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a Good Loser vs a Time Sorcerer

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The_Causality

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i know, i know, bla bla Medaka Box, bla bla Bullshit but this time i think this is a good match. Kumagawa is a characters never used in fight because of Medaka, anyway this is his chance to win (at least on time in his life)

  • 5-A Doctor Strange vs 8-B Kumagawa
  • Speed Equalized
  • Battle start at 100 meter of each other
Good loser kumagawa no background by rmage76-d5sch9h
StrangeBadass
 
I mean

Erasing Strange might work.

If it doesn't Incon unless Strange can tss him in a void
 
Unless Strange can trap Kumagawa in a similar way to what he did to Loki and set him a time loop so that Kumagawa can't get out I don't see how strange can win so I vote Incon.
 
I'm gonna vote Inconclusive. Kumagawa can erase time, as seen with his signiture screw spam, but Strange can time loop something timeless to begin with, so the eye might be able to overpower All Fiction. Now if Kumagawa brings out Bookmaker, he should have this, but it's totally random when, if ever, he actually uses it.

We need more Kumagawa matches. Medaka-lite is better then Medaka Classic by far.
 
Hmm he can time loop something that's timeless. Can that be negged via causality erasure doe? Like erasing the action of the loop instead of the time.

PS: I just realized Kumagawa has only wins xD.
 
Voting for Kumagawa off Fire reason. If he use AF to erase DS previous action. He can avoid time loop all together
 
Yusuke138 said:
Voting for Kumagawa off Fire reason. If he use AF to erase DS previous action. He can avoid time loop all together
Click to expand...
But then the loop starts over again?

Fire didn't vote. He simply asked a question
 
Gargoyle One said:
Fire didn't vote. He simply asked a question
Click to expand...
He never said i voted, he said "he" votes Kumagawa for my reason.

So rather than erasing the time, just erase the action. You can loop something timeless (idk how), but cause erasure is a different issue. You can loop time at 0, if you never started to loop time, it won't loop doe. That was my point, if it works then im all for Kuma.
 
You don't loop time at 0, you loop at -2

Erasing Strange means the loop starts again and another strange appears
 
Gargoyle One said:
You don't loop time at 0, you loop at -2
Erasing Strange means the loop starts again and another strange appears
Click to expand...
You didn't get it.

I snap and make time loop. Kumagawa realizes the loop. He erases the reality that "you snapped". If you never snapped, time never looped, resulting in the "end" of the loop, because it never existed. (im just making "snap" the trigger for time loop, since idk what the trigger is, so instead of the "snap" insert the time loop trigger action).
 
Erasing the reality you time looped means the time loops again, erasing the reality is simply a part of that loop
 
This may sound like a NLF, but Time Looping operates on "When something bad happens to Strange". The reality he's in being erased seems like something bad happened don't it?

Also, if the reality where Strange did the timeloop is erased, then the stone would react and timeloop the reality back to a point where the reality was still there. Now you may say this is unfounded, but the Time Loop worked on universe sized beings before (Dormammu). If The Time Loop didn't have universal range then there would be parts of Dormammu that would go unaffected by the loop, but that's visibly not what happened.
 
Gargoyle One said:
Erasing the reality you time looped means the time loops again, erasing the reality is simply a part of that loop
Click to expand...
What i mean is this:

Point 1: DS snaps causing time to loop (an outside the loop moment).

Point 2: Time loops.

Point 3: Kumagawa erases the "cause" for all the loops. Without it having a cause, a beginning, a start it cannot exist. The loop was never created therefore it cannot exist.

Think of GER's death loop for a moment. It triggers an endless loop of deaths with the trigger being "a death". If he erases the fact that he died, the loop stops, because he never died, he was never put in the loop etc etc.
 
@Akreious

The stone can't go back to a point in reality, because there is no such point. That's the idea. There was never a point where the Time Loop was about to be initiated. If Kuma erases someone, if you go back in time before the erasure, he wouldn't be there, because....he never was there.
 
Not really

Kumagawa erases the reality, Stone goes before said reality got erased.

Plus a Time Loop doesn't have an actual beginning as it is a backwards loop in time.

Also, has he ever actually erased reality? Because Im 99% sure that's not in character
 
Gargoyle One said:
Not really
Kumagawa erases the reality, Stone goes before said reality got erased.

Plus a Time Loop doesn't have an actual beginning as it is a backwards loop in time.

