A Hunter X Hunter calculation blog

[Shmeatywerbenmanjenson]

I also used the official colored version, which makes the calculation much more clearer too. I'll just get someone to evaluate it.

Man... Can't we just stop making 1 million different calcs for the Youpi feat. I already have one that has been acknowledged by DMUA and I went and measured by the pixel. No offence to you man, but it just seems redundant at this point.

 

[TioKill]

Man... Can't we just stop making 1 million different calcs for the Youpi feat. I already have one that has been acknowledged by DMUA and I went and measured by the pixel. No offence to you man, but it just seems redundant at this point.

Not only are you using a worse scan, but it's also using the incorrect height. I don't mind, but I'll stick with my blog, as it explains everything the CGM reading it needs to know. And it only contains the accepted scan as opposed to unnecessary new methods.

 

[Hk1488]

Anime.

Also, at that angle, that calculation would be impossible. We don't know where the celling would be relative to the diameter.

Using the anime as reference is pretty weird with 1 minute summed up in a few episodes.

And yes it is possible. We have multiple frames of characters like knuckle at the edge of the crater giving us an almost perfect reference

 

[Shmeatywerbenmanjenson]

Not only are you using a worse scan, but it's also using the incorrect height. I don't mind, but I'll stick with my blog, as it explains everything the CGM reading it needs to know. And it only contains the accepted scan as opposed to unnecessary new methods.

Actually my scan is higher quality, go take a look. Also it makes no difference whether it is colored or not it's still the same size. Also the height your using, while correctly scaled, is invalid due to the killua anime scene with youpi which is even more accurate

 

[Hk1488]

It was the conclusion reached on the original thread. Because the depth often seemed inconsistent

I was there in the original thread. I'm pretty sure we argued cause the radius was inconsistent not the height

 

[TioKill]

I was there in the original thread. I'm pretty sure we argued cause the radius was inconsistent not the height

I have updated the height. The 0.25x is incorrect by simply scaling that height to a line and putting it in the crater, it becomes too high.

 

[Hk1488]

Alternatively you could use these shots:

 

[Shmeatywerbenmanjenson]

I was there in the original thread. I'm pretty sure we argued cause the radius was inconsistent not the height

The original calc outlines why they used the 0.25 value. Take a look because that's not changing

 

[Hk1488]

The original calc outlines why they used the 0.25 value. Take a look because that's not changing

I'm pretty sure it's only an assumption. No backup at all.

 

[TioKill]

The original calc outlines why they used the 0.25 value. Take a look because that's not changing

That is absolutely changing. First off, from I can tell, craters have been updated, the new accepted value is between 0.1 to 0.2, with an average of 0.18x

Second, 0.25x is wanked. If a crater is 1086px in diameter, the height would be 271px, which is absolutely not correct.

Even a regular member can look at this and immediately tell it's inaccurate.

 

[TioKill]

Yes, it has been decided that the ratio is just between 0.1 to 0.2x, we're not using 0.25x

https://vsbattles.com/threads/official-calculations-discussion-thread.123478/post-5126048

 

[Shmeatywerbenmanjenson]

That is absolutely changing. First off, from I can tell, craters have been updated, the new accepted value is between 0.1 to 0.2, with an average of 0.18x

Second, 0.25x is wanked. If a crater is 1086px in diameter, the height would be 271px, which is absolutely not correct.

Even a regular member can look at this and immediately tell it's inaccurate.

Once again you didn't listen to what I said. It was already decided in the THREAD LINKED IN THE ORIGINAL CALCULATION that 0.25 is the go-to for crater created by explosions. The 0.18 values you are getting are for impact craters.

https://vsbattles.com/threads/depth-of-craters-formed-from-explosions.122747/

 

[CloverDragon03]

That is absolutely changing. First off, from I can tell, craters have been updated, the new accepted value is between 0.1 to 0.2, with an average of 0.18x

Second, 0.25x is wanked. If a crater is 1086px in diameter, the height would be 271px, which is absolutely not correct.

Even a regular member can look at this and immediately tell it's inaccurate.

