit. This just shows Azmuth can make powerfull enough tech to affect higher D. Indicating that he knows about higher.

All of this will remain theoretical, my friend. A 26-dimensional being or higher can perceive the exact mechanism of a 26-dimensional structure.

No it doesn't you couldn't even give me evidence that IQ is limit by dimensionality by quoting from the HDE page you said my claim contradicted. You don't need to perceive air to know it exists. Just like you don't need to perceive higher D to know it exists.

 

[Floxiaaa]

No it's not a NLF indicates that a character has no limit based of not showing any limit. This just shows Azmuth can make powerfull enough tech to affect higher D. Indicating that he knows about higher.

No it doesn't you couldn't even give me evidence that IQ is limit by dimensionality by quoting from the HDE page you said my claim contradicted. You don't need to perceive air to know it exists. Just like you don't need to perceive higher D to know it exists.

A 3-dimensional being's description of a 26-dimensional space and its mechanics will only remain theoretical.

 

[Floxiaaa]

I didn't say that they can understand higher dimensions to infinite limits or any such nonsense. I SAID that the 3D beings comprehend higher dimensions in the series, because they create technology capable of affecting multiple 4D dimensions. Azmuth himself creates technology capable of turning a 3D human into a 4D alien that literally has a dimension inside of it.

Just because a 3D being does something 4D doesn't mean it will describe 26 dimensions.

 

[TheShape03]

Just because a 3D being does something 4D doesn't mean it will describe 26 dimensions.

By your logic, a three-dimensional being cannot understand higher dimensions, the fact that they can create 4D technology proves that they can, and blows your argument out of the water.

A 3-dimensional being's description of a 26-dimensional space and its mechanics will only remain theoretical.

Ban her from the solar system.

 

[Lloydblitzed]

Just because a 3D being does something 4D doesn't mean it will describe 26 dimensions.

What the heck is that reasoning

 

[LordDestroit10K]

Shush, we are discussing 1-A Alien X.

That makes much more sense than this thread lol

 

[Celestial_Scaler25]

A 3-dimensional being's description of a 26-dimensional space and its mechanics will only remain theoretical.

Proof. Give actual evidence. From a site rather than your own opinion. Preferably from this wiki or an actual intellectual site. We humans can't perceive higher D but we know they exist. Same with Asmuth. He straight up admitted that he atleast know about 17D of spacetime in prior video.

 

[Hellformer]

2 minute silence for the braincells of all those who are countering the arguments from the side of OP

 

[Lloydblitzed]

A 3-dimensional being's description of a 26-dimensional space and its mechanics will only remain theoretical.

Due to what? He has shown understandings of higher dimensions before....

 

[Lloydblitzed]

2 minute silence for the braincells of all those who are countering the arguments from the side of OP

Honestly I feel like a discussion rule against that is necessary. OP/his supports are clearly unable to explain his points well asw

 

[Celestial_Scaler25]

Ban her from the solar system.

MULTIVERSE*

 

[Floxiaaa]

It is obvious that if I answer these questions, the thread will get very long. Therefore, I will stop answering you.

 

[Hellformer]

It is obvious that if I answer these questions, the thread will get very long. Therefore, I will stop answering you.

This makes more sense than any of the points you made earlier. Including the reasoning of the OP

 

[Lloydblitzed]

It is obvious that if I answer these questions, the thread will get very long. Therefore, I will stop answering you.

*You can't answer it, and you will likely pull out other Association Fallacies

 

[Floxiaaa]

This makes more sense than any of the points you made earlier. Including the reasoning of the OP

I have enough arguments to drop 1-B. I just don't want to bother with that.

 

[Celestial_Scaler25]

It is obvious that if I answer these questions, the thread will get very long. Therefore, I will stop answering you.

Cause you keep committing repetition fallacy and ignoring my request for proof of IQ being limited by dimensionality.