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One Piece Post-Timeskip Scaling and Calcs #8

Damage3245

Damage3245

He/Him
VS Battles
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Quite a few calcs have been remade in the light of certain errors being discovered in previous calcs, this means that a lot of the current scaling chains for Post-Timeskip characters are obsolete and require a thorough examination. Here is a rough list of all the calcs to take into consideration.

Here is the previous thread.

Current Topics

  • Finalizing the new and updated scaling the Dressrosa Arc characters.
  • Discussing the scaling for the Whole Cake Island characters, and Yonkou Commanders in general.
 
So, a finalized version for the Dressrosa Saga in its entirety, excluding movie characters for now:-

Unknwo: Koala, Sugar

Unknow, likely Low 7-B+ (Uknown, likely 5.8MT): Orlumbus

Low 7-B+ (5.8MT): Nami, Chopper, Usopp, Brook, Monet, Pre-Awakening Sai, Baby Five, Buffalo, Viola, Tashigi, Overdosed Hody Jones, Leo, Ideo, Jora, Franky, Senior Pink, Machivise, Hajrudin, Bellamy, Elizabello w/ Lite King Punch

At least Low 7-B+ (At least 5.8MT): "Monster" Hody Jones, Delinger, Gladius, Bartolomeo, Cavendish w/o Hakuba, Base Lao G

At least Low 7-B+, likely higher (At least 5.8MT, likely higher): Old Chinjao, Sai (Post-Awakening), Cavendish w/ Hakuba, Lao G with Power Released from Training, Base Luffy

At most Low 7-B+, likely far higher (At most 5.8MT, likely far higher): Prime Chinjao*

At least Low 7-B+, likely 7-A+ (At least 5.8MT, likely 838MT): Nico Robin

7-B (35MT): Elizabello w/ King Punch, Bartolomeo's barriers

Likely 7-A+ (Likely 838MT): Base Pica, Diamante, Kyros, Trebol, Sanji, Vergo, Smoker

7-A+ (838MT): Pica w/ Stone Golems

At least 7-A+ (At least 838MT): Roronoa Zoro, Trafalgar Law, Black Knight, Gear 2nd and 3rd Luffy, Fujitora, Sabo, Jesus Burgess

At least 7-A+ (At least 838MT), likely High 7-A (>1GT but <2.5GT): Donquixote Doflamingo

High 7-A+ (>2.5GT): Gear 4th Luffy

6-C (46GT): Fujitora w/ meteors

  • Dziga bring up on the last thread that Prime Chinjao could be At most Low 7-B+, likely 7-B (>>>5.8MT, likely >6.3MT) or just Likely 7-B (>6.3MT) for being considerably so above the other Low 7-B+. I'm okay with the current rating I have for him but if others favor one of these more then....
 
Thank you for summarizing the ratings PlumCrayfish, that is pretty helpful.

I have a couple of things I want to sort out with calc group members (just double-checking for accuracy) but the scaling there looks generally fine.

Although I want to check, what is Law scaling to here? Being stronger than Pica's Stone Golems?
 
According to Cin it was from stomping Vergo in a fight but being inferior to Doffy so most likely.
 
He stomped Vergo by using his ability that bypasses durability, so that seems a bit off to me.
 
Damage3245 said:
He stomped Vergo by using his ability that bypasses durability, so that seems a bit off to me.
Click to expand...
I thought only Gamma Knife dypasses durability
 
Well plums makes sense

he also did survive hits from Vergo while weakened from his heart being crushed.
 
I thought only Gamma Knife dypasses durability

Law's spatial cutting bypasses durability as well.
 
@Cin you didn't place Duffy at likely high 7-A, you just put high 7-A. There's a slight but noticeable difference. Otherwise, while you are right about the majority of the feats presented it doesn't change much.

As you admitted, Luffy can take blunt damage.

Duffy isn't powerful enough in that regard.

Cracker could damage him slashing.

Could Duffy damage him slashing? We don't know. He never succeded. Would Luffy have negated the damage from Cracker if he'd used blunt force? We don't know, Luffy doesn't have that feat except in his Tankman form after absorbing many biscuit soldiers.

Cracker was defeated in one shot but it was by Tankman, not Boundman. The latter has no feats against Cracker. Cracker's durability scales from his soldiers and hurting Luffy and being cited as the strongest CoA Luffy's seen. His body was entact after blasting through at least a few soldiers while they were destroyed. As a minimum, his durability should be several times the soldiers which are comparable to base Duffy in feats. Arguably greater since Luffy gets stronger after every fight.

I'm fine with likely high 7-A for Duffy, but Cracker should get it as well if not just High 7-A (No likely).
 