The standard is that the depth of a crater caused by an explosion is 0.25 * diameter

 

[Antvasima]

Tell me here when you have finished with your new calculation blog, and I should send a notification to the involved calc group members (Clover, DMUA, and Damage), and possibly a few others, please.

 

[Shmeatywerbenmanjenson]

Tell me here when you have finished with your new calculation blog, and I should send a notification to the involved calc group members (Clover, DMUA, and Damage), and possibly a few others, please.

I don't know if you were referring to me or Tio but I have finished it and am in the process of making a new thread for it. I really hate to be annoying and make 20 million re-calcs but I believe there is legitimate reasons for them. Let me know if you would prefer to make a new thread or to continue on this one. I can list my reasons if need be.

 

[Antvasima]

I think that we can probably continue here if you write an explanation post that I can quote for the benefit of the calc group members, so they can quickly get a good idea of what is going on here.

 

[TioKill]

The standard is that the depth of a crater caused by an explosion is 0.25 * diameter

We can see this is inaccurate by looking at the pixelscaling I made with the 0.25 assumption.

 

[TioKill]

Once again you didn't listen to what I said. It was already decided in the THREAD LINKED IN THE ORIGINAL CALCULATION that 0.25 is the go-to for crater created by explosions. The 0.18 values you are getting are for impact craters.

https://vsbattles.com/threads/depth-of-craters-formed-from-explosions.122747/

And you completely ignore the visual fact that 0.25x is simply not correct, it goes way past the diameter line.

 

[Shmeatywerbenmanjenson]

I think that we can probanly continue here if you write an explanation post that I can quote for the benefit of the calc group members, so they can quickly get a good idea of what is going on here.

Very well. First of all the original calc does not or at least leaves no indication that the full crater was actually pixel scaled. The scan we have cuts off part of the crater. While normally this is not too big of a deal, the cm per pixel values in this calc are quite big so even being off by 10 pixels results in differences in the tens of kilotons.


Here is the picture in question

My second reason is how they found the height. It was decided in the original thread that since Youpi's height fluctuated so much that using the anime for finding height was allowed. They did just that and used a random person to find his height.



Here is that.
The problem is that they assume this man's height instead of using a separate scene where we see Youpi's height compared to Killua. Who DOES have an established height. I believe this to be better because it requires no height assumptions and is set up in order for you to see the size difference.



Here is the scene. Ignore the pixel scaling.


Anyways I applied all the changes in my new blog right here https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:Shmeatywerbenmanjenson/Re-calc_Of_Youpi's_Rage_Blast

 

[CloverDragon03]

We can see this is inaccurate by looking at the pixelscaling I made with the 0.25 assumption.

That doesn't work because the angle of the shot is such that the height will be a bit weird to pixel scale. Hence, the standard assumption is better

 

[TioKill]

Very well. First of all the original calc does not or at least leaves no indication that the full crater was actually pixel scaled. The scan we have cuts off part of the crater. While normally this is not too big of a deal, the cm per pixel values in this calc are quite big so even being off by 10 pixels results in differences in the tens of kilotons.


Here is the picture in question

My second reason is how they found the height. It was decided in the original thread that since Youpi's height fluctuated so much that using the anime for finding height was allowed. They did just that and used a random person to find his height.



Here is that.
The problem is that they assume this man's height instead of using a separate scene where we see Youpi's height compared to Killua. Who DOES have an established height. I believe this to be better because it requires no height assumptions and is set up in order for you to see the size difference.



Here is the scene. Ignore the pixel scaling.


Anyways I applied all the changes in my new blog right here https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:Shmeatywerbenmanjenson/Re-calc_Of_Youpi's_Rage_Blast

The man would be 2.25m tall if Youpi's height is to be scaled to Killua.

Unless we believe this random board game master is somehow Lebron James, this height is not correct in the slightest. The proportions and his height compared to average sized character like Meruem and Neferpitou also contradicts this.

The average japanese male assumption is better.

