Yu-Gi-Oh! Tiering

NOTE: Staff Only and each side has a day to prepare their arguments. After the day is over, the thread will be highlighted.

Given the nature of the last threads, it has been decided that it should be concluded by staff eyes.

Pro Rapid and Megaboy:

Pro Kukui and Data:

Previous Threads: 1, 2, and 3.

This was supposed to be less of arguing and more of presenting both sides, do you mind if I delete both sides so the thread can be fresh for when both sides are prepared? @Dark and Rapid

Oh, sorry about that.


I will prepare a full on presentation instead of continue the discussion

bump

thought you were preparing a full presentation

we're kind of waiting on you

Oh, really?

Forgot about that. I tought that the topic was just frozen.

Anyways, it will take quite a damn amount of effort to pretty much represent everything tier wise at once. I can do it, not now, but i can do it.

But, if you wanna me to focus on Anime Yugi or Manga Yugi and discuss it little by little, or just want me to, you know, drop EVERYTHING about the Yugioh verse in one big whop, lemme know.

bumpu

@Ari we're also waiting for Kukui

@Rapid Everything would be nice (but seperate it based on post) Also, would you like Megaboy to help you? (If so, I or Ari would probably have to help Kukui)

Megaboy is getting rekt on the Thomas the tank enginge shit, so i will do it on my own.


On a thread or in like, a blog?

we made this thread for a reason, if theres anything unrelated to the current argument itself just make that separate somewhere else on like another thread

@Rapid this thread.

-- Still in construction, too ******* tired for today. --

1.- Canonicity

There are two different Yu-gi-Oh Timelines determined by the Anime and the Manga.

Anime Timeline

Seasons 1-3, Capsule Monsters, Pyramid of Light (Novel), Season 4, Bonds Beyond Time, Season 5 and Yugioh GX.

Manga Timeline

Yugioh, Yugioh Duel Monsters, Yugioh R, Dark Side of Dimensions.


1.1 Why Pyramid of Light, Bonds Beyond Time and GX are canon to the animeverse?

Pegasus makes an appearance in all of three, despite the fact he should be dead by Duelist Kingdom Arc in the manga.

1.2 Why Novel Pyramid of Light instead of the movie?

The Movie was made by 4kids, not the original japanese creators.

The Light Light novel was made by the producers of the anime that tells their version of Pyramid of Light. http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/Yu-Gi-Oh!_Duel_Monsters:_Pyramid_of_Light_(novel)

The translated Novel is located in this link https://es.scribd.com/document/14282035/Yu-Gi-Oh-Duel-Monsters-Pyramid-of-Light, we will use it later.

-Anime Yu-Gi-Oh Verse -

Seasons 1-3, Capsule Monsters, Pyramid of Light (Novel), Season 4, Bonds Beyond Time, Season 5 and Yugioh GX.

1.1 Duel Monster is real and its effects are too.

Novel Shining Dragon Uses its effect in real life.

A dazzling light arosefrom the card in Yugi's hand. The light soars into the Dome's air above Yugi and Dark Yugi'shead. The mass of light little by little takes form of The Blue-Eyed Dragon of Light—The Blue-Eyes Shining Dragon. "Farewell, King of Destruction! Now our circle of friendship will stretchinto one and your evil designs will be crushed!" "Shining Nova!!" Kaiba and Yugi shouted at thesame time. The Blue-Eyes Shining Dragon was wrapped in a supernova-like radiance. Theradiance of the Shining Nova reduced the monster-transformed Anubis to cinders. The Anubismonster faded awa and the red eye left in the airspace exploded with a thunderous roar.

1.2 Season 1 - 3

Pegasus can drag Yugi into a Dark Game with a videotape, Mind read, steal Grampa´s soul and more.

https://youtu.be/d2P1GaKcSNk?t=11m23s

As discussed in 1.1, this will just be a list of feats.

As shown in all of these instances.