Just pointing out a thing said in the previous thread: Luffy isn't weak against cutting damage. He has no defenses against it unless he uses Haki. Nobody in OP sans some special cases like Buggy, Daz Bonez, Kaido and Linlin is resistant to cutting-piercing damage. This isn't Bleach where the body's Durability is increased in a way that looks like the flesh's density is higher than the average.

Luffy is as susceptible to cutting damage as Sanji or Nami are. Even Jinbe'd be harmed from a sword slash. That's what make Kaido and BM so special.

>Law's scaling

We're scaling Law to the Black Knight and for briefly managing to match Doffy. Vergo whooping him while weakened is his Durability justification since he can't truly scale to Doffy. The moment the Ten Yasha becomes serious Law gets stomped badly.
 
For the other characters I forgotten about or didn't add before:

Unknown, likely Low 7-B+ (Unknown, likely 5.8MT): Baccarat (Flim Gold)

Unknown, likely 7-A+ (Unknown, likely 838MT): Surume the Kraken [For his Durability, not sure about AP]

Likely 7-A+ (Likely 838MT): Donquixote Rosinante, Ain (Flim Z)

At least 7-A+ (At least 838MT): Old Zephyr (Flim Z)

At least 7-A+ (At least 838MT), likely High 7-A (>1GT but <2.5GT): Gild Tersoro (Flim Gold)

Possibly 6-C (46GT): Prime Zephyr
 
Damage3245 said:
He stomped Vergo by using his ability that bypasses durability, so that seems a bit off to me.
Click to expand...
He withstood blows from Vergo using Haki, and his Counter Shock did clear visible damage to him. (Heart Squeezing being the only thing keeping him in check) Also, the fact that his DF power easily bypassed Vergo's Haki should indicate his supremacy over him.

I'm gonna be inactive for now because I just got my wisdom teeth removed, and yeah.
 
Oh damn sorry to hear Cin I completely know how much like hell that feels like (got all 4 of mine removed at once.)
 
@Fix - Also, with the sole exception of Gear 4th (cuz he's constantly using Haki in attacks), Haki is not applied to the AP of characters, and at best, would afford a "Likely" if they only still managed to harm a character w/ Haki if their previously scaling conflicted.

(ex: someone consistently harming Low 7-B characters with and without Haki, but still showing the ability to seriously damage someone like 7-A with Haki would afford them a "likely 7-A", and the description would note they could hurt x 7-A character, albeit only with Haki)
 
That's pretty messed up given every living creature in OP has haki. It is also a given that if they are fighting they would not be suppressing it.

Won't say more then that now though out of respect for the teeth. Been there . . . .
 
@Fix - Statistics Amplification does not apply to a user's ratings unless said Statistics Amp has a specific multiplier, additive, or a feat in itself. All we know is that Bound Man is 3x stronger than his previous limit, and all of his attacks are coated in Haki, so his AP would not receive an increase via Haki since he's... constantly using it.

There's like no feat w/ Haki to my memory that has been displayed by a mid to high tier character that is comparable or even notable when looking at other feats they've displayed, or scale to. And we know of no stated additive or multiplier for Haki in terms of AP or Dura, so we can not apply it to anyone's stats, and putting "higher" with Haki is redundant and would take effort for every single page.
 
Cin is correct regarding Haki. In the past I used to wonder about it, but it should be redundant to try and mention it on every Haki users page and would just complicate things.
 
It sounds like dangerous territory to me. Who is and isn't using haki for this feat but not this feat . . . not using it for anyone besides Luffy . . . I see major scaling problems arising in the future.

Still, if Cin and Damage both agree on said policy I won't refute it. At least not right now.
 
While we're at it, could we possibly refine a couple of the justifications section?

Doflamingo's is excessive currently, and some of the feats listed there could probably be moved to an actual Feats section further down the page if necessary.
 
@Captain Torch; Chinjao's Drill Dragon Nail which was recalced by Cin to be Small City level+.

This would give Chinjao's durability, and some other characters AP (roughly) as a result.
 
@Damage

At least Mountain level+ with Black Knight (Pressured Trafalgar Law and keep him on the defensive. Capable of overpowering Luffy); At least Mountain level+ (Stronger than Pica and Vergo, took no damage from Aokiji's casual freezing. Easily far stronger and superior to Luffy in his Base, Gear 2nd and 3rd), likely Large Mountain level himself (Although shown to be weaker than Bound Man Luffy, he was still capable of trading blows with him), higher with Awakening (Should be far more powerful than his normal threads. Even without Haki, the threads were capable of keeping Gear 4th Luffy at bay for over 20 minutes)

How's that

@Captain Torch

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/U...sa_Feats#Elizabello.27s_Lite_King_Punch_Redux
 
I gotta say that this:

  • only incapable of harming Luffy only because of Luffy's Bound Man utilizing Haki in a way that allowed him to retain his rubbery stature, thus mitigating the impact of his physical strikes
Is still too speculative. Yes, Doflamingo couldn't hurt Luffy. And Luffy's rubbery body helped mitigate his strikes.

