A Hunter X Hunter calculation blog

[Antvasima]

just replace 25700 with 214.35, it's not hard

Would somebody else here be willing to take the time to create an updated calculation blog for this?

 

[Shmeatywerbenmanjenson]

Would somebody else here be willing to take the time to create an updated calculation blog for this?

On it Boss

 

[Antvasima]

Thank you for helping out.

 

[Shmeatywerbenmanjenson]

Thank you for helping out.

This destroyed my soul to do but here you go

Re-calc Of Youpi's Rage Blast

vsbattles.fandom.com

 

[Antvasima]

This destroyed my soul to do but here you go

Re-calc Of Youpi's Rage Blast

vsbattles.fandom.com

Thank you. Would you be willing to evaluate the above blog please, @DMUA ?

 

[Hk1488]

I have, it's still not convincing me.

Pulverization via heat would still generate a lot of smoke as a result, and that would indeed travel upwards. The immediate explosion itself releases the dust cloud of destroyed material, and smoke travels upwards.

The reference to nukes actually directly supports me, since, yes it gets that hot at ground zero, but most material outside of the immediate epicenter is in fact pulverized or less damaged depending on how far out you go (with some buildings or objects just not being majorly compromised at all)

Can't articulate much more because it seems to just be repeating the same idea with flimsy evidence

just replace 25700 with 214.35, it's not hard

You sure? I get that there is no statement but the clues does make it look like vapor


Direct aftermath of the explosion with the vapor rising straight upwards for easily over hundred meters. Smoke settles rather quick but this cloud does not seem to settle at all.

 

[Antvasima]

DMUA accepted the new calculation blog and has already rejected the old one for these feats.

Which current calc group members accepted the old blog, so I can ask for their evaluation help here?

 

[aktrguser]

DMUA accepted the new calculation blog and has already rejected the old one for these feats.

Which current calc group members accepted the old blog, so I can ask for their evaluation help here?

I'm sorry, but can you tell me how we can change those calc?

In truth, it took so much time.

 

[Antvasima]

@CloverDragon03

You accepted the following calculation blog earlier.

Hunter x Hunter: Craters Updated

vsbattles.fandom.com

However, now DMUA has rejected it and accepted the following calculation blog to replace it.

Re-calc Of Youpi's Rage Blast

vsbattles.fandom.com

Which of the above calculation blogs do you currently find most reliable?

 

[DMUA]

Smoke settles rather quick

That's not how smoke works. Here's a photo of aftermath of a junkyard explosion in Philadelphia last month

As you can see, it's all travelling right into the air, and there's a lot of it being released. Granted, that's also because there's a ton of still burning material, but pulverization would still have these sort of results of smoke floating out like we see here, especially if you're far away from the source.

 

[DMUA]

I'm sorry, but can you tell me how we can change those calc?

In truth, it took so much time.

just replace 25700 with 214.35, it's not hard

 

[CloverDragon03]

@CloverDragon03

You accepted the following calculation blog earlier.

Hunter x Hunter: Craters Updated

vsbattles.fandom.com

However, now DMUA has rejected it and accepted the following calculation blog to replace it.

Re-calc Of Youpi's Rage Blast

vsbattles.fandom.com

Which of the above calculation blogs do you currently find most reliable?

This panel (which I borrowed from Damage's old calc, hence the pixel lines) indicates vaporization to me, especially the "kssh" sound effect and the apparent steam present. Plus, I believe Rage Blasts in HxH have a history of being vaporization, though this bit is more supplemental to my point than a key part of my stance.

 

[Antvasima]

@CloverDragon03

You accepted the following calculation blog earlier.

Hunter x Hunter: Craters Updated

vsbattles.fandom.com

However, now DMUA has rejected it and accepted the following calculation blog to replace it.

Re-calc Of Youpi's Rage Blast

vsbattles.fandom.com

Which of the above calculation blogs do you currently find most reliable?

This panel (which I borrowed from Damage's old calc, hence the pixel lines) indicates vaporization to me, especially the "kssh" sound effect and the apparent steam present. Plus, I believe Rage Blasts in HxH have a history of being vaporization, though this bit is more supplemental to my point than a key part of my stance.

