A few terraria revisions

[Mr. Bambu]

A planet appearing out of thin air is incalculatable, even if u find the size of it
Its ap is "at least 8-a"&illusion creation

A planet appearing is absolutely not incalculable, in fact we even have a calc for it.

High 5-A is, at the very least, perfectly fine. 5-C is a little muddier I feel, depends on if we'd consider Terraria to have a UES, and if we assume Sealing is how the Wall of Flesh did that (which I feel is also questionable).

 

[Sillyfox0]

A planet appearing is absolutely not incalculable, in fact we even have a calc for it.

High 5-A is, at the very least, perfectly fine. 5-C is a little muddier I feel, depends on if we'd consider Terraria to have a UES, and if we assume Sealing is how the Wall of Flesh did that (which I feel is also questionable).

No matter if you enter the area with the solar pillar at day or night, the planet appears, once you leave, the planet is gone
At least illusion creation
At max gameplay mechanic

And 5-c is simply mad how is sealing= 5-c ap if sealing equals ap now then the wof is high 5 a since it prevents the whole hardmode which includes the moonlord

 

[Mr. Bambu]

I don't understand what your criticism is of the pillars, do you have proof of it being illusion creation aside from it being around the Pillars (i.e., them doing it)?

We don't actually know the specific mechanic through which the Wall of Flesh is doing this. If it is physically restraining the spirits (you know... like a wall) then 5-C is probably fine. I don't remember any lore that specifically points out Sealing but it may exist because I don't remember everything in Terraria photographically, which is why its muddier.

 

[Sillyfox0]

Ok about the pillar thing

The current tier is high 5 a because they are bringing the moon closer to earth though that is not the moon since you cna enter the pillar areas even if its the day, also the planets are all different in size and coloring, a ring that shows us that the planet is not the moon, though even if it gets proven that that is indeed the moon, the feat is unusable since the planet is inconsistent and only appears at background at a specific pillar's area,
Once you leave the are it disappears and appears once you get back on thats obviously a game mechanic (background change once you enter a specific area like jungle having jungle background and so on) or at max illusion creation at a specific area

 

[Sillyfox0]

And the 5-C is just ridiculous, the wall of flesh prevents hardmode at all times, is a seal technically, should be high 5 a since it prevents the whole moonlord scenario, but yet is 5-c because it prevents like the solar eclipse... Which is not moon level because there is no even such a calculation... Though even if it SOMEHOW achieves 5-C ap the ap does not equal ss/dura since this ap supposedly is sealing the whole world, not meant to fight with it

 

[Sillyfox0]

Same with pillars actually, high 5 a only makes the moon move, its not about fighting with the same strength, also the fact that their dura is Dwarf Star for no reason... Crazy

 

[Sillyfox0]

How do early bosses have 8-B ap it states "can harm the terrarian" but the early game terrarian's dura scales to 8-b (can take hits from the king slime) doesnt make sense

 

[Sillyfox0]

Btw why not king slime multi city block level dura (can survive 7 dynamite explosions, 635.02581262 tons of tnt)
And terrarian multi city block level ap (can harm the king slime)

Unsure about the terrarians dura and the bosses ss tho

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Yeah this reads like a fundamental misunderstanding of how our wiki works. If you can move a moon with an ability it is generally presumed that you're fighting with that same strength, it doesn't really make sense otherwise. If you're now accepting that it isn't an illusion then the feat ought to be fine. 5-C is still muddier but I'm more neutral on that than anything.

How do early bosses have 8-B ap it states "can harm the terrarian" but the early game terrarian's dura scales to 8-b (can take hits from the king slime) doesnt make sense

Level with me here man, do you know what "powerscaling" means? Is it your opinion that the King Slime cannot deal damage to the Terrarian? Is it your opinion that the Terrarian cannot survive a hit from the King Slime? Both of those things are true, so they scale. What's so hard to understand?

