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5th strongest 7-A Bracket Round 5 (Gyuliedistodies vs King Hassan)

I've seen that characters from Fate are extremely skilled too. So with an AP difference and skill Hassan could win. Just depends on if Gyu can somehow "outskill" him and bypass his durability eventually with continuous attacks.
 
Gyruies Ap isn't exactly baseline, even if it isn't calced.

He he above Shiraori, who like all gods is above the system.

To put numbers on it: Mountain level is around 20k offense, while Gyurie is far above 100k offense.
 
Is that linear though? cause if it is or maybe non-linear making it far higher a difference they would be hitting around the same force. At least.
 
That's why I ask, would his barrier still be there if he was one shot. Because if he lost his barrier, KH would regain his skills then death hax him. The ap difference is just too big.
 
John985 said:
That's why I ask, would his barrier still be there if he was one shot. Because if he lost his barrier, KH would regain his skills then death hax him. The ap difference is just too big.
Click to expand...
Yeah, this. Please Dont, answer this (wordplay intended).
 
EmperorRorepme said:
Is that linear though? cause if it is or maybe non-linear making it far higher a difference they would be hitting around the same force. At least.
Click to expand...
As usual hard to say. Let's say there are at least 2 levels of complete stomp between it, though.

Yeah, this. Please Dont, answer this (wordplay intended).

His God Zone would definitely be unaffected and simple injuries should do nothing either. And they regenerate nigh-instantly. Shiraori had no particular problems when Kuro cut the nerves in her neck.

Gods are basically their soul, less than being physical beings, so I would think it probably isn't an issue.
 
>His God Zone would definitely be unaffected and simple injuries should do nothing either. And they regenerate nigh-instantly. Shiraori had no particular problems when Kuro cut the nerves in her neck.

Can you give scans on this part? I dont remember this happening when I was still reading the story.
 
DontTalkDT said:
A lot of what you mentioned seems like the cause of a skill, not its mechanism.

And it can literally negate a spiders skill to produce poison, so don't think that things which don't seem supernatural are excluded.
Click to expand...
Technically speaking it is both in many cases.

Negating the ability of a spider to make silk is a lot easier then negating how history views someone, or negating how much someone loves their god.
 
His God Zone is a realm not an ability but a place that has a certain effect, so that would obviously not change. And simple injuries, like a ripped off arm or something, wouldn't affect the usage of a thought based ability, cause... why would they?

As for Shiraori being capable of thinking like normal while having Kuros hand in her neck:

Snap ― suddenly that dull sound resounded from inside of me.


I lose all the strength in my body, but the hand grasping my neck doesn't allow me to fall down. The hand that had suddenly appeared behind me had seized my neck and smashed the bones. As if it was somebody else's problem, I realised the situation.

ÒÇîI've no doubt that wasn't enough to kill you.ÒÇì

I hear a voice from behind me. It's a voice that I've heard before. Or rather, there's only one person on this planet that I'm aware of who is capable of doing this.

I'm violently pulled backwards by my seized neck. Since my neck, or to be precise the part of my body that transmits instructions from my brain to my body has been destroyed, I'm currently unable to resist that.
 
Ah shit. I just realized. King Hassan is a smurf now, his death manip and skills involved with it are 2-A since it worked on Tiamat. That field definitely isn't working on him in this regard lol
 
Iapitus The Impaler said:
Technically speaking it is both in many cases.

Negating the ability of a spider to make silk is a lot easier then negating how history views someone, or negating how much someone loves their god.
Click to expand...
That's how they get their ability, not how the ability works. And I could relate it to the effects of titels, which can be acquired through things like how one is viewed by others, also being negated.

Iapitus The Impaler said:
Ah shit. I just realized. King Hassan is a smurf now, his death manip and skills involved with it are 2-A since it worked on Tiamat. That field definitely isn't working on him in this regard lol
Click to expand...
2-A hax or 2-A power? Also, add that stuff to the profile...
 
When, I say it is both, I mean it is both. Let's take the High Servant skill for example. The High Servant skill is granted by being a composite of multiple divinities. For example, Passionlip has the high servant skill because she is a composite of Parvati, Durga, and Brynhildr. It is both the mechanism, and the way she gained it. How did she gain the skill? By being a composite divinity. What is the skills mechanism? Its mechanism is that she is a composite divinity of those 3 goddesses. So, how would he negate a skill like this? Would she just stop being a composite goddess and stop existing? Would the three goddesses information split off into their respective selves? What?

Current doctrine is 2-A hax. I'm not exactly sure how I would put it on there, it worked on Tiamat (Fate), so his death manip scales hax wise.
 