Thank you for the reply.

What do you think @DMUA ?

 

[Nierre]

Following.

 

[Antvasima]

My apologies, I was thinking about what might have happened to Agnaa, and initially called for him instead of @DMUA .

 

[TioKill]

That's not how smoke works. Here's a photo of aftermath of a junkyard explosion in Philadelphia last month

As you can see, it's all travelling right into the air, and there's a lot of it being released. Granted, that's also because there's a ton of still burning material, but pulverization would still have these sort of results of smoke floating out like we see here, especially if you're far away from the source.

It's not smoke, it's very clearly vapor, not only the movement, but the very white steam coming off.


Smoke is dense, making it hover over the air and slowly climb, like your picture shows. But in the video and on the panel, the vapor is flying straight up like a rocket, like vapor would, it's that much less dense the air, something smoke is not. I'm sorry, but I don't think that's smoke whatsoever.

 

[Shmeatywerbenmanjenson]

That's not how smoke works. Here's a photo of aftermath of a junkyard explosion in Philadelphia last month

As you can see, it's all travelling right into the air, and there's a lot of it being released. Granted, that's also because there's a ton of still burning material, but pulverization would still have these sort of results of smoke floating out like we see here, especially if you're far away from the source.

I'd argue that this is a poor example because in this case it's clearly due to the trash burning. Tires and plastics are known to produce pitch black smoke when burned.

 

[Shmeatywerbenmanjenson]

It's not smoke, it's very clearly vapor, not only the movement, but the very white steam coming off.


Smoke is dense, making it hover over the air and slowly climb, like your picture shows. But in the video and on the panel, the vapor is flying straight up like a rocket, like vapor would, it's that much less dense the air, something smoke is not. I'm sorry, but I don't think that's smoke whatsoever.

This is based on manga scans the anime is a secondary source in this matter. The main reason that this is even a debate is because the Youpi blast uses the same sfx as the Aftermath of the Poor Man's Rose (HxH Version of A nuke)

 

[Hk1488]

That's not how smoke works. Here's a photo of aftermath of a junkyard explosion in Philadelphia last month

As you can see, it's all travelling right into the air, and there's a lot of it being released. Granted, that's also because there's a ton of still burning material, but pulverization would still have these sort of results of smoke floating out like we see here, especially if you're far away from the source.

I live right besides a factory that produces tons of smoke. I can literally see it from my bedroom window. I know that not really enough evidence to convince you but I'm sure smoke won't rapidly rise up 100 meters without settling at all

 

[DMUA]

It's not smoke, it's very clearly vapor, not only the movement, but the very white steam coming off.

That clip, even putting aside any anime/manga alterations, just isn't white vapor as you're describing. There is some steam in the background, but if anything I'd describe it as dust, and indeed it's lingering around as the narration plays before fading as the video ends.

I live right besides a factory that produces tons of smoke. I can literally see it from my bedroom window. I know that not really enough evidence to convince you but I'm sure smoke won't rapidly rise up 100 meters without settling at all

It's also not "rapid" in the feat, either. The shots of it smoking is from far off locations, presumably a bit after the initial explosion.

This panel (which I borrowed from Damage's old calc, hence the pixel lines) indicates vaporization to me, especially the "kssh" sound effect and the apparent steam present. Plus, I believe Rage Blasts in HxH have a history of being vaporization, though this bit is more supplemental to my point than a key part of my stance.

Same sort of thing here. This is him having a fistfight well after the blast's happened, I doubt there's any correlation between a "kssh" sound and "the entire crater was turned to vapor". It could just be heat in general, or something unrelated.

On that note like, all of the blogs don't even link to the feat itself (for some reason) so that's another deal

 

[TioKill]

That clip, even putting aside any anime/manga alterations, just isn't white vapor as you're describing. There is some steam in the background, but if anything I'd describe it as dust, and indeed it's lingering around as the narration plays before fading as the video ends.

it's not altered in the anime, no. You may not like Vaporization but Pulverization is really out of the question given the following attributes.

