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Conceptual absorption for Yhwach

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Adam1396

Adam1396

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This will be very straight forward.

Names in Bleach are concepts with meaning, power assigned to it. Name is someone's fundamental aspect of existence (concept)
Ichibe needs to name ichigo as "reio" to function as reio despite having the requirements of reio, again meaning name is important.


After absorbing WSK, Yhwach acts as reio.


Conclusion: Yhwach should have absorption on fundamental level(conceptual)
Agree: LordGriffin1000, Elizhaa (concept type 3)
Disagree:
 
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LordGriffin1000 said:
Well, he absorb the entity and as a side effect, he takes the name, no? He didn't absorb the name directly so would it really be absorption on a conceptual level?
Click to expand...
I think the argument is that Yhwach holding the cosmology together (as Jugram references) doesn’t just entail him having raw power comparable to that of Reio, but also the ”name” of Reio as well, which is supported by the first scan stating that Ichigo would’ve been given the name of Reio if they’d decided to make him the new linchpin.

I’m not sure if that directly addresses your concern, but it doesn’t make much sense to me personally that Yhwach would get a more fundamental component of Reio’s existence (his name) as a side effect of absorbing a less fundamental part of his existence (his body and power), if anything, the opposite makes more sense imo, given how Ichibei is able to modify someone’s power as a side effect of modifying their name.
 
TheLav69 said:
I think the argument is that Yhwach holding the cosmology together (as Jugram references) doesn’t just entail him having raw power comparable to that of Reio, but also the ”name” of Reio as well, which is supported by the first scan stating that Ichigo would’ve been given the name of Reio if they’d decided to make him the new linchpin.

I’m not sure if that directly addresses your concern, but it doesn’t make much sense to me personally that Yhwach would get a more fundamental component of Reio’s existence (his name) as a side effect of absorbing a less fundamental part of his existence (his body and power), if anything, the opposite makes more sense imo, given how Ichibei is able to modify someone’s power as a side effect of modifying their name.
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The name is still connected to the person in question, so he'd logically gain the status as a side effect. Regardless, I'll wait for the remaining knowledgeable Bleach members to give their thoughts.
 
LordGriffin1000 said:
The name is still connected to the person in question, so he'd logically gain the status as a side effect. Regardless, I'll wait for the remaining knowledgeable Bleach members to give their thoughts.
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It’s possible you’re right. Given how type 2 concepts are described on the wiki, it’s possible that Yhwach a directly absorbed his name, therefore he absorbs his power as a side effect, but it’s also possible that he absorbed his power, therefore he absorbs his name as a side effect, so I see what you mean, now.
 
LordGriffin1000 said:
Well, he absorb the entity and as a side effect, he takes the name, no? He didn't absorb the name directly so would it really be absorption on a conceptual level?
Click to expand...
Either way guarantees conceptual absorption. And he already interacted with/manipulated names prior to this.
 
PrinceofPein said:
This was downgraded recently to remove the CM, can anyone link the downgrade thread
Click to expand...
No? I don't believe Bleach ever had CM related to names or Ichibe's black removed.

Closest I can find is here where Bleach CM got readjusted.

vsbattles.com

Bleach high godly and concept hax

Looking through the bleach pages I have questions regarding some of the abilities due to how lacking the information is. high-godly regen: So where exactly in this scan does it imply informational regeneration? Because turning from an imaginary product to something real is way to vague in of...
vsbattles.com vsbattles.com

and here a completely unrelated instance of CM.

vsbattles.com

Possible CM removal for Soul King

There is a little problem i noticed here. The Soul King's profile says this: Death Manipulation, Life Manipulation and Conceptual Manipulation (Type 2: Created the concepts of life and death) After looking a bit deeper into the scans around i noticed something. From what i get, Life is...
vsbattles.com vsbattles.com
 
I mean, I believe this does make sense when collectively evaluated. Names in Bleach are the properties that provide power to objects and abilities, it's why removing or changing Names causes reality itself to warp and switch. If it's explained that Yhwach has become the new Soul King and acquired his power, it stands to reason that he gained this power through absorbing the thing that grants Soul King his power in the first place, his title as Soul King.

There is also some other supporting evidence, such as Yhwach being capable of restoring his name after it was manipulated by Ichibe, showing a consistent theme of Yhwach being capable of manipulating these fundamental aspects of himself with his powers.

All in all, I agree with the addition.
 
Deceived3596 said:
I mean, I believe this does make sense when collectively evaluated. Names in Bleach are the properties that provide power to objects and abilities, it's why removing or changing Names causes reality itself to warp and switch. If it's explained that Yhwach has become the new Soul King and acquired his power, it stands to reason that he gained this power through absorbing the thing that grants Soul King his power in the first place, his title as Soul King.

There is also some other supporting evidence, such as Yhwach being capable of restoring his name after it was manipulated by Ichibe, showing a consistent theme of Yhwach being capable of manipulating these fundamental aspects of himself with his powers.

All in all, I agree with the addition.
Click to expand...
Fair point. I guess it's fine then.
 
Deceived3596 said:
I mean, I believe this does make sense when collectively evaluated. Names in Bleach are the properties that provide power to objects and abilities, it's why removing or changing Names causes reality itself to warp and switch. If it's explained that Yhwach has become the new Soul King and acquired his power, it stands to reason that he gained this power through absorbing the thing that grants Soul King his power in the first place, his title as Soul King.

There is also some other supporting evidence, such as Yhwach being capable of restoring his name after it was manipulated by Ichibe, showing a consistent theme of Yhwach being capable of manipulating these fundamental aspects of himself with his powers.

All in all, I agree with the addition.
Click to expand...
This makes sense to me
 
neutral, but I'm more inclined to disagree, because it doesn't look like conceptual manipulation, something like manipulating information, as LuffyRuffy46307 said above
 
Gendolfgg1 said:
neutral, but I'm more inclined to disagree, because it doesn't look like conceptual manipulation, something like manipulating information, as LuffyRuffy46307 said above
Click to expand...
I'm sure you didn't read the thread well enough. Names are accepted to be concept type 2 for bleach.
And he absorbed the title that is maintaining the existence of the worlds
 
Read the profiles
Conceptual Statistics Reduction (Type 2 - When being used as a weapon, Ichimonji can cut the name and thus powers of anything it touches in half[14]), Conceptual Power Nullification and Memory Manipulation (Type 2 - Ichimonji releases ink that strips anything it touches of its name and powers. When Ichibe strips something of its name, no one retains any memories of that name[13]), Breaking the Fourth Wall (Ichibē can blot out names from speech bubbles using his Shikai[15][13][16]), Conceptual Power Modification (Type 2 - By changing someone’s name with his Shinuchi, Shirafude Ichimonji, Ichibē can change their power into whatever their new name becomes. For example, if he changes their name into “Black Ant” all of their powers will be comparable to that of a black ant[17]), Conceptual Sealing (Type 2 - Ichibē can manipulate names to seal people away, such as when he sealed Ikomikidomoe away by manipulating its name. He sealed Ikomikidomoe away for hundreds of thousands of years[18])
Click to expand...

Click to expand...
 
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