About Novel Kars and Dio

[Yobo_Blue]

@Yobo
Kars never encountered GER. And I don't remember DIO stopping time against him. Will recheck the scene to make sure.

Yup, this is getting F I S H Y.

No, seriously.

 

[Walking_Strawman]

It was originally only 6-B with Low 2-C hax most when it was first created. Then it got progressively more wanked.
You also need to check out Heaven Overture DIO, I think that's wanked too.

what part do you see as particularly wanked?

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

Lephyr gets more awesome with every transaction I have with him. Thanks for the scans ovo.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Yeah, I remembered correctly. Even better, Giorno wasn't even trying to fight, so DIO's resistances and speed? Welp, you know how this goes.

 

[Yobo_Blue]

Damn.

BTW, why isn't j-man here?

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Anything else you guys want me to check? I'm planning on full-on rereading it anyway for the fifth time now. ovo

I've already covered my personal issues with the page.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Lephyr gets more awesome with every transaction I have with him. Thanks for the scans ovo.

Aww, thanks!~

 

[DMUA]

Damn.

BTW, why isn't j-man here?

He posted one comment and noped out.

 

[Yobo_Blue]

@DMUA

this is gonna be one of those revisions, isn't it?

 

[DMUA]

Likely.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

This is what was used to justify Kars surviving as a disembodied soul. Do I even need to explain?

 

[DodoNova2]

Kars op Time Stop is Debunked?

 

[DMUA]

Okay, a bit of a misunderstanding on my part about the "Universe kaboom" thing.

 

[Walking_Strawman]

So the universal durability comes from surviving the big crunch then

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

And why should we believe there is said singularity when this was never mentioned in the novel? Why should we use this specific detail from the manga when the novel ignores it entirely?

Edit: BTW, while I understand why J-Man wants to avoid the debate, it would be infinitely better if he just states his argument here. He was the one that got Kars upgraded, and resorting to argue it outside the thread that is questioning it it's... Not helping him, in any case.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

Someone should likely make a separate "JORGE JOESTAR Downgrades" thread.

 

[DodoNova2]

@LephyrTheRevanchist Does Kars have 36 souls? I heard this somewhere

@Dragon it's your role lol

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Someone should likely make a separate "JORGE JOESTAR Downgrades" thread.

I will do so when i read the novel

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

@LephyrTheRevanchist Does Kars have 36 souls? I heard this somewhere

No



Edit:

I correct myself, in the literal next page he says that the 36 souls are part of him.

 

[DodoNova2]

yeah, thanks for your answer, i will avoid derail the thread

 

[Yobo_Blue]

I'm almost afraid to ask, but what about understanding?

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

You mean that Power Mimicry he has?

 

[DMUA]

BTW, while I understand why J-Man wants to avoid the debate, it would be infinitely better if he just states his argument here. He was the one that got Kars upgraded, and resorting to argue it outside the thread that is questioning it it's... Not helping him, in any case.

He didn't ask me to be his spokesperson. I just asked him for input and he was like "I ain't crawling in that hole, but it's the case because...."

I mean, does the novel necessarily contradict the big crunch being involved?

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

@Yobo

That one is correct, lol. Though we should stop the derail. Let us wait for when Weekly reads the novel and make the thread.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Oh no dont wait for me Lephyr, i'll be reading it but you know what yore talking about so feel free to keep talking, i'll give my input when i finish the story

 

[Yobo_Blue]

Welp, at least we know that's stayIng

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

@DMAU

I posted the three instances where MiH is used in the whole novel. There is no mention or description remotely similar to a Big Crunch. They simply say "the universe died". While this doesn't contradict that a Big Crunch did occured, it also does not support it. Ignoring the fact that MiH fuctions very differently in the novel as well. In mere seconds it could cycle through 36 universes. What happened to eventual acceleration? The fact that in the manga it transports people to the new universe created and here it doesn't. Yet we should use a specific detail that is ignored in the three mentions of said power. I don't know what may others agree, but I support a downgrade.

 

[DMUA]

Hmm.

Really in the end we don't know. It could retain the property of big crunching the universe, it could blow it up. But, there's no evidence of it not crunching, so I think I'll stick with Low 2-C for now.

Though it'll be awhile before I actually get to read Jorge Joestar as I always want to buy the work I'm reading.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

If there's no evidence to support it we cannot treat it as such

 

[DMUA]

Well.

There's the evidence of the fact that it's still Made in Heaven, and while it's effect is altered, it still follows the same concept of the universe getting reset.

And there is no stronger evidence of contradiction, so....

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Just finally read a bit about the Big Crunch in wikipedia. It's impossible that MiH triggers one.

"Recent experimental evidence suggests that the expansion of the universe is not being slowed down by gravity but rather accelerating. However, since the nature of the dark energy that is postulated to drive the acceleration is unknown, a big crunch is still possible, although not observationally supported as of today."

"The idea behind the theory was originally, that the expansion of the universe was linked to the energy released in the Big Bang, therefore the outward speed of the matter would decrease over time due to gravity (mutual attraction). This would act as ballast and would eventually lead to a halt of the expansion. As matter attracts and there is no matter beyond the maximum expansion point, eventually all matter would begin to travel inwards again, accelerating as time passes."

As shown in past scans, the novel explains that MiH bends space-time by controlling Gravity.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

But I did find that the Arrow house that Kars crashed through is not the Cube House(which is the living universe tesseract house)

Was meaning to comment about this but forgot. The Arrow House is in fact the cube house. The problem is that, while it has it's own space time and can bend it by making whoever falls into it accelerate to infinity, it is not a literal tesseract nor is it universe size. Kars crashing through it's walls should be the same as Vegeta blowing up the Room of Spirit and Time; simple hax.

 

[Dienomite22]

From the translation I read it explicitly states that the Arrow House is unrelated to the Cube House but the Cube House can lead to the Arrow House(or the other way around) assumedly through a portal and the Cube House was stated to be a tesseract and described, illustrated, and functions like a tesseract from what I saw.

EDIT: The Arrow House only shares one room with the Cube House is what the translation says.Other than that there are no other links between the two.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

@Dienomite

Sugimoto Reimi is the Cube House herself, and look at what she states:

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Oh, and it can't be a literal tesseract because it doesn't have four dimensions. Eight rooms (liked through space) form it's structure so it can perform it's role: Accelerating objects to infinity so they can travel through time.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Context and scans really do change everything

 

[DodoNova2]

excuse me, I do not know at all but what will change for the profile?

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

@Nova

• Get rid of resistance to willpower manipulation and acausality from DIO's and Kars' profile

• Get rid of infinite speed

• Both downgraded to 6-B

• Getting rid of Kars' resistance to menger sponge

Edit: Oh, and Kars' disembodied soul thing would have to go, too.

 

[Dienomite22]

@LephyTheRevanchist

What about the statement that says that the Arrow/Cube House contains its own space-time?