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Yhwach's Power Nullification
- Thread starter ProfessorKukui4Life
- Start date
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- #43
Interacting with invisible powers and allowing Yhwach to see them so he can nullify them is not the same thing.Xulrev said:
Plus, like I said, I dont care about the powers Yhwach himself bestows. Im talking about the powers of opponents.
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Opponents as in vs battles???
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- #45
Yhwach's info analysis is him being able to understand the powers he sees.KazuiK said:
What happens if he's facing a power that cant be seen?
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- #46
Good points, but the issue is these are all powers that Yhwach himself bestowed onto Uryu and the Sternritter.Sigurd Snake in The Eye said:
So he obviously doesnt need to see them in order to understand them (which by then, means he can null them). They're Yhwach's powers to begin with after all.
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That made 0 sense, you asked about invisible powers.
These are invisible powers.
These are invisible powers.
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- #48
100% this. Pointing this out incase this wasnt before.Sigurd Snake in The Eye said:
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You asked for proof of interaction via Almighty with invisible powers.
Several have been given.
I do believe at this point it may be simple failure to grasp the base point. By definition and by feats The Almighty works on all powers within range of its sight and it automatically enables Yhwach to comprehend said powers and then makes then useless against him
Several have been given.
I do believe at this point it may be simple failure to grasp the base point. By definition and by feats The Almighty works on all powers within range of its sight and it automatically enables Yhwach to comprehend said powers and then makes then useless against him
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Is the vanishing point now the real counter to Almighty?
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- #51
>You asked for proof of interaction via Almighty with invisible powers.
No, I asked for evidence of the Almighty seeing invisible powers in the future, not interacting with them. The examples you gave were powers that Yhwach himself once had but later.
>Is the vanishing point now the real counter to Almighty?
Isnt Lee a member of Yhwach's quincy group? