Lostbelt 5 Revision: STELLA and NANOMACHINES SON Edition

New Keys

Atlantis Artemis, Chiron, Corday and Paris should get their own keys. They are amplified than their normal forms due to having nanomachines while Artemis is just eh, look at her. Jason should get one too, albeit he doesn't have nanomachines, he got Golden Hind as his Argo.

I also argue that Aviceron will get their Lostbelt 1 key. This revision will extend to Russian Lostbelt, you'll get it later. Also, I think Adam shouldn't have his own tier, he's basically a weapon, it should in Aviceron's key just like any other weapon.

Abilities
Lostbelt Chiron: Nanotechnology (Most Servants in Atlantis managed to get nanomachines from the remains of the Gods, giving them the ability to heal themselves and increase their capabilities in combat), Resistance to Disease Manipulation (Nanomachines gives resistance to diseases)

Lostbelt Paris: Nanotechnology (Most Servants in Atlantis managed to get nanomachines from the remains of the Gods, giving them the ability to heal themselves and increase their capabilities in combat), Transformation (Can transform into an arrow using Apollo's Authority), Data Manipulation (Apollo was able to download data of his Lostbelt self), Resistance to Disease Manipulation (Nanomachines gives resistance to diseases)

Lostbelt Corday: Nanotechnology (Most Servants in Atlantis managed to get nanomachines from the remains of the Gods, giving them the ability to heal themselves and increase their capabilities in combat), Electricity Manipulation and Transformation (Was transforming her body into metal and emitted electricity when her nanomachines went berserk), Pseudo-Battle Continuation (Gained an ability to not die by fatal injuries as long as her mission is accomplished), Aura (Has aura of bloodlust with Zeus's nanomachines), Resistance to Disease Manipulation ([https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/644740076349292544/659687774638702592/Screenshot_20191226_182318_com.google.android.youtube.jpg Nanomachines gives resistance to diseases)

Artemis: Nanotechnology and Power Bestowal (Gods are able to produce nanomachines, giving the users the ability to heal themselves and increase their capabilities in combat), Duplication (Artemis has multiple terminals that she can deploy and have control over), Self-Destruction (Artemis' terminals can self-destruct), Teleportation and BFR (Can teleport herself and others with her Authority), Abstract Existence (Greek Gods, just like any other Gods, comes from nature and concepts), Large Size (Type 3; 1.5km big), Inorganic Physiology (Type 2), Telepathy (Read Orion's mind) and Reactive Evolution Negation (Heracles wasn't able to evolve and become immune to her Noble Phantasm even when hit twice)

Lostbelt Jason: Nanotechnology (While he didn't implemented himself with nanomachines, he used it to turn Golden Hind into Argo), Energy Projection, Weather Manipulation and Summoning (As Argo is originally Golden Hind, he should have these abilities) and Illusion Creation (Medea gave him an ability to cover up his own wounds, letting other see that he is fine when he is not)

Goetia: Air Manipulation and BFR (Capable of creating powerful air that will blow anyone away), Teleportation (Was shown to be able to teleport)


AP
Artemis' NP can destroy stars. It's 4-C by description. She has complete control over stars too, tier 4 Artemis shouldn't be an outlier. Though this is also likely 2-A, considering with just two shots, she managed to destroy Orion's NP. So Artemis and anyone scales to her will be At least 4-C, likely 2-A. As for speed, there is a calc currently going on but DMUA is saving my ass by calculating the distance of Artemis orbit. So we add that when it's done. Artemis' movement speed is immobile though.

There are three people who scales. Zeus first, it's stated that he is comparable to it. Ivan for second, it's stated by Caenis in LB1 that Ivan is comparable to Zeus, and lastly Aviceron with Adam, as ya know, it kicked his teeth in.

As for Noble Phantasm that will scale, Mold Camelot will for blocking strikes from Iva. Combination of Achilles' Akhilleus Cosmos and Meteor Spear will scale too, not like he used that to anyone. Durindana will scale, hold your horses, this was Stella Durindana, it was nothing comparable to normal Durindana. Mandricardo with Durandal scales too but this was also Stella.

For Herc tanking Artemis, he didn't do it with God Hand alone, he was buffed even further by Casters, so that won't scale to him. And we don't know if it was Medea and it was plural so we also won't scale it to her.

What about Servants with Nanomachines? They should be At least 6-C. They should be superior to villagers who daily hunts beasts including boars and able to kill soliders who are stronger than villagers. I'm thinking Corday's NP being High 6-C for killing Cerberus but considering alive Herc can beat it, I don't think that's the case. Argo in Atlantis should be High 6-C scaling from Golden Hind though.