EmperorRorepme said:
If the "output" isn't 2-A he can still null the "output" before the death hax activates.
Click to expand...
I'm not sure what you mean by this, but using the durability negation that comes with this skill he leaved off the wing of a 2-A character will applying the concept of death
 
Iapitus The Impaler said:
When, I say it is both, I mean it is both....
Current doctrine is 2-A hax. I'm not exactly sure how I would put it on there, it worked on Tiamat (Fate), so his death manip scales hax wise.
Click to expand...
Vampires have the vampire skill, which is the skill that makes people Vampires and gives the Vampire its characteristics and that can be negated. So the answer to your question is: by negating every effect that comes from being a composite of multiple divinities.

If it's just 2-A hax then the activation can still be negated. As argued far up in this thread what is relevant for this negation isn't that the field negates the effect, but also the activation of the skill. As long as the "power flow" (to say it in an as general manner as possible) isn't 2-A, but 7-A, the negation of the activation still works.
 
You seem to be confused. The other abilities she gets from them Aren't skill, but Authority and Noble Phantasms. Or the powers they get are distinct skills. This isn't a skill about having the powers of 3 different goddesses, this is a skill about being a combo of 3 different goddesses.

At the Boundary is a skill that is always active, as is proved by fgo categorizing it as a passive skill. Azrael, At the Boundary, and Evening Bell, are all linked so it is not so simple as preventing one of their activation. Also yes, the durability negation that comes with Evening Bell let him cleave off the wing of Tiamat, so it would be 2-A durability negation
 
Yes, and the vampire skill is the skill to be a vampire. Same situation.

2-A dura negation, but not with 2-A power behind it. It's similar to how the Curtana in To Aru negates High 1-C durability, but can be blocked by Kanzaki due to her not having to negate High 1-C power, but just a fraction of the power of an archangel.

Preventing the activation is a bit misformulated. What it does is prevent the power that the skill uses from shaped/transformed to produce the skills effect.

To use a metaphor similar to one that used in the work: Imagine the power as water and the skill as a compressed water beam. What the negation does is to prevent the water from being compressed by cutting the tubing.

So an active skill will also be deactivated.
 
From your description it sounds like the skill that grants abilities of a vampire, which is not what High Servant does. If it does not stop them from being a vampire, then it wouldn't be able to negate the High Servant skill.

It does have 2-A power behind it. It cleaved off the wing of a 2-A being, unless I do not understand what you mean.

But it works because of anti-magic right? It has been shown that anti magic does not negate the non-magical skills of servants.

Except that you could not prevent the water flow that is already flowing, like a passive skill.
 
No. It's obvious that "skills" also include things like states. A spider has a biological component that lets it exert poison, that's nulled. A vampire has physiological abilities due to being a vampire, that is nulled.

He means that affecting 2-As doesn't mean the energy source (or source in general) is 2-A.

Magic in Kumo cannot be equated with magic in fate, especially with how skills work.

Destroying the pipe would stop it from flowing...
 
Yes, but we are discussing that skills from that verse means something different. I'm saying that skills within fate are not inherently magical, so they cannot be negated in the same way. How about skills from Medaka box? those have no relation to magic whatsoever, so would you claim that his anti magic still works on them? How about the fate skill Admonishment to the King of Knights. Its literally just guilt over a phrase from the past. How would he negate that skill?

So you are saying that if someone walked in here with 1-A hax this dude would be able to null it?

Exactly, since magic cannot be equated, these skills cannot be properly equated either, since anti-magic is proven to not destroy skills in fate unless they are inherently magical

But it could not stop the 2-A hax that is already flowing, at least not for this metaphor. In fact, it would flow even harsher than before
 
A spider excreting poison is not magical either. Skills, only because they are called magecraft, are not automatically limited to "magic" as defined by other verses. This has affected basic skills something has regardless of them being magic or not.

He isn't nulling the hax, he is keeping the person from using it by cutting off the source. You can't shoot a gun without bullets, after all.

Except the definition of skills in Kumo would fit Hassan's abilities'. Magic is a non-factor to either case.

The metaphor is plain broken. Hassan can only kill enemies by striking them with his sword. If he is made unable to strike an enemy, then his death hax is useless.
 
So, how would it negate the skills I brought up then?

And what source would that be? Other than specific skills that draw from Mana, the skills in question have no energy source

Except that skills within the nasuverse except for those that specifically draw on mana, have no energy source to be drawn from. Again, skills in the nasuverse can be things like a personality trait, which I would love to hear what kind of source it draws from that it could cut off.

Is there any specific reason why he wouldn't be able to use it. And no, he can activate evening bells before he strikes. Once he has used evening bell, he is guaranteed to
 
Gyulie: 4

Hassan: 2

I think?
 
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