TegamiBachi25
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this makes sense. Where's the CRT that we all downgrade every other version of Goku and upgrade OG DB Goku and Anime Toei OG Goku to 2-C?
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Dragon Ball Daima Spoiler Discussion Thread
- Thread starter Ednaxel2
- Start date
- 36
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interesting...
Hasty12345
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Why does he know so much
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No Dragon Ball super
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Another episode where the heroes struggle against fodder. Said fodder is somehow stronger than Dabura. A ship plane beat Vegeta's ass so hard he cried for Goku to help him.
TegamiBachi25
He/Him- 871
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lmao
Another episode where the heroes struggle against fodder. Said fodder is somehow stronger than Dabura. A ship plane beat Vegeta's ass so hard he cried for Goku to help him.
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They got up right after this btwlmao
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This is equivalent to Goku and Vegeta in RoF going back to Namek Saga and needing back-up against the Ginyu Force.
Another episode where the heroes struggle against fodder. Said fodder is somehow stronger than Dabura. A ship plane beat Vegeta's ass so hard he cried for Goku to help him.
It's the main thing I dislike about Daima. Not even on a powerscaling level, just in terms of how it's weird and annoying on a level of common sense. Goku and Vegeta, even as kids, are at least stronger than Dabura. And even if they've been nerfed, this is still post-Buu Saga. Even excluding Z and just focusing on Daima in itself, Goku and Vegeta have both defeated Tamagami's, who are meant to possess virtually unparalleled power within the Demon Realm, untouchable even to the likes of Supreme Demon King's, yet people who defeat them almost lose to actual random grunt soldiers. Does this mean a random Gendarmerie soldier from the Demon Realm would literally kill Namek Saga Frieza? On so many levels it just feels wrong.
Daima essentially throws the series' scaling and any aspect of consistency in power levels into the garbage and just has their power levels fluctuate depending on what the plot wants. And unfortunately, in Daima, most of the opponents are random nameless fodder, and the plot WILL make the gang struggle against them for dramatic tension.
And also, none of this explains why Goku and Vegeta didn't at least go Super Saiyan in a supposed "life or death" battle where they got caught and were injured multiple times. For Vegeta I could see it being out of ego, but Goku knows when to get serious and he only did it AFTER being saved by more literal fodder.
It sucks because all of these guys look like Mercenary Tao victims.
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Scaling wise? No, not really.
Basically all that happened was Goku and co. went up against the Gendarmerie army, kept getting hurt and almost losing, and had to get saved by the Demon King of the 3rd realm alongside some random fodder, because the Gendarmerie had tanks that fired pools of electricity at the ground in a small circle (Goku, Vegeta, and Piccolo forgot they can fly I think so they ran at human level speeds on foot).
The B plot was about the annoying pilot guy having the Evil Third Eye which Gomah wants, then we got a flashback where Dabura plotted to overthrow his father. So he had the Evil Third Eye get stolen, which got lost in the Third Demon Realm, and then Dabura took over by overpowering Abura or something.
And that's about it.
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Namekians die from fatal injuries and can't regenerate vital organs, just a bit nerfed
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On the flip side, high 4C to 4B tanks is deeply funny so I'm not gonna bitch about it
Those tanks solo so many verses now
Those tanks solo so many verses now
Dust_Collector
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Never, NEVER, diss the GOAT Hybis ever again
Spinoirr
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That guy Is attracted to kid Bulma
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daima as a whole so far has been extremely disappointing
TegamiBachi25
He/Him- 871
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Really? I'm guessing that only applies to Canon DBZ and not Toei then
Those tanks now solo SSJ3 Buu Saga Goku
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This is so weird because like on one end, yeah. I mean, Frieza and Vegeta killed a bunch of Namekians without killing them whole. On the other end, noooo—because Cell and Buu Saga say that they can regenerate whole bodies so long as their head is around, so…?
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If I understood correctly, the problem is mostly the electrical effect, so I wouldn't say that it breaks the scale too much,
Besides the first Katagami needed a Super Saiyan Goku, the second one came by needing Vegeta SSJ 3 (although thanks to Neva) and the last one was defeated by Majin Doo...
Add to that the problem is the weapons, since all their wielders are oneshotted
They haven't broken the scale yet, although it does seem strange
plus: Vegeta never healed from his fight, right? He was already half tired
Besides the first Katagami needed a Super Saiyan Goku, the second one came by needing Vegeta SSJ 3 (although thanks to Neva) and the last one was defeated by Majin Doo...
Add to that the problem is the weapons, since all their wielders are oneshotted
They haven't broken the scale yet, although it does seem strange
plus: Vegeta never healed from his fight, right? He was already half tired
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Piccolo hasn't always been like that tbf
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I don’t really think any of this acting is a problem nor do I actually believe base goku is a match for debura. I could definitely believe it would take SS2 forms to beat him in there current state and neba would have to intervine id the Demon king himself fought one of his creations. If the 3 could handel fine on there own why would he need to stay behind after all?