So basically the changes in tiers are:

Paris: Island level (Has D-Rank Strength, making him comparable to servants like Emiya), higher with Troia Velos (As an A-Rank Anti-Unit Noble Phantasm it should be comparable to Durindana) | At least Island level (Was able to to keep up with Achilles and managed to take many nanomachines amped soldiers)

Corday: Wall level (Despite her E-rank strength, she should be as strong as even the weakest Servants who are able to crush skulls like they were eggshells) | At least Island level (Managed to kill one of the nanomachines amped soldiers and killed Odysseus with Noble Phantasm)

Jason: Island level (As a servant with C rank Strength, he should be comparable to Sasaki Kojirou). Higher with Astrapste Argo (Capable of summoning the Argonauts for combat, including Heracles, Atalanta and Medea Lily) | Island level (Was able to kill one of the nanomachines amped soldiers and somehow fought Chiro even in near death). Large Island level with Astrapste Argo (As it was originally Golden Hind, it should be comparable to it)

Chiron: Island level (He can shoot down Atalanta's arrows. Can fight and injure both Mordred and Achilles in close combat and fought Achilles in his Duel Field with his bare hands. Antares Snipe is much stronger than his normal arrows and can fatally wound most Servants) | At least Island level (Stronger than himself in Greater History of Man due to having his data, getting even his Noble Phantasm and boosted even further by nanomachines from Zeus. Able to damage Achilles to the point of death and was able to fight Jaso even in near death)

Artemis: Island level (As a combat-ready Servant with D-Rank Strength, she should be comparable to EMIYA. Fought against Anne Bonny and Mary Read, Edward Teach and Hector, and contributed to the defeat of Demon God Forneus during Okeanos. Fought Marie Antoinette, Saint George, Chevalier d'Eon, Caesar, Caligula and Altera during the Moon Festival event). Large Island level with Tri-star Amore Mio and Mikotto (As an A+-Rank Anti-Unit Noble Phantasms, they are comparable to Caliburn) | At least Star level, likely Multiverse level+ (Stated multiple times that her beams are able to bring down and destroy stars and has full control over stars as a God. Managed to destroy Grand Archer Orion's Noble Phantasm by shooting twice)

Mash's Durability: Island level (Fought against and presumably traded blows with Lancelot and a weakened Demon God, and has fought numerous other beings like Saber Alter and her Lancer counterpart as well as C├║ Chulainn Alter), much higher with Mana Defense (With enough mana, she would supposedly be able to defend an entire country from attack). Continent level with Lord Chaldeas (Tanked C├║ Chulainn's Wicker Man without a scratch and blocked a direct Excalibur Morgan blast. Was also able to defend against a Grail boosted Atilla's Teardrop Photon Ray, which is this strong, albeit she needed help from Boudica's Chariot to do so). At least Star level, likely Multiverse level+ with Mold Camelot (Able to take bloodlusted electricity bolt from Iva who is comparable to Zeus). Multiverse level+ with Lord Camelot (Completely nullified Beast I's Ars Almadel Salomonis and while Mash died due to the sheer heat of the attack, her shield remained unscathed)

Hector: Island level (Is comparable to Achilles, having fought him in life and only lost by a paper-thin difference in skill. In Okeanos, he fought a few battles against Shielder, Francis Drake, Orion and Asterios). Higher with Durindana (An A-rank Anti-Army Noble Phantasm that is powerful enough to pierce through and kill Heracles and fatally wound Asterios with a single throw. When Hector was alive, Durindana managed to penetrate the original Rho Aias' up to the final layer before stopping). At least Star level, likely Multiverse level+ with Suicide Attack Durindana (By powering it up to the point of death, it can match True Form Artemis)

Achilles: Island level (Comparable to Karna, and could wound the Nameless Vampire. His final punch against Chiron boasted power on par with a Noble Phantasm), higher with Troias Tragōidia (Can easily mow down golems with physical capabilities comparable to weaker Servants, and can reduce other Servants to a red paste). Unknow with Akhilleus Kosmos (Achilles is able to advance forward and crush his opponents with the miniature world when used as an attack). At least Star level, likely Multiverse level+ with combination of Akhilleus Kosmos and Diatrekhōn Astēr Lonkhē (With the combination of power of these weapons, Hephaestus was able to create a weapon that will overpower and kill True Form Artemis)