• The steam is completely white, and see-through. It's definitely vapor, not smoke from debris, which would take form in a brown-ish or gray-ish tone.
• The edge of the crater is cauterized from the heat, something that indicates either melting or vaporization.
• We see the "kssh" onomatopoeia. Again, indicating something is melting or being vaporized, as that's what the onomatopoeia is used for.
• The rise of the steam. Yes, I'll insist, because while smoke can rise some meters where the air is dense, it certainly doesn't shoot up in the sky like the air is constantly pushing it upwards, smoke isn't that light, and certainly isn't like that:

Considering that we accept the palace as being >5km wide, that steam is over 3500m in the air, where the air is 0.85kg/m³. Smoke is far dense than that. Only vapor, with a density of 0.013 kg/m³ could rise so fast on this much denser air.

Although I remember 5km being just a small section in the palace, meaning it's much larger than 5km, and thus the steam is actually higher, further cementing my point. This is undoubtedly steam and vapor.

 

[Hk1488]

it's not altered in the anime, no. You may not like Vaporization but Pulverization is really out of the question given the following attributes.

• The steam is completely white, and see-through. It's definitely vapor, not smoke from debris, which would take form in a brown-ish or gray-ish tone.
• The edge of the crater is cauterized from the heat, something that indicates either melting or vaporization.
• We see the "kssh" onomatopoeia. Again, indicating something is melting or being vaporized, as that's what the onomatopoeia is used for.
• The rise of the steam. Yes, I'll insist, because while smoke can rise some meters where the air is dense, it certainly doesn't shoot up in the sky like the air is constantly pushing it upwards, smoke isn't that light, and certainly isn't like that:

Considering that we accept the palace as being >5km wide, that steam is over 3500m in the air, where the air is 0.85kg/m³. Smoke is far dense than that. Only vapor, with a density of 0.013 kg/m³ could rise so fast on this much denser air.

Although I remember 5km being just a small section in the palace, meaning it's much larger than 5km, and thus the steam is actually higher, further cementing my point. This is undoubtedly steam and vapor.

Agree on all points with you. But the palace certainly isn't accepted as 5km. I'm sure we used much smaller sizes in all calcs

 

[TioKill]

Agree on all points with you. But the palace certainly isn't accepted as 5km. I'm sure we used much smaller sizes in all calcs

You're right, palace is smaller than the 5km corridor, it's about 3.5km

 

[DMUA]

see-through

We are certainly not looking at the same pictures here. You can't just see directly through that, end of story. Even then, something else I've neglected to mention is that water vapor turns to steam, vapor of rocks or dirt would look far different (as well as stick closer to the ground and instantly kill anyone nearby via suffocation, but that part I could forgive as fiction being fiction if there were actual direct statements of vaporization)

cauterized from the heat

Heat in general does this. You'll find black residue at the bottom of normal fires, let alone something like this.

We see the "kssh" onomatopoeia. Again, indicating something is melting or being vaporized, as that's what the onomatopoeia is used for.

"Kssh", if anything, sounds like it's just a sizzle or heat being outputted. Not something outright turning to vapor.

Only vapor, with a density of 0.013 kg/m³ could rise so fast on this much denser air.

Already mentioned vapor not being equivalent in all accounts but are these events even that close together in terms of time anyhow?

 

[TioKill]

We are certainly not looking at the same pictures here. You can't just see directly through that, end of story. Even then, something else I've neglected to mention is that water vapor turns to steam, vapor of rocks or dirt would look far different (as well as stick closer to the ground and instantly kill anyone nearby via suffocation, but that part I could forgive as fiction being fiction if there were actual direct statements of vaporization)

They have some transparency, yes. We see Youpi there. Again, completely white, and rising towards the sky like a rocket instead of progressively hovering and rising like your example.

Heat in general does this. You'll find black residue at the bottom of normal fires, let alone something like this.

At that speed over such a large area? I don't think normal fires would cause that, no. The heat was clearly tremendous, I don't know the specifics, but if you're capable of cauterizing rock as fast as an explosion, the heat vaporizing the contents shouldn't be absurd or outside of it's capabilities.

