UeTa
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So basically, he just uses the infinite amount of magic power that Fairy Heart have to "push the button" that trigger the Space Between Time, and so the event called "Neo Eclipse" ?
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Fairy Tail: Revisiting Neo Eclipse
- Thread starter CloverDragon03
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I don't think resetting or erasing a part of time is considered to be pure AP here.
The exact same kind of feat wasn't enough to give this character a tier 3 or 2 rating, despite having world destroying statements and all; which would mean that Zeleph's case wouldn't be much different.
The exact same kind of feat wasn't enough to give this character a tier 3 or 2 rating, despite having world destroying statements and all; which would mean that Zeleph's case wouldn't be much different.
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- Thread starter
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Them being from the same author doesn't mean anything. They're still completely separate series and trying to use an example from a separate series shouldn't be viable at all.
Also, it's not just "from belief," it's just how it is in general. The hoops you need to jump through to say it'd be for the planet are insane.
Could you explain this one? Not familiar with this guy so I'm not sure what his deal is.
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The main Fairy Tail world, aka earthland, is the Universe's name as its called many time's to be the parallel universe of Edolas, Edolas is most recently described using 異世界 (at the bottom of the page), which literally translates to parallel universe, Mystogan uses Sekai to describe the ability to travel between different universes multiple times, this establishes that Sekai is more often than not used to describe the whole Universe, so when Zeref uses Sekai he most likely referring to the whole universe and not just the planet.
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The difference between the Edolas and Zeref's statement is Edolas uses 異世界, while Zeref uses 世界. They both have different meanings, Edolas panel uses Isekai which means parallel universe/different dimension but Zeref's statement uses Sekai which means world, society and universe.
Edolas using Isekai to mean universe can't be used to justify Zeref meaning universe when he says Sekai.
Mystogan scan makes sense but that's only 1 case where Sekai is being referred to as a universe, that's not enough to warrant that every time Sekai is used it would mean universe.
I don't think you understood what I meant. I'm not saying the series are related, I'm saying the author has previously used the concept of a planets time being removed so it's possible that the same was going to happen here.
We see in Fairy Tail multiple times characters are able to affect time of a limited space. Natsu burns through time yet he doesn't burn the entire universes time, Dimaria stops time yet she's not time stopping the entire universe so Zeref resetting time doesn't have to be the universes time.
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Well actually Edens Zero isn't relevant because he did that after Fairy Tail. So, he didn't previously use that concept, he uses it later if anything.
Also, Natsu was burning through Zeref's Time Magic, there's a difference, and we don't know the reach of Dimaria's time stop. It could be universal for all we know, we've never seen a limit to its range so we can't say what its limit is.
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I can see worlds being universes, in context. I am more or less neutral on the changes.
Mathematically, even time intervals of seconds contained uncountably infinite snapshots of spatial universes. Low 2-C is from destroying uncountably infinite snapshots of the spatial universe, but such cases like destroying time intervals like above are not treated as Low 2-C. I don't feel like having a contradictory view on the matter regarding the tiering. However, such cases are usually treated like hax.
Mathematically, even time intervals of seconds contained uncountably infinite snapshots of spatial universes. Low 2-C is from destroying uncountably infinite snapshots of the spatial universe, but such cases like destroying time intervals like above are not treated as Low 2-C. I don't feel like having a contradictory view on the matter regarding the tiering. However, such cases are usually treated like hax.
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Elizhaa is correct. Diavolo has something similar if I read his profile correctly.
Time Erasure and Causality Manipulation (King Crimson can erase up to ten seconds of time, removing space in the process. With this it allows him to erase all the process of the actions done in the erased time, leaving only its results)
Time Erasure and Causality Manipulation (King Crimson can erase up to ten seconds of time, removing space in the process. With this it allows him to erase all the process of the actions done in the erased time, leaving only its results)
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Bump
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I strongly disagree due to Vexzito, gin and elizhaa's reasonings
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Read the thread.
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I did before replying to the thread.
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Ngl, but he should have some clean ups, and should have a tier 3 (possibly) key through all fiction, but if this is what we have, then FT having it through logic just as weak, if not weaker should be dismissed. Obviously, I disagree with the OP
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I disagree atm for the reasons above
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I'll summon some more staff here
@Sir_Ovens @ByAsura @Dragonmasterxyz @LordGriffin1000 @Duedate8898 @Eficiente
Could you please take a look at this thread and give your opinions on it
@Sir_Ovens @ByAsura @Dragonmasterxyz @LordGriffin1000 @Duedate8898 @Eficiente
Could you please take a look at this thread and give your opinions on it
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1) "The difference between the Edolas and Zeref's statement is Edolas uses 異世界, while Zeref uses 世界. They both have different meanings, Edolas panel uses Isekai which means parallel universe/different dimension but Zeref's statement uses Sekai which means world, society and universe. Edolas using Isekai to mean universe can't be used to justify Zeref meaning universe when he says Sekai. Mystogan scan makes sense but that's only 1 case where Sekai is being referred to as a universe, that's not enough to warrant that every time Sekai is used it would mean universe."
2) "I can see worlds being universes, in context. I am more or less neutral on the changes. Mathematically, even time intervals of seconds contained uncountably infinite snapshots of spatial universes. Low 2-C is from destroying uncountably infinite snapshots of the spatial universe, but such cases like destroying time intervals like above are not treated as Low 2-C. I don't feel like having a contradictory view on the matter regarding the tiering. However, such cases are usually treated like hax."