Ivan: At least Star level, likely Multiverse level+ (Comparable to the Ancient Gods and was stated by Caenis to be able to defeat the chief Divine Spirit under Kirischtaria, also known as Zeus, and as such he should be comparable to True Form Artemis)

Aviceron: Wall level (Like most other Caster-class Servants, he's physically helpless when compared to other Servants, but he is still much stronger than humans of the modern era). Island level with golems (They're comparable to weaker Servants, and can slow down stronger Servants like Mordred). Higher with Adam (It will eventually grow to a thousand meters in height, and it will ultimately paint over the entire planet with its Reality Marble) | Wall level. Island level with golems (Was able to contend with other Servants in Russian Lostbelt). At least Star level, likely Multiverse level+ with Adam (Managed to damage Lostbelt King Iva)

This looks good to me

I agree

Agree.

Agreed about just adding Adam to Avicebron's normal AP, even if he treats it as its own being.

I am gonna trust you about the basic nanomachine abilities since I can't read that, totally agree there.

Agree with everything else in abilities but not sure about the negation. I think it is mentioned in Okeanos that as a gift of the Gods, Artemis should just completely ignore Godhand, kinda like a CEO ignoring the special privileges of a lower rank worker, until Orion reminds her she has his stats and powers, not hers.

Pretty alright with the Artemis AP thing, her NP would just be Higher if she can already manipulate stars normally.

I would specify that Adam needs to grow enough to reach that level. As the Apocrypha novel notes, even a pretty normal Servant could kill the thing when he is first activated and starts growing. Though I am damn near tempted to call it an outlier, but he doesn't have much showings to make you think otherwise.

Am more unsure about Akhilleus Cosmos and Mold Camelot, but sounds alright.. Also, remind me what was the "Stella" Durandina all about and if Durandina was left undamaged after being used like that?

Basically Durindana used as a Suicide Attack. He powers it up to her point of death. Yeah, it wasn't damaged but I think it's outlier that Durindana survived that.

Question. Will what apply to Artemis here will too on Meltryllis? Also, are you sure it's Star, not Planet? Since the kanji for both can be the same. For now, i can agree with the most part already.

So Living Ivan would be bumped to Star and Multiverse level? I dunno about this one tbh

@Velox NGL i kinda saw this coming

She is more associated with star than planet, isn't she? Plus lots of people refers to earth in this lostbelt as wakusei, as opposed to hoshi.

Hmm, true. Guess that counts

This works for me.

To be fair, aside Living Ivan scaling i agree with everything here, it just sound ridiculous that Living Ivan should be star and multiversal level

It said on the mats that Durandal cant be destroyed even Roland tried it. So Durindina surviving isnt an outlier.

Where is the 2-A comefrom?

I honestly consider the whole Durindana thing an outright outlier.

Hephaustus had to combine one of his creations and Achilles' spear for something comparable, while Orion ended up using the bow of a god and an arrow special crafted from the body of a Servant. We literally have it above even the likes of Ea and other sacrificial NPs like Stella and Ozy's temple getting thrown as a whole. It just feels odd and wonky.

I'd be tempted to say it surviving is less of an outlier as Durindana's indestructability is one of its qualities, kinda like Arondight.

Yeah, Durindana = Durandal = Indestructable

But yeah, that's my opinion, I see the Sacrifice Durindana thing as an outlier and would only entertain a Possibly Star Level, Possibly Multiverse level if the others really wanna go with it.

Where did the 2-A comefrom?

Scaling from Grand Archer Orion.

Destroying Orion's NP. Orion was a Grand at that moment, meaning comparable to Beasts, meaning comparable to 2-A people.

and why grand archer orion is 2-A? dont say its because he is grand.

LSirLancelotDuLacl said:

Destroying Orion's NP. Orion was a Grand at that moment, meaning comparable to Beasts, meaning comparable to 2-A people.

Click to expand...

ah, i think we cant do that, i mean seriously we give 2-A to random servant with a scaling chain, while the scaling chain itself is a complete mess, Unknown is best IMO


as someone who read lostbelt, 2-A Avicebron is not funny.

... Yes, because he's a Grand. Grands can battle Beasts. Is literally one of their functions. Or are you seriously saying we should assume he can't even hurt the things he is sent to kill?

Which servant are you calling random?

Orion, who exists to kill Beasts?

Adam or Ivan, who are stated to be comparable to Zeus?

LSirLancelotDuLacl said:

... Yes, because he's a Grand. Grands can battle Beasts. Is literally one of their functions. Or are you seriously saying we should assume he can't even hurt the things he is sent to kill?

Click to expand...