Also, has he ever actually erased reality? Because Im 99% sure that's not in character
Click to expand...
As i said, you can't go back before it was erased. It's a timeline erasure. Remember when Kumagawa says "Zenkichi never existed", that's as easy as i can make it. It's erased from the timeline completely as it was never part of it, go read my blog on all fiction, it'll clear that up.

Yes a backwards loop in time, it has a time when it was initiated. The loop doesn't just happen, it is triggered by an action or by DS the moment it is triggered it "begins".

Ugh...yes. Literally anything he does is erase reality. When erasing colors, erasng zenkichi, and even erasing his own death (he erases the action that lead to his death, he never died, you can go back in time and you wouldn't see him die). Those are all parts of erasing reality. He does that all the time. Saying he won't do it in a time loop wouldn't be true as he always does that when he's in a pinch.
 
Erasing colors=/=Erasing a timeline for the hell of it, huge difference.

Except you are a part of a time loop, you erase time before it happened, but there is no time before it happened, that is a point of a loop, Kumagawa erases the loop, and the loop reappears again, trapping him, again.

A backwards loop in time doesn't have a time when it was initiated
 
Gargoyle One said:
Erasing colors=/=Erasing a timeline for the hell of it, huge difference.
Except you are a part of a time loop, you erase time before it happened, but there is no time before it happened, that is a point of a loop, Kumagawa erases the loop, and the loop reappears again, trapping him, again.

A backwards loop in time doesn't have a time when it was initiated
Click to expand...
Geez, it has a "trigger" without a trigger it can't exist. Erase the trigger, you erase the loop. Or he can just All Fiction himself outside of the loop by erasing the fact that he was ever cought in that loop. There are too many ways around it.
 
That trigger no longer exists when the loop is created. That's the thing.

Erasing yourself is a win condition for Strange, not Kumagawa
 
Gargoyle One said:
That trigger no longer exists when the loop is created. That's the thing.
Erasing yourself is a win condition for Strange, not Kumagawa
Click to expand...
Exactly. It no longer exists once it's created. It only exists in the past. Kumagawa is not gonna alter the present, he's gonna alter the past.
 
Gargoyle One said:
<It only exists in the past
Again, no it doesn't. It is part of a neutral loop
Click to expand...
Dude, looping something doesn't just erase it's cause out of existence unless you can prove that.

And again he can just undo "him being in the loop" and get out of the loop without affecting the loop.
 
Yes it does

You loop time, it is now a fully connected loop

You take a string, you manage to connect it 100% perfectly to the point where it's literally fused together, there is no Trigger anymore as it is now a fully connected Loop.

"Him being in the loop"

He attempts too, can't do so due to the fact there is no action to erase, he is in an endless Loop.

BTW, we've only discussed him simply trying to get it, he can't escape time Stop with BFR from what I can tell
 
Kumagawa FRA. Kumagawa can erase all actions of a loop if he wants too, or even the loop itself OR THE CONCEPT OF LOOPS at that.
 
point is loops ain't gonna work due to the bullshit that is all fiction. Like seriously. He can just go back before the loop existed. (unless you're gonna start saying omnipresent loop through time cus im really gonna drop this conversation if the Omni-Bomb hits the field).

And no being in a time loop doesn't just erase anything that happened before. How did u come up with that? The loop exists only for Kumagawa for him to be unable to completely affect that would need the loop to have these stuff:

1. Omnipresent throughout time. (the loop always existed, so like if you go to a time beyond what the loop allows, you'll still be in the loop, and yes you can get out of loops with time travel as long as it can be applied).

2. Time loop to be literally acasual. (RIP AF)

3. Time Loop exists for EVERYONE. So there is nothing outside of that loop (what i mean is, DS loops time for Kumagawa and DS+Kuma+anything that exists is trapped on that loop) because if anything IS outside of that loop it means there does exist something outside of the loop which Kuma can go back to. And in our case it isn't. The fact that DS can normally live means that there did exist a trigger (and still does) for the time loop, and there is a time beyond the loop. All Fiction can just get back to that reality.

Srsly i've gone over the "loops don't beat All Fiction" countless times by now. Most loops are causality repetition or time repetitions. Since DS can loop something timeless im going with causality repetition (since controlling the time for sth that doesn't have time, is like saying i can see your panties even though you have none). Causality repetition, erase the cause and you're out of the loop. Time Repetition, erase cause that you are in that loop and get out (he looked at me and got me in the loop, gets erased so it becomes he didn't look at me so he didn't get me in the loop. It's really hard for causality not to get to you (which is why acausality is such a strong power).

Also @Rububle what do you mean a different type?
 
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