 

[Sillyfox0]

Terrarians ap is multi city block yes
King slimes dura is multi city block yes
But how about the reverse which is terrarians dura
And king slimes ap
Dont think they can scale backwards since
The terrarian can only under extreme circumstances survive a dynamite explosion in early game, though is capable of taking a bomb's explosion

 

[Sillyfox0]

Terrarians ap is multi city block yes
King slimes dura is multi city block yes
But how about the reverse which is terrarians dura
And king slimes ap
Dont think they can scale backwards since
The terrarian can only under extreme circumstances survive a dynamite explosion in early game, though is capable of taking a bomb's explosion

King slime's ap is not multi city block since terrarians dura is not multi city block

 

[Sillyfox0]

"Yeah this reads like a fundamental misunderstanding of how our wiki works. If you can move a moon with an ability it is generally presumed that you're fighting with that same strength, it doesn't really make sense otherwise. If you're now accepting that it isn't an illusion then the feat ought to be fine. 5-C is still muddier but I'm more neutral on that than anything."

Uh in that case i will go with the
"That was not the moon, thats a game mechanic, the "moon" is not consistent and can appear at day, the "moon" is different on the 4 different pillar's backgrounds, can appear in seconds and disappear in seconds once you leave a specific area (game mechanic, background change only), illusuon creation in a specific area around the pillar itself (makes sense since once you leave, the planet disappears)"

And the 5-C WoF is Invalid because:
Sealing something powerful is Sealing and is not AP, even if it SOMEHOW equals ap, would equal high 5-a since the WoF seals the hardmode which includes the moonlord

 

[Sillyfox0]

Terrarians ap is multi city block yes
King slimes dura is multi city block yes
But how about the reverse which is terrarians dura
And king slimes ap
Dont think they can scale backwards since
The terrarian can only under extreme circumstances survive a dynamite explosion in early game, though is capable of taking a bomb's explosion

By that i mean that u cant scale the Terrarian's dura and bosses ap to a high tier since the Terrarian's dura is super small going by feats, even if u powerscale him high, you are never scaling his dura above town level

 

[Sillyfox0]

Also quick question...
1 terraria block is 2ft by 2ft cuz depth meter or something, and the third dimension is also 2ft considering the spherical explosion of dynamite, 0.22m of platinum ore (which when placed looks like a whole ore block) is 4,719kg, now the platinum bar is refined from 4 ores, 18,876kg, full platinum armor set+broadsword is
377,520kg(plat greaves)+566,280kg(plat chainmail)+471,900kg(plat helmet)+151,008kg(plat broadsword)=1,566,708kg, Class M
Valid calc or nah? Would bosses scale to the Terrarian's lift str since they can knock him back with their attacks

 

[Sillyfox0]

"Level with me here man, do you know what "powerscaling" means? Is it your opinion that the King Slime cannot deal damage to the Terrarian? Is it your opinion that the Terrarian cannot survive a hit from the King Slime? Both of those things are true, so they scale. What's so hard to understand?"

Uh well its just that the KS's ap is actually unknown and same with Terrarian's dura, terrarian does not scale to the ks cuz we dont know where ks's ap scales in the first place and so on

Current King slime:
Attack Potency: City Block level+ (Comparable to Early Game Terrarian, who can harm him.)

Yes ks does get harmed by the terrarian but there is no reason for the ks to have the same ap as Terrarian's ap because if
Character A's Ap is town level
Character B's Dura is town level
Character B's AP would not scale to A's since even if he can harm him you can not tell if A's dura is town level or not, no feats supporting such
at most the terrarian can survive like 1 dynamite explosion (in early game) which is city block level, and which gets ks's ap to city block and Terrarian's dura to city block

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Dude you're posting too many replies most of which are barely coherent. I encourage you to think through your posts a bit more in the future before posting them, and preferably post your entire argument at once (ideally in the OP).

At the moment I am obviously against most revisions suggested in this thread. If a properly evaluated calc blog can be made for the platinum block thing then that's fine, and the gender bit is uncontroversial to me. 5-C WoF is admittedly a hazy area but at the moment I think it has enough grounds to remain.

 

[Sillyfox0]

Sry for random bursts of statements btw

 

[Sillyfox0]

Dude you're posting too many replies most of which are barely coherent. I encourage you to think through your posts a bit more in the future before posting them, and preferably post your entire argument at once (ideally in the OP).