Also, for the record, Killua's height comes from a databook whose heights have been contradicted by the manga before, with Hisoka being 1.83m in said databook, but "over 1.9m" in the manga.

That doesn't work because the angle of the shot is such that the height will be a bit weird to pixel scale. Hence, the standard assumption is better

That is widly incorrect, we're at barely at a 50° degree angle from the ground, no amount of deviation will make the diameter-horizon appear half the height of the crater, for the offset from the center to be so great, you'd need something close to 90°. It's visibly not 25 meters tall, characters are not that far off from it too, You could say we could fit 2 or 3 Youpi's there, but absolutely not 9 or 10.

 

[CloverDragon03]

That is widly incorrect, we're at barely at a 50° degree angle from the ground, no amount of deviation will make the diameter-horizon appear half the height of the crater, for the offset from the center to be so great, you'd need something close to 90°. It's visibly not 25 meters tall, characters are not that far off from it too, You could say we could fit 2 or 3 Youpi's there, but absolutely not 9 or 10.

"We're at barely a 50 degree angle from the ground" Based on what? Use facts, not personal headcanon

 

[Shmeatywerbenmanjenson]

The man would be 2.25m tall if Youpi's height is to be scaled to Killua.

Unless we believe this random board game master is somehow Lebron James, this height is not correct in the slightest. The proportions and his height compared to average sized character like Meruem and Neferpitou also contradicts this.

The average japanese male assumption is better.

Also, for the record, Killua's height comes from a databook whose heights have been contradicted by the manga before, with Hisoka being 1.83m in said databook, but "over 1.9m" in the manga.

Yeah the databooks were off by less than 10 cm, I don't see this as a reason to completely invalidate established character heights.
Also applying your method to literally any character in the anime would result in inflated heights, that's just how it works. Next thing your gonna do is find some random frame where Hisoka is shorter than he should be and state that "Hisoka cannot be 190 cm". The comparison to killua is the best thing we have there is no debate on it. You trying to invalidate that by pointing out the anime's slight height inconsistency does not change that.

 

[TioKill]

Yeah the databooks were off by-

The amount of centimeters the databook is off is not a relevant factor on this. The information itself is inaccurate, it's indication that the manga does not consider the heights there too seriously. It's not "consistently" incorrect either, Killua is not solidly 158cm, and that's just a fact.

Also applying your method to literally any character in the anime would result in inflated heights, that's just how it works.

What do I say to this? It's simply not true. Using an average height in a reasonable panel doesn't inflate the results at all. Using Killua's unreliable height led to problems, so we're not going to use it.

Next thing your gonna do is find some random frame where Hisoka is shorter than he should be and state that "Hisoka cannot be 190 cm".

Bro, if you don't shut this silly stuff down...

Hisoka being over 190cm is objective canon, stated in the manga, directly contradicting the same databook you want to use. I can't have an opinion on it, if he's 190cm, he's 190cm.

The comparison to killua is the best thing we have there is no debate on it.

Trying to shut down a debate is a sign you can't possibly win it.

No, Killua's height isn't even canon technically. The same databook also has inaccurate information about the character's birthdays. The info there is simply not reliable.

Again, you ignore the problems even in the anime that Killua's height brought.

You trying to invalidate that by pointing out the anime's slight height inconsistency does not change that.

"slight height inconsistency".

Oh, so you're allowed to just ignore this glaring problem and assess which end is more correct based on your personal headcanon? No. We're not using Killua's unreliable height for such important feat.

 

[TioKill]

"We're at barely a 50 degree angle from the ground" Based on what? Use facts, not personal headcanon

Let 0° be a straight view from the ground at the creater, and 90° be a panned out shot on the very top of the crater, from above.

The shot in question is just barely closer to a top view than a ground view, thus, 50°. The angle is not altering the height-diameter relationship by a factor of 2, that's ridiculous.

 

[Shmeatywerbenmanjenson]

The amount of centimeters the databook is off is not a relevant factor on this. The information itself is inaccurate, it's indication that the manga does not consider the heights there too seriously. It's not "consistently" incorrect either, Killua is not solidly 158cm, and that's just a fact.