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I saw some of your comments and would like to delve into them because I don’t find them correct at all.
The correct way to interpret this is to compare both when neither knew anything about SSJ3, considering the time it took them to achieve or not achieve SSJ3. Remember that Goku didn’t know anything about SSJ3 either, so I think it’s unfair to measure Goku’s time this way but view Vegeta’s from a different perspective. Why, then, aren’t Vegeta’s seven years, during which he failed to achieve SSJ3, taken into account?
In a span of seven years, Goku achieved SSJ2 and SSJ3, while Vegeta only reached SSJ2. So, I don’t think it makes any sense to say that Vegeta achieves things faster than Goku. Moreover, I find it a bit absurd, considering that Goku achieves things first, even within similar timeframes for achieving such transformations. But for some reason, you say that Vegeta achieves them faster, which is contradictory.
Why is Vegeta’s timeframe considered until after Goku achieves them? That doesn’t make sense to me either. And how would it even make sense to count Vegeta’s timeframe from when he learns about a transformation or perfecting a form, already knowing how to do it after having a reference in Goku, with Goku, who doesn’t yet know about that form, just to say Vegeta achieves them faster?
"Six months for Vegeta to achieve SSJ3" haha.
Lastly, you claim that Vegeta constantly masters things faster than Goku. Which ones, exactly?
I hope you’re not going to bring up Vegeta’s training on Yardrat, considering they’re very different versions of Goku and Vegeta—one having already trained with an Angel and achieved all those forms.
It has always been shown in the narrative that Goku has a superior learning ability compared to Vegeta.
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Except Vegeta literally knows about SSJ3, why in the hell would you ever compare it as if he doesn't? He literally does.
Nobody is comparing that specific case. Just that Vegeta can, and has, learned things quicker than Goku before. If you want to compare that specific case, it wouldn't matter because Goku throws himself under the bus and said it took him years to master it after learning it was a thing.
Because why would it be? Goku's shouldn't even be counted either, he only managed to figure out it was a thing because of the way the after life worked in the first place. Once people actually knew it was a thing, it didn't take them long to copy it. We see it with Gotenks who pulls it out his ass in 2 weeks, and we see it with Vegeta as per the very point.
And Goku had the benefit of a body and the other world mechanics enabling him to push beyond in a way that wouldn't be feasible on earth.
It does because it's literally happened. Moro Arc is an example, Vegeta learned the funny alien stuff at a far quicker rate compared to Goku explicitly.
Goku learning SSJ3 first because he was dead, doesn't detract from Vegeta, or hell even Gotenks, learning it as soon as they know it's a thing with a bit of training.
Because simply knowing it exists, doesn't mean you can master it.
Goku himself literally, unironically, says it took him years in the manga to master SSJ3. Not learn it mind you, just master it to the point he had, which is why he's astounded Gotenks already reached that point. The fact Vegeta also got to said point, in a much shorter time just corroborates that.
You're ignoring the actual details in what this involves.
Yep, it took Goku literal years to actually master it, not find it was a thing, which he only did because of being dead in the first place. Vegeta took less time to "master it". Vegeta has also shown the ability, elsewhere, to learn things quicker, like, again, Moro arc. Not sure why you're acting like this is the only time but sure go on.
Sucks, I'll bring up whatever I want given your reasoning here isn't stated at all.
They're not "vastly different", they didn't get some sort of "learn better" buff.
This was something Vegeta literally had no experience with, they even give him slack for it. He learned it quicker.
Arguing that training in completely other things enabled him to somehow pick up this completely different thing ain't gonna fly.
"Always", bar the times the manga goes out of its way to show Vegeta doing stuff quicker.
Now, did you really quote like a month old post just to yap?
Goku learned of SSJ3 due to being dead, the conditions enabled him to find out it was a thing in the first place.
Vegeta wasn't dead, of course he wouldn't have found it himself. In spite of this, it still took Goku years by his own admission to actually master it. Vegeta took less time, so did Gotenks which astounded Goku, showing it isn't just a matter of "knowing" it's a thing, but actually doing so is complex. This makes the entire premise of your point faulty in how Goku learned it was a thing when nobody else did. Which was never the point anyway, given we're talking about time to master it, not figure out it's a thing to begin with.
Vegeta learned spirit stuff and IT at a explicitly noted quicker time compared to Goku. This isn't attributed to unrelated training.
Gets to a further point than Goku, in less time. Note, the only thing it's attributed to, is that fact he's "cut from a different cloth". That's it.
Unless you have actual canonical non-conjecture, Vegeta progressed quicker and further than Goku in something without having any prior training in it (To the point they call him out on how skewed his actual chi is and how imbalanced it is), don't waste my time.
We could bring up other times, but that's beside the point. But regardless. Vegeta learning SSJ3 in less time, is fine and dandy and not at all a contradiction given it isn't unprecedented, and Vegeta, can, and has, progressed at stuff quicker than Goku, this is a fact. Goku has found things quicker, but it isn't a universal thing.
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