At the moment I am obviously against most revisions suggested in this thread. If a properly evaluated calc blog can be made for the platinum block thing then that's fine, and the gender bit is uncontroversial to me. 5-C WoF is admittedly a hazy area but at the moment I think it has enough grounds to remain.

So uh in one message i want to get early bosses duras to the amount of dynamite explosions they can take (king slime multi city block dura, terrarian multi city block ap, etc)
WoF must have sealing/high 5 a since it prevents the moonlord scenario in the very first place, the Celestial Towers must be renamed to the Celestial Pillars cuz they are Pillars, their moon moving feat is super outdated, since that is a game mechanic that makes a planet appear and disappear once you enter a specific area which is illusuon creation only

I wonder if the class 5 should stay on most bosses too since knocking back is kinda a game mechanic

Kinda gotta make them bosses placeholders for possible future revisions based on these "Tooltip'The fury of the universe lies within this fragment'" and "Tooltip 'The power of a galaxy resides within this fragment'"

WoF and above 8-A/Close to 8-A&Sealing
Pillars and above 8-A/Close to 8-A&Illusion creation

Thats all i have to say for now

((Can also remake the thread in a more appropriate way, but still need ur last words on that statement above))

 

[DMUA]

I just found this thread

I'd comment more but the arguments here are genuinely unintelligible just as a grammatical thing, much less the actual contents within

 

[Antvasima]

So should all of the Terraria characters that are currently listed with "Infinite" stamina have it changed to "Superhuman" instead due to game mechanics?

 

[Mr. Bambu]

That depends on the character. The Terrarian shouldn't but other characters definitely have an argument for infinite stamina. I don't know what all characters are presently listed as such at the moment but can check later.

 

[Antvasima]

Thank you. Feel free to revise the Terraria pages that seem to have blatantly inaccurate stamina sections or other information, but preferably mention it here first.

 

[Sinpokefan]

Just gonna leave this here

 

[Qawsedf234]

If you can move a moon with an ability it is generally presumed that you're fighting with that same strength, it doesn't really make sense otherwise

Well, if you move a moon with an ability and you can showcase that you can put the same effort into other abilities.

 

[DaReaperMan]

Just dropping by to say people are cooking on Stats RN, and it's just being argued about in a group chat right now

I argued against some shit myself too so yay

 

[Antvasima]

Thank you for helping out.

 

[DMUA]

I'm not sure how swinging by and dropping the equivalent to this is exactly help, but I can't imagine this thread is going to go anywhere given it's OP anyways, so

 

[DaReaperMan]

I'm not sure how swinging by and dropping the equivalent to this is exactly help, but I can't imagine this thread is going to go anywhere given it's OP anyways, so

It's basically saying "yeah a lot of this is being handled!"

Same reason the Star Wars downgrade from 5-B KING did fell so hard on it's face

 

[Antvasima]

So should we close this thread, or is there anything constructive that we can do here?

 

[Sillyfox0]

If the mods view high 5-a and 5-c as reasonable then i have nothing else to say

 

[Sillyfox0]

If these dogshit feats are actually fine then i have absolutely nothing else to say

Again sealing and illusion creation
Vs 5-C and High 5-A

 

[DMUA]

Nobody ordered you to use this website, just saying

 

[Sillyfox0]

God damn (still waiting for some admin's opinion)

 

[Mr. Bambu]

I'm still ambivalent towards 5-C (would be shocked if there weren't a feat above 8-A to replace it, though), High 5-A is absolutely fine- the problem seems to arise more from the limitations of the game's graphics over anything.

 

[Phsccarvalho]

(would be shocked if there weren't a feat above 8-A to replace it, though)

In truth no.

After that, the only things that are relevant are the endgame, ie the pillars and the final boss.

the problem seems to arise more from the limitations of the game's graphics over anything.

Anyway, if people consider that pillars really somehow pull totally different celestial bodies, they should be 4-A.

Because the blue pillar has stars in the background, even if you fight during the day, and for some reason only in the pillar area and not in the rest of the world.

 

[Phsccarvalho]

5-C is a little muddier I feel, depends on if we'd consider Terraria to have a UES, and if we assume Sealing is how the Wall of Flesh did that (which I feel is also questionable).