Okay if you want that way, the attack that overpowered Orion NP is only capable of destroy a fking island, unknown is still better

And the scaling chain Goes to Ivan and Avicebron? Are you joking? Ivan NP even only capable of destroying a couple of mountain, actually there is many inconsistencies for 2-A in Nasuverse i just don't want to bring it since i don't really care, but 2-A Avicebron is just too much.

Unknown? It has feats and statements on its own, unknown is used when it lacks one. Not to mention it's not only, it killed Hephaestus who is, I don't know, has the same power as her and 12 Gods of Olympus.

Hell no, it can kill Zeus. Caenis is trustable, she is a Greek who've seen 12 Gods and one of the Divine Spirit of Wodime. It's not to Aviceron himself it's for Adam.

Also btw, that's AoE fallacy.

Are you really gonna use the AoE fallacy for this? Should we also downgrade Goetia since his beam NP doesn't destroy the multiverse? This is irrelevant.

Is not 2-A Avicebron, it is Possibly 2-A Adam at full power.

Let's be real here, None of them have actual 2-A feats except with scaling chain, even of all nasuverse character only CCC servant who have actual feats and probably from Shinjuku quantum thing, and even if it just AoE fallacy the laser beam from Artemis should penetrated the earth if it really 2-A, sorry but my Logic cannot grasp it, how the fk a 2-A laser cant even penetrated a fking planet.

Its unknown still better because none of them have the actually feats, cmon every servant just pop out out of nowhere and its become 2-A with almost no feats, scaling chain is just a nonsense that even not present in the Nasuverse, in Nasuverse everything is up to the writer, i've seem so many stronger even 2-A servant killed by a fking fodder, A=B=C Logic almost not present if it come to "who is stronger than who?" "Who is comparable to who?" in the Nasuverse, Alien God the culprit of Lostbelt cannot dive into a sea and many more.

At this point we should ignoring GL with his ignorant statement, or because he's salty that his provosal for the 1-A Last boss always dismished

Anyway i'm still neutral on Ivan being scaled to Star and Multiversal level

If a servant has been shown to Hurt 2-A character i can let it pass, but these servant even never met each other.

Veloxt1r0kore said:

At this point we should ignoring GL with his ignorant statement, or because he's salty that his provosal for the 1-A Last boss always dismished

Anyway i'm still neutral on Ivan being scaled to Star and Multiversal level

Click to expand...

Ha jokes on you Ultima already said to me that it seems 1-A, and the only thing i should do is to discuss how high she is into 1-A.

Sure, now go make a thread to downgrade most of the verses here if scaling chains aren't allowed. I hope you aren't proposing something this illogical in a serious manner. I don't know, you tell me how Might Guy can jump on air without causing something comparable to a nuclear explosion from air friction.

Every... Servant? GL, can you actually make a lick of sense please? I don't even like the 2-A rating, but the only ones with them are God tiers; People with full control of the moon cell, people comparable to that, beasts, Grands (who, surprisingly, are meant to fight and be able to hurt them), and people that compare to any of those.

I'll seriously stop wasting my time even addressing a response to you if this sentimental logic is all you are gonna offer.

Im not say the scaling chain is not allowed but use a completely nonsense scaling chain is indeed a problem.

>Hurt 2-A characters

They are able to hurt 2-A characters. Orion gets insta killed when he gets hit, that's why Hector and other Servants sacrificed themselves. And penetrating is AoE fallacy too.

2-A Servants killed by fodder? Who? Goetia? Weakened by Ars Nova. Arjuna? Weakened by Jinako. Adam? Not the same one in Apo. Surtr? Weakened by probability hax of Napoleon. Who are you referring to?

Beasts are comparable in power. Grands are meant to kill them. Kiara is comparable to herself in CCC, meaning stronger than BB. Artemis was able to destroy the NP of one of those Grands.

Is pretty freaking straightforward. All you are literally doing is an argument from incredulity because of AoE fallacy.

I disagree with nonsense scaling too. CCC=Beasts=Grands=Greek Gods=Ivan and NPs.

Pretty straightforward. I mean this better than Fairy Tail or Baki scaling.

I dunno man, Star/Multiversal level Ivan soubd really iffy to me, and by that upgrade mean his High 6-C should be gone?

It feels odd, but sadly that doesn't change common logic.

Im actually doesnt really care about 2-A Orion but, 2-A Ivan and Adam is just... AoE fallacy is only available if they already shown to hurt someone higher than his AoE, besides scaling chain they really never have 2-A feats. im still think unknown should be better for Ivan and Adam.