What do I say to this? It's simply not true. Using an average height in a reasonable panel doesn't inflate the results at all. Using Killua's unreliable height led to problems, so we're not going to use it.

Bro, if you don't shut this silly stuff down...

Hisoka being over 190cm is objective canon, stated in the manga, directly contradicting the same databook you want to use. I can't have an opinion on it, if he's 190cm, he's 190cm.

Trying to shut down a debate is a sign you can't possibly win it.

No, Killua's height isn't even canon technically. The same databook also has inaccurate information about the character's birthdays. The info there is simply not reliable.

Again, you ignore the problems even in the anime that Killua's height brought.

"slight height inconsistency".

Oh, so you're allowed to just ignore this glaring problem and assess which end is more correct based on your personal headcanon? No. We're not using Killua's unreliable height for such important feat.

Buddy your the one trying to invalidate a character's established height due to pixel scaling. Doesn't matter Null point, I'm pretty sure there's a word for this type of fallacy but I can't remember it. Your trying to invalidate an established height of a character because a character who doesn't have an established height is taller than you expect. That's not happening, even if the guidebook was wrong about Hisoka's height it's still written by Togashi himself and all heights are cannon until proven otherwise. Id also like to point out that the average height of a 14 yo boy is around killua's height 162 cm. When you objectively prove that all height's listed in an OFFICIAL handbook written by the author himself is when you win this debate.

 

[TioKill]

Buddy your the one trying to invalidate a character's established height due to pixel scaling. Doesn't matter Null point, I'm pretty sure there's a word for this type of fallacy but I can't remember it. Your trying to invalidate an established height of a character because a character who doesn't have an established height is taller than you expect. That's not happening, even if the guidebook was wrong about Hisoka's height it's still written by Togashi himself and all heights are cannon until proven otherwise. Id also like to point out that the average height of a 14 yo boy is around killua's height 162 cm. When you objectively prove that all height's listed in an OFFICIAL handbook written by the author himself is when you win this debate.

ESTABLISHED? No.

The databook's information is not taken into account in the canon.

Hisoka's height is established.
Gon's age is established.
Killua's age is established.
These were stated in canon, undoubtful, irreversible manga pages not corrected in their volume release. That's what established information means. NOT a statement in a book that has been contradicted three times in the past arcs like Togashi isn't even taking these informations at face value.


The pixelscaling issue is just the nail in the coffin. You're not going to just ignore the incorrect height because of this terrible book. We're not using it.


Taller than what I expected? What are you even saying, now you're trying to validate the mistake. Look at this guy's appearances alongside Meruem, who is consistently portrayed as 169cm by comparing to average characters. Stop twisting the truth or you'll suddenly try and say everyone in the show is 2.2m tall just so your terrible pixelscaling can pass.


You did not prove anything, you just stomped your feet and yelled "it's valid" on top of your lungs.


Killua's height is from an unreliable, disconsidered databook.

Killua's height constitutes into problems when comparing Youpi to any other character.

It's not valid. You're not convincing me to use this terrible databook for the sake of your convenience.
In fact, I can prove that Youpi being 3.2m is the outlier in his height, he is CONSISTENTLY portrayed as 2.5m even if we use the shitty databook.

 

[Shmeatywerbenmanjenson]

ESTABLISHED? No.

The databook's information is not taken into account in the canon.

Hisoka's height is established.
Gon's age is established.
Killua's age is established.
These were stated in canon, undoubtful, irreversible manga pages not corrected in their volume release. That's what established information means. NOT a statement in a book that has been contradicted three times in the past arcs like Togashi isn't even taking these informations at face value.


The pixelscaling issue is just the nail in the coffin. You're not going to just ignore the incorrect height because of this terrible book. We're not using it.


Taller than what I expected? What are you even saying, now you're trying to validate the mistake. Look at this guy's appearances alongside Meruem, who is consistently portrayed as 169cm by comparing to average characters. Stop twisting the truth or you'll suddenly try and say everyone in the show is 2.2m tall just so your terrible pixelscaling can pass.