Stone of soldier destroys a mini moon, At least Continent Level.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IzUT-1kX254

(Jounochi vs Marik) God cards would destroy the planet while used in the wrong hands. Planet Level.

https://youtu.be/O0xN1r-m540?t=59m6s

Infinite Obelisk as High 3-A

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKTcorgMlrs

1.2 Capsule Monsters

Dont know a lot of this, but Shadii made a 4-A Feat that scales to All Millenium Item users, also, the monsters are real in here as well and deal raw AP. [1] [2] https://*********.ac/Anime/Yu-Gi-Oh-Capsule-Monsters.48097/Episode-011?id=54520


Mr. Not a badguy steals the key to the realm Shadi created, Yuugi and pals tackle him and also fall into the star filled realm.


4-C, 4-B or 4-A? But Tier 4 Yugioh is a thing now, and no one can possibly attempt to debunk this.

(Credits to Megaboy Prime)

Several stuff has to be calced as well, like the different armors they can get.


Yugi vs Seiya whe


https://youtu.be/6vg7Q0ZwtOA?t=1m51s

Also, they have swords, flight and tons of awesome shit, so ill surely check it out later.


1.3 Pyramid of Light

As stated in 1.1, this makes monster effects, magic cards, trap cards real, which would be a massive hax advatage to Anime Yugi.

I couldnt find a lot of relevant feats about Pyramid of Light, but, another user made a well done thred about the movie.

https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/254659

But, as ive seen in the Rule Violation Thread, it is a very controversial user, so, take it with a grain of salt.


1.4 Season 4

Jounochi vs Varon create a massive lightstorm. And further support raw AP for Duel Monsters.

https://youtu.be/_sX_3BVpv-Y?t=10m33s, https://youtu.be/_sX_3BVpv-Y?t=12m17s

The Clip is gone from Youtube but...

Timaeus Knight of Destiny surpassed infinite Attack points, which would be At least High 3-A or Low 2-C.

1.5 Bonds Beyond Time

-Paradox created an Universal Time Stop with Malefic World.

-Judai was able to launch a fire ball irl to make people run away from Paradox´s attacks.

-More real monsters that destroyed all of Domino City.

1.6 Season 5

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:Darkanine/Yu-Gi-Oh:_Zorc_vs_the_Egyptian_Gods

1.7 Yu-Gi-Oh GX

- The Final Graduation Duel Feat & Scaling . Adult Yugi's Deck as portrayed in the Final Graduation Duel parts 1 & 2 has a Low 2-C feat. Yugi from Battle City's Deck was stated to be the strongest by Judai, also confirmed by Adult Yugi's statement. The issue is many things actually : Who scales to Yugi's Deck ? Does Judai at that point scale to Yugi ? How will this affect the current canon scaling with it, considering GX, 5D's , and DM all are connected with each other via Bonds Beyond Time . Also the fact they are able to move in stilled space-time is another matter we should get into. Whether it is speed related or ability related. This will drastically affect scaling if it is deemed canon, and will likely require a key if it isn't.

(Credits to The 2nd Existential Seed)


All of these topics have been discussed on these threads.

https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/1435301

https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/1362300

-Manga Yu-Gi-Oh! Verse-

This covers Yugioh, Yugioh R and Dark Side of Dimensions.

Yu-Gi-Oh and Yu-Gi-Oh R

These two have been mostly covered by Arigamy.

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:Arigarmy/the_power_of_a_childrens_card_game

Alongside a High 7-C for the OG Egyptian Gods and various other skills for Manga Yu-Gi-Oh verse.

---

Dark Side of Dimensions

Resistances to various effects, Time Travel for Kaiba, Power Nullification for Atem, and more.

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:RapidMotorcycle19/Yugioh_3-A_Prana

We have a big discussion about this on this thread https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/1433375

-Resistance to existence erasure with the new duel disk

-Obelisk being able to destroy a Multi Universal Dimension on his own.

-Time Travel for Kaiba

-Atem reversed Prana on his own as he returned, which has been shown consistently to be 3-A.

---

My friend got nuked.

Im the only pro-upgrade Yugioh guy left now.

Well, here is the bump.