I don't recall terraria having UES. And he seals the spirits that cause the eclipse to happen. I don't think we have any proof that he seals these spirits physically, because they are literally spirits that even make a new biome appear, and I also don't think there is any proof that the spirits physically eclipse them, because they are spirits with any kind of body or something like that.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

In truth no.

After that, the only things that are relevant are the endgame, ie the pillars and the final boss.


Anyway, if people consider that pillars really somehow pull totally different celestial bodies, they should be 4-A.

Because the blue pillar has stars in the background, even if you fight during the day, and for some reason only in the pillar area and not in the rest of the world.

Yeah I just don't believe that really. I suppose I could try to hunt down feats above 8-A but idrc if we downgrade WoF to a much lower tier, I'm neutral on that point as I said, I just disagree with the notion that the Pillar's High 5-A feat is invalid.

Stars are actually always in the background in real life, daytime just makes it difficult to see them, it wouldn't need to be a higher feat to render them visible. Moving a celestial body as part of the background shift would, though, hence feat.

 

[DMUA]

Because the blue pillar has stars in the background, even if you fight during the day, and for some reason only in the pillar area and not in the rest of the world.

The lighting is what would make stars more visible, it's not telekinetically pulling them towards the earth in the same way that we see it do so with the Moon. Don't really get this.

I don't recall terraria having UES. And he seals the spirits that cause the eclipse to happen. I don't think we have any proof that he seals these spirits physically, because they are literally spirits that even make a new biome appear, and I also don't think there is any proof that the spirits physically eclipse them, because they are spirits with any kind of body or something like that.

Just glancing over the UES page, even if you interpret that their sealing is entirely magical rather than just containing stuff with its body (And non physical interaction is a pretty universal thing in the setting, since something like ghosts do get affected by NPCs attacking them and they're not as overtly supernatural as something like the wall of flesh), they still actively fire laser beams in their fight, and magic armor sets do scale up in durability alongside how strong the boosts to magic damage are (with the other classes having relatively the same kind of increase), so it's at least somewhat arguable

 

[Phsccarvalho]

Yeah I just don't believe that really. I suppose I could try to hunt down feats above 8-A

Well, that's it, it kind of doesn't exist until the pillars.

Stars are actually always in the background in real life, daytime just makes it difficult to see them, it wouldn't need to be a higher feat to render them visible. Moving a celestial body as part of the background shift would, though, hence feat.

It still changes the thing about celestial bodies not having any kind of resemblance to the moon and each one being totally different, in addition to the fact that the scenery only appears close to them.

But let's say the scenery changing around them is just game mechanics.

This means that there are 4 totally different scenarios with 4 celestial bodies at the same time, which would also prevent it from being the moon.

Just glancing over the UES page, even if you interpret that their sealing is entirely magical rather than just containing stuff with its body (And non physical interaction is a pretty universal thing in the setting, since something like ghosts do get affected by NPCs attacking them and they're not as overtly supernatural as something like the wall of flesh), they still actively fire laser beams in their fight, and magic armor sets do scale up in durability alongside how strong the boosts to magic damage are (with the other classes having relatively the same kind of increase), so it's at least somewhat arguable

What do armors have to do with bosses? Besides that increasing the terrarian's magic doesn't give him more defense and not even giving them magic equipment does that.

Also, the main thing is that WoF doesn't seal the moon or eclipse, it seals the spirits. When the spirits are released things like an eclipse can happen. Even if these spirits had high ap and durability, sealing is still hax, which in case these spirits do not resist.

Plus there's the outlier thing, considering the only things that come close to that in the lore would be the late game part with the celestial stuff.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

I'm going to move past the "There's no feats above 8-A!!" thing because, again, I just don't believe that, but don't feel motivated to go a-huntin'

It still changes the thing about celestial bodies not having any kind of resemblance to the moon and each one being totally different, in addition to the fact that the scenery only appears close to them.

But let's say the scenery changing around them is just game mechanics.

This means that there are 4 totally different scenarios with 4 celestial bodies at the same time, which would also prevent it from being the moon.

While I don't agree that it prevents it from being the moon (they could, after all, all be moving it), it's also generally acceptable to say a moon, or some other celestial body, it doesn't really matter I think. Personally still think it's just the moon and each of them are moving it about.