You did not prove anything, you just stomped your feet and yelled "it's valid" on top of your lungs.


Killua's height is from an unreliable, disconsidered databook.

Killua's height constitutes into problems when comparing Youpi to any other character.

It's not valid. You're not convincing me to use this terrible databook for the sake of your convenience.
In fact, I can prove that Youpi being 3.2m is the outlier in his height, he is CONSISTENTLY portrayed as 2.5m even if we use the shitty databook.

I don't know if you've ever heard of something called secondary cannon, but it's a thing here and we use it unless it is directly contradicted by the primary canon.
Like it or not that book is Secondary cannon therefore we take what is in it as the truth until proven otherwise, that's how it works. Also weird how you've suddenly become the author and can confidently say that it is not taken into the canon based on your words alone.

Also your saying youpi being 3.2 meters is hard to believe???



Here are multiple height shots we get from the manga and they all put him around the 10 ft mark if that's what your after. 3.2 meters is NOT outlandish in the slightest.

 

[Hk1488]

That doesn't work because the angle of the shot is such that the height will be a bit weird to pixel scale. Hence, the standard assumption is better

Yeah but that's why I provided scans that just blatantly show the height of the crater

 

[Hk1488]

Yeah the databooks were off by less than 10 cm, I don't see this as a reason to completely invalidate established character heights.
Also applying your method to literally any character in the anime would result in inflated heights, that's just how it works. Next thing your gonna do is find some random frame where Hisoka is shorter than he should be and state that "Hisoka cannot be 190 cm". The comparison to killua is the best thing we have there is no debate on it. You trying to invalidate that by pointing out the anime's slight height inconsistency does not change that.

Bro you are simply saying that the other version of the feat is inaccurate for NO reason.

1. TioKill showed that the anime is inconsistent with the sizes too by giving a perfect example.

2. It's pretty obvious your only reasoning for the assumption that it's an average Japanese being wrong is that it would get lower results when you try to advocate for the assumption the depth is . 25 times the diameter when actual scaling contradicts that

3. Why scale the crater based on a character who doesn't have an official height. I literally showed a scan with a Direct comparison to killua. What's the point in first scaling killua to youpi than youpi to the crater rather than just killua to the crater.

 

[Hk1488]

Buddy your the one trying to invalidate a character's established height due to pixel scaling. Doesn't matter Null point, I'm pretty sure there's a word for this type of fallacy but I can't remember it. Your trying to invalidate an established height of a character because a character who doesn't have an established height is taller than you expect. That's not happening, even if the guidebook was wrong about Hisoka's height it's still written by Togashi himself and all heights are cannon until proven otherwise. Id also like to point out that the average height of a 14 yo boy is around killua's height 162 cm. When you objectively prove that all height's listed in an OFFICIAL handbook written by the author himself is when you win this debate.

Yeah then why do you use an unofficial height(youpi) rather than killua with an official height. Kinda contradicting yourself there

 

[Antvasima]

Tell me here when you have finished with your new calculation blog, and I should send a notification to the involved calc group members (Clover, DMUA, and Damage), and possibly a few others, please.

I don't know if you were referring to me or Tio but I have finished it and am in the process of making a new thread for it. I really hate to be annoying and make 20 million re-calcs but I believe there is legitimate reasons for them. Let me know if you would prefer to make a new thread or to continue on this one. I can list my reasons if need be.

I think that we can probably continue here if you write an explanation post that I can quote for the benefit of the calc group members, so they can quickly get a good idea of what is going on here.

Very well. First of all the original calc does not or at least leaves no indication that the full crater was actually pixel scaled. The scan we have cuts off part of the crater. While normally this is not too big of a deal, the cm per pixel values in this calc are quite big so even being off by 10 pixels results in differences in the tens of kilotons.


Here is the picture in question

My second reason is how they found the height. It was decided in the original thread that since Youpi's height fluctuated so much that using the anime for finding height was allowed. They did just that and used a random person to find his height.