It was only a matter of time with him. Kukui is the guy who hauls everything, I'm not gonna piece together all of his stuff when 90% of it is unrelated arguing.

Well, i guess it will be a bit tougher without him around.

You both said the same stuff and argument, and the verdict is the other Admins' decisions, not mine or Kukui. It won't change much

I...don't know how I wasn't getting notifs from this when I was following the thread....

My fault.

I'm in school atm and am dealing with some stuff IRL so I'll get to this ASAP.

@SomebodyData

You need my help in gathering anything?

I will be mostly unavailable for the time being.

The nuking of Megaboy, the nature of these discussion and personal issues will indeed delay my replies to this discussion, i hope none of you mind.

I mean, we can wait, though we probably won't be arguing much in this thread given its supposed to be a rundown of the reasons and arguments for staff to digest easier.

Yeah, but once Kukui replies, i am expected to put his arguments under doubt, and viceversa

Ye, as it should, only in this case, after you guys reach a certain amount of comments, you guys should just put some ending words in a final post that way the staff don't have to take on several dozens of comments.

Well, i guess it is better this way.

Will the staff make a choice for all feats talked about here? Is it going to be a selective process or just a definitive yes or no?

Aka accept this feat, but discard that other one.

Its the Aka accept this feat but discard that other one, saying one definite yes or no would be pretty weird, unless they truly believe that one side is completely correct.

I see.

I guess, this will be our final battle, Kukui

It might be best to close this thread and start a new one after all of the explanations have been properly prepared and organised, so they can be posted right at the start.

I'm thinking of moving to general discussion in case they have any more questions, but yes, making a new one is a good idea. @Antvasima

Well, it depends on if the thread would likely get out of hand again.

https://youtu.be/6vg7Q0ZwtOA?t=2m3s

Oh my god, Yugi just suplexed a five headed dragon in Saint Seiya armor.

Bump

It seems that the thread has died a bit, @Rapid you could use this time to add that feat if you want to your argument if you want, Imma see if Kukui still wants to do this.

Well, i have not yet seen ALL of Capsule Monsters, maybe we should leave that alone for now.

It might either be for a failsafe upgrade or another form anyways.

@Somebody

I am sorry for not replying as much. Believe me, I am still interested in getting to this discussion when I have the opportunity. Right now IRL I am having family issues to deal with as well so i'd like to get that out of the way before getting to this given the severity of the threads topic.

Okay. No problem, but as I mentioned earlier, it may be best to make a restart thread with all of the respective arguments at the start afterwards.

We've made a lot of new threads for this one argument, haven't we

It has been quite a long journey indeed.

Kukui will just never give up.

"Kukui will just never give up".

Can we not please? I have enough to deal with off site and there's absolutely 0 reason why that needs to be brought up here again. We are better than this and should try to remain as civil as possible.

I actually don't think he was being trying to be provocative this time; he brings a valid point. It's been a stalemate for months now. Just take your time and post your arguments so the Admins can deal with it.

bump


Anywho, any toughts on the DM versions of Monsters´s AP scaling?

And i dont mean "lore", more like the Infinite Obelisk above.

Depends.

From what I recall, certain monsters like the gods did have real effects in the real world, and it was specifically something that could only be done with tributes. If Obelisk used any abilities in a "real" battle in the past, I believe its fine.

It's also pretty clear that duelists like Bakura can make their effects real, so iyt is likely. However, scaling things like attack to AP is sketchy, at leat if we do it linearly. However, monsters with the same or greater attack in the show are likely comprable or greater than, since those attack values aren't just for show. Heck, some of our profiles right now have AP based on attack values.

Thats the thing, there are some cards in the Duel Monsters lore that can consume stars and some that exist outside of the duel monsters multiverse with less than 3000 atk, while Card obelisk has 4000, so, is Obelisk stronger than both of them?

There is also the fact that some cards´s ka are directly linked to their Season 5/Ancient Egypt counterparts.


As far as ive seen there are three "forms" for Duel Monsters Monsters.

Duel Monsters (Game) , Duel Monsters (Lore) and Ancient Egypt versions.