"Kssh", if anything, sounds like it's just a sizzle or heat being outputted. Not something outright turning to vapor.

It does mean sizzle, yes. The ground was scorched instantly. Again, melting seems the low end here.

Already mentioned vapor not being equivalent in all accounts but are these events even that close together in terms of time anyhow?

The first two panels are directly after the explosion
The second one I showed are two panels after them. Risen several kilometers in nearly like vapor, meaning it's still far less dense than air at that altitude by a landslide, still making it impossible to be just dust.

 

[CloverDragon03]

Same sort of thing here. This is him having a fistfight well after the blast's happened, I doubt there's any correlation between a "kssh" sound and "the entire crater was turned to vapor". It could just be heat in general, or something unrelated.

“I doubt [x]” and “It could just be [y]” are nowhere near solid enough arguments. That kind of sfx is often used to denote steam, and again to supplement my argument is the fact that Rage Blasts have been vaporization before. The arguments you’re making are filled with too much uncertainty

 

[Antvasima]

Should we call for more calc group members to break the deadlock here?

 

[DMUA]

They have some transparency, yes. We see Youpi there. Again, completely white, and rising towards the sky like a rocket instead of progressively hovering and rising like your example.

That's mostly the smoke just not covering his body. You can't see his legs, for instance, and you can't really discern anything past the thicker portions of it.

At that speed over such a large area? I don't think normal fires would cause that, no. The heat was clearly tremendous, I don't know the specifics, but if you're capable of cauterizing rock as fast as an explosion, the heat vaporizing the contents shouldn't be absurd or outside of it's capabilities.

Normal fires also wouldn't form massive craters instantly in the first place, so we're operating mostly on general ideas of how things work. Burnts areas leave black reside, even if it doesn't vaporize everything inside (On that note, another thing I don't remember alluding too is that nukes IRL do vaporize stuff, but only a small portion of the bigger picture, where most of the destruction is pulverization or fragmentation)

The first two panels are directly after the explosion
The second one I showed are two panels after them. Risen several kilometers in nearly like vapor, meaning it's still far less dense than air at that altitude by a landslide, still making it impossible to be just dust.

The crater should have been more than clear in a matter of seconds after the blast, then... which, the panelling seems to flip flop on deciding. Some shots, the crater's mostly empty, other shots there's still clearly a lot lingering around

“I doubt [x]” and “It could just be [y]” are nowhere near solid enough arguments. That kind of sfx is often used to denote steam, and again to supplement my argument is the fact that Rage Blasts have been vaporization before. The arguments you’re making are filled with too much uncertainty

I doubt x because the proof isn't substantial, this is just how debating is. If Rage Blasts have been explicitly vaporization before, that's another thing entirely, and something you should post sooner instead of later.

 

[TioKill]

That's mostly the smoke just not covering his body. You can't see his legs, for instance, and you can't really discern anything past the thicker portions of it.

I find your insistence on calling it smoke while not addressing the attributes that make it impossible to be smoke kind of weird. It cannot be smoke due to the color and the way it's density is presented.

Normal fires also wouldn't form massive craters instantly in the first place, so we're operating mostly on general ideas of how things work. Burnts areas leave black reside, even if it doesn't vaporize everything inside (On that note, another thing I don't remember alluding too is that nukes IRL do vaporize stuff, but only a small portion of the bigger picture, where most of the destruction is pulverization or fragmentation)

I'm sure you're aware of it, but the fire was just a metaphor, it's not the only source of heat in the universe. My point is how hot it was that the contact with the earth made it cauterize instantly, which is impressive.

Don't bring IRL nukes into this, this was an energy explosion based on a fictional property, Nen. IRL Nukes do less damage the further they go due the Law of Conservation of Energy, which is not at play with Nen at all.

The crater should have been more than clear in a matter of seconds after the blast, then... which, the panelling seems to flip flop on deciding. Some shots, the crater's mostly empty, other shots there's still clearly a lot lingering around

It was. The paneling shows the massive amount of vapor pouring out, it's empty next panel, and then we see all the vapor pour out of the palace itself at a distance.

Well, that's pretty much another evidence of vapor-like behavior, no?