Here is that.
The problem is that they assume this man's height instead of using a separate scene where we see Youpi's height compared to Killua. Who DOES have an established height. I believe this to be better because it requires no height assumptions and is set up in order for you to see the size difference.



Here is the scene. Ignore the pixel scaling.


Anyways I applied all the changes in my new blog right here https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:Shmeatywerbenmanjenson/Re-calc_Of_Youpi's_Rage_Blast

@CloverDragon03 @DMUA @Damage3245 @Therefir @AbaddonTheDisappointment

Would any of you be willing to help evaluate this please?

 

[Damage3245]

I think that my pixelscaling for the crater is fine, but I don't have a problem with the value for Youpi's height being changed.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. Thank you for helping out.

 

[TioKill]

I don't know if you've ever heard of something called secondary cannon--

That's not how secondary canon works. The guide has incoherent information and I've proven that the sizes of the databook are not taken into consideration, thus making Killua's height unreliable.

That alone wouldn't be enough to discredit it, but I pointed out an example where his height is contradicting someone else's, thus we're not using him. Stop trying to dance around this fact.

Also your saying youpi being 3.2 meters is hard to believe???



Here are multiple height shots we get from the manga and they all put him around the 10 ft mark if that's what your after. 3.2 meters is NOT outlandish in the slightest.

The first one he seems to be 1.5x Meruem, which is 1.5x

In fact most of these he seems to be around 2 meters tall. Let me calculate most of them, since you've given me a debunk on a platter

 

[TioKill]

I think that my pixelscaling for the crater is fine, but I don't have a problem with the value for Youpi's height being changed.

It has been shown that, while the pixelscaling is accurate, it takes out the final result by a margin of 20%, which is very significant.

 

[TioKill]

Colt is very short. I'd say significantly short.

For the record, Cheetu is about average height.

So even using an average human feels wrong. But I'll give him the benefit of the doubt.

Colt: 1.72m/132px
Youpi: 201px = 2.6m


Well, even with the generous height, that's far from 3 meters. With Colt's actual height, which might be around 1.6m, it would go down to 2.4m, or around what @Damage3245 calculated, consistency. Inconsistent for you.

---

Meruem is also a short boi, he's smaller than Pitou, and comparable to this old man Netero who is simply not that tall. I'll be nice and use the average human as well.

Now we

Meruem: 1.72m/186px
Youpi: 332px = 2.8m.

Again, closer to 2.5 than 3.2. Use Meruem's estimated height by the fandom, 1.69m, then we get something closer to 2.7m

"Nah, why did you-", Youpi's feet were bent down.

---

Again, Meruem, short king.

Meruem is 121 pixels whereas Youpi is 206 pixels, meaning Youpi 1.7x taller than Meruem.

Thus, 1.72m × 1.7x = 2.9m. This, using 1.72m which is generous for Meruem. Using the estimation, we get 2.8m

---

Knuckle ain't particularly tall either. So a generous 1.75m instead of the average 1.72m should be fine.

(209+318+767+223)÷(276+213+390+90) = 1.56x

1.56×1.75 = 2.7m


Yeah, 2.5m is simply more consistent.

 

[Damage3245]

It has been shown that, while the pixelscaling is accurate, it takes out the final result by a margin of 20%, which is very significant.

There is no way that it is off by 20%.

 

[TioKill]

There is no way that it is off by 20%.

The diameter itself isn't. The diameter is off by 4 meters, but please refer to this recalc using the same height.

That's actually correct.

Youpi: 2.47368421053m/16px = 0.154605263m per px
Radius of the crater: 307px = 47.4638158m

(47.4638158/45.8182399319)^5 = 1.19294725x by Joules.

386.7x1.19294725 = 461.312702 Kilotons.

The original one at the verse page, which uses .25 height and your pixel, is 387 Kilotons. That's nearly 100 Kilotons lost by a few pixel, or 1.1929x the original result, aka >19%.

 

[Damage3245]

@TioKill My calc does not give 387 Kilotons as a result.

If you're arguing against Charmander's calc, then whatever. But that's not my calc.