3) "Elizhaa is correct. Diavolo has something similar if I read his profile correctly. Time Erasure and Causality Manipulation (King Crimson can erase up to ten seconds of time, removing space in the process. With this it allows him to erase all the process of the actions done in the erased time, leaving only its results)"
4)"I don't think resetting or erasing a part of time is considered to be pure AP here. The exact same kind of feat wasn't enough to give this character a tier 3 or 2 rating, despite having world destroying statements and all; which would mean that Zeleph's case wouldn't be much different."
(there are more arguments against 3-A, i just picked 4 at the moment)
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I'm don't really like using other characters from different verses as arguments for or against topics for another verse. With that said, when time stuff is involved, we usually assume it's on a universal scale unless proven otherwise. However, this ability seems like pure hax to me, even though the side effect of him doing this would "destroy" that part of the timeline by reseting back 400 years.
At best, I see this as 3-A Environmental Destruction if we consider it to be on a universal scale which is possible. So I guess I'm in favor of a "possible" 3-A Environmental Destruction rating but those are just my thoughts.
At best, I see this as 3-A Environmental Destruction if we consider it to be on a universal scale which is possible. So I guess I'm in favor of a "possible" 3-A Environmental Destruction rating but those are just my thoughts.
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Last I checked it was being argued for as ED
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Thing is, most everyone is agreeing that Neo Eclipse will in fact destroy the universe, people just seem to take issue with the idea since other characters who have time hax don't have the 3-A rating, but I don't think that matters that much IMO
I still think 3-A Enviormental Destruction is still valid
I still think 3-A Enviormental Destruction is still valid
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Shouldn't the same be changed for ars-magia?
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Ars-Magia is irrelevant right now, but I guess it would be High 6-A Environmental Destruction? Not sure tbh
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It would technically be a double standard if we give Neo Eclipse 3A when Kumagawa (or people similar to him) don't, especially when his is pretty blatant in its ability to destroy everything. If anything, it seems more like everything will be destroyed simply because of the reversal of time, not because it's actually destroying the entire universe, which wouldn't really qualify for a 3A rating. Possibly High 3A works much better.
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If they're replicating a similar feat to Neo Eclipse, they should get the same thing.
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He's literally able to destroy the entire world with All fiction, which is a better and more reliable feat than Neo Eclipse's feat, which just seems to be time reversal...at best. It would definitely be universal on some degree (ie. universal range), but I wouldn't give it any kind of AP upgrade. Possibly High 3A is fine by me, tho
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A lot of the counter arguments boil down to "Well another character didn't get this rating, so neither should Neo Eclipse", but I don't agree with that counter argument as the story explicitly makes a point of saying the world will be destroyed, erased, crumble, etc.
I am fine with giving other characters with the same feat the rating, but even then, other verses have no impact on this suggested feat and revision
I am fine with giving other characters with the same feat the rating, but even then, other verses have no impact on this suggested feat and revision
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I'm not really saying that. I'm just saying that it's a double standard if that's what we're going to accept. Obviously, it was merely a side-argument (thingy). The main thing is the purpose of Neo Eclipse in the first place.
The whole thing with the world being destroyed, erased, crumbled, etc. is literally because of the time reversal. It wouldn't be an AP feat. Definitely a range feat...but it wouldn't be solid enough to warrant High 3A. possibly High 3A works much better...
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Is the destruction of a universe through roundabout means that doesn't scale to a character's AP not the definition of ED?
vsbattles.fandom.com
We give Pucci Low 2-C for this reasoning "Universe level+ through universal reset (Made in Heaven will accelerate time until the universe is reset)" this is 1 for 1 with what's being proposed, except it's not a full timeline so it's just 3-A.
Environmental Destruction
Environmental Destruction describes a character's capability to damage and destroy an area around themselves, but not necessarily their capacity to realistically harm their opponent. In practice, this is essentially a non-combat applicable Attack Potency; if a character is able to cause weather...
vsbattles.fandom.com
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Pucci's reset is completely different, apples to oranges at best. Pucci's is very well explained on several occasions, via himself, other characters and WoG. He also accomplishes this in starting a brand new universe that was very different than the original universe. He also did his in a very different manner, as opposed to Neo Eclipse.
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Could you elaborate a bit?
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I can but you'd have to give me some time, Made in Heaven is a very complicated Stand but it's Universal Reset (outright described, shown and explained in the Mange and various other sources several times.)
Made In Heaven in short causes the universe to hit a "vanishing point." where the universe will be destroyed and a new one will be born, a new universe where history plays out exactly accordingly how Araki defines "Fate." and it's successful in doing so. The two situations are very different contextually, Neo Eclipse uses a different Kanji whilst Made in Heaven uses Isekai and is shown to be effecting the universe as opposed to the planet.
He basically altered to timeline to be completely different, giving us Steel Ball Run and Jojolin as a result. It's also very consistent in-verse as there are several Stands who can effect Infinity, Tusk ACT4 and GER respectively.
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Oh...interesting...
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Pretty sure Low 2C from that was already rejected, and even then the issue is how said things are being destroyed.Did nobody see this picture that I posted earlier? Even by "resetting" one timeline, Zeref is actually erasing 3 futures (timelines?) within one timeline because of a timeline split.
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