But that doesn't prove that Doflamingo would be capable of harming Gear 4 Luffy if Gear 4 Luffy wasn't rubbery,
 
Why don't you merge the justifications for Doffy and his Black Knight since it's essentially the same rating (Mountain level+) in the current situation?
 
IIRC the Black Knight was going to scale to Mountain level without +. Guess with so many calcs it's hard to keep up with it.
 
Yeah, that was before we decided to scale everyone to Pica's 800 Megaton feat.

Still not sure how to feel about tbh.
 
Dr.Fix said:
It sounds like dangerous territory to me. Who is and isn't using haki for this feat but not this feat . . . not using it for anyone besides Luffy . . . I see major scaling problems arising in the future.
Click to expand...
Haki doesn't have a clear increase in value for Attack or Defense. It'd be foolish to try and scale characters w/ Haki.

They're scaling from a Fujitora and Pica feat easily Mountain+ and neither used Haki (if they even could in such a situation anyways).

Luffy constantly uses Haki w/ Gear 4th and thus the 3x statement applies to him utilizing Busoshoku. There's only 2 characters (Doflamingo w/ Awakening and Katakuri w/ Awakening) that even fully scale to Bound Man Luffy for deflecting/blocking his attacks, putting him on the defensive and having him rely on evasion, and in the case of Katakuri, shown harming Luffy.
 
Burning Full Fingers said:
Why don't you merge the justifications for Doffy and his Black Knight since it's essentially the same rating (Mountain level+) in the current situation?
Click to expand...
We could also give the Black Knight and Doflamingo separate keys as well. Just like we did with Charlotte Cracker
 
@PlumCrayfish, at this point with the way the ratings are, there wouldn't be much point. Better to just merge it into Doffy's key.
 
We still need to get some input on how to properly calculate the Bird-Cage durability from the strongest meteorite, as I'm sure that will further affect the scaling. But for the 7-A+ ratings, that would mostly remain the same from Gear 3rd Luffy/Fujitora and anyone scaling to or below that.

Katakuri, Possibly Cracker to an extent, Doflamingo, and Bound Man Luffy (+whoever else scales to or above these characters) would all be affected if we agree that the threads scale to Doflamingo (my opinion on this is clear, I'm sure).
 
@Damage - Also, you brought up in a previous post that Awakening does not have a statement or indication of increasing the AP of the user. So by that statement, I believe it would be necessary to note that this would make both Doflamingo and Katakuri High 7-A in AP since they both scale somewhat comparable to Bound Man Luffy.

Unless the topic needs to be re-evaluated.
 
Yeah, I'll work on it, but we need to edit profiles regarding the Low 7-B+ stats, if one of you would like to do it. I'll do the KKG calc some time, but I'm sluggish today.

7-A+ to High 7-A stats are also accepted, right? If so, change accordingly, but Law should be flat 7-A+ for taking hits from Vergo (w/ Haki), hurting him, and ultimately beating him in their fight, and Vergo would only be "Likely 7-A+" Scaling at least equal to Pica in Base.
 
Also, I suggest changing Luffy's current Post time-skip page to only having one key, same with Zoro and Sanji.

Luffy should actually probably have the following: "At least Low 7-B+, likely far higher in Base" For scaling above Coliseum fighters, and that he shouldn't be obscenely weaker than Sanji or Zoro, "7-A+ with Gear 2nd" (Scaling to Zoro, and Black Knight, the latter scaling to Law), "At least 7-A+ With Gear 3rd" (Stronger than Gear 2nd), "At least 7-A+, likely higher with Snake-Man" (Matched Katakuri, who is far stronger than Gear 3rd, and this is before we assume Katakuri and Doflamingo both scale to their Awakening for hurting Luffy, otherwise "High 7-A" for Snake-Man), "High 7-A with Bound Man" (Noted by Doflamingo to be 3x stronger than his previous limit), "Possibly High 7-A with Tank-Man" (The Full version of this form ultimately one-shot Cracker and all of his Biscuit Soldiers simultaneously, and should be comparable to his other Gear 4th transformations).
 
I still think Base Luffy in Dressrosa should be Possibly 7-A+ simply because he should already be capable of matching Sanji and Zoro to some extent since he's always been stronger than either of them up to this point, and he also managed to pressure a (severely weakened) Doflamingo immediately after Gamma Knife, albeit with Haki.

And that we never really see him fight anyone seriously with Base except with Hody and later Doflamingo. He straight up one-shot people with G2 or 3 when they said or did something to piss him off (Hajrudin and Chinjao, for example. He was enjoying himself before that). And Chinjao (the only person to last more than a second with Luffy) was using Haki and was still getting thrashed when the fight was on-panel and he got one-shot by Gear 3rd when he pissed Luffy off.
 
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