I doubt x because the proof isn't substantial, this is just how debating is. If Rage Blasts have been explicitly vaporization before, that's another thing entirely, and something you should post sooner instead of later.

It is rather substantial. The indication of heat is already a good indicator that makes vaporization possible, the SFX, the cauterization at high speed, the vapor-like aftereffects. These are supports to vaporization, and Hitchen's razor should favor my argument unless you bring an equally valid approach to claim it's pulverization instead.

 

[Antvasima]

@Mr._Bambu @Therefir @Jasonsith @Wokistan @Migue79 @KLOL506

Do you think that DMUA or CloverDragon03 makes better sense here?

 

[TioKill]

@Mr._Bambu @Therefir @Jasonsith @Wokistan @Migue79 @KLOL506

Do you think that DMUA or CloverDragon03 makes better sense here?

Uhm, if I may say so myself, Clover only pointed out that DMUA was just claiming possibilities without making a counter. Were my points not good enough to be considered here, or...?

 

[Antvasima]

You points can also be considered of course.

 

[TioKill]

Thank you Ant. I will abide by whatever the CGMs decide.

 

[Antvasima]

No problem. Thank you for being reasonable.

 

[Arkenis]

it's not altered in the anime, no. You may not like Vaporization but Pulverization is really out of the question given the following attributes.

• The steam is completely white, and see-through. It's definitely vapor, not smoke from debris, which would take form in a brown-ish or gray-ish tone.
• The edge of the crater is cauterized from the heat, something that indicates either melting or vaporization.
• We see the "kssh" onomatopoeia. Again, indicating something is melting or being vaporized, as that's what the onomatopoeia is used for.
• The rise of the steam. Yes, I'll insist, because while smoke can rise some meters where the air is dense, it certainly doesn't shoot up in the sky like the air is constantly pushing it upwards, smoke isn't that light, and certainly isn't like that:

Considering that we accept the palace as being >5km wide, that steam is over 3500m in the air, where the air is 0.85kg/m³. Smoke is far dense than that. Only vapor, with a density of 0.013 kg/m³ could rise so fast on this much denser air.

Although I remember 5km being just a small section in the palace, meaning it's much larger than 5km, and thus the steam is actually higher, further cementing my point. This is undoubtedly steam and vapor.

Completely agree.

 

[CloverDragon03]

I doubt x because the proof isn't substantial, this is just how debating is. If Rage Blasts have been explicitly vaporization before, that's another thing entirely, and something you should post sooner instead of later.

There was a whole blog post detailing why Youpi's and Meruem's Rage Blasts should be vaporization that was accepted before, shown here

 

[LIFE_OF_KING]

The arguments from DMUA are nothing new tbh

 

[Shmeatywerbenmanjenson]

We see here that the same SFX are used for both instances and even the way the Vapor is drawn diffusing (Hugging the edge of the crater and then continuing upwards) is the same in both instances.


If it was dust or something similar he probably would have drawn it like this

 

[DMUA]

There was a whole blog post detailing why Youpi's and Meruem's Rage Blasts should be vaporization that was accepted before, shown here

I think this was already shown to me (interesting that it explicitly brings up nukes to support the argument when I got criticized for bringing up that nuclear ordinance doesn't vaporize everything in a given crater it makes)

That said, looking at it a bit later I guess I am a bit harsh on it, the aftermath does show a bit more vapor qualities than just "no fragments, heat", so just go ahead

 

[TioKill]

We have to upgrade Neferpitou, Hiruzen, Menthuthuyeopi tier to 7-B

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Category:Tier_7-B <- We have to rank them at 7-B.


https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:LordUrien935/The_Re-Tiering_of_Hunter_x_Hunter#| <- Menthuthuyeopi's one angry blast record 7-B. And why they were not ranked at 7-B? In truth, it even seems that they are stronger than some other 7-A tier cherecters.


We have to rank them 7-B

• This calc is incorrect, the crater wasn't a hemisphere.
• The current version uses much more reliable pixelscaling
• It's Low 7-B, not 7-B
• Calc's not used in our profiles.

The upgrade is not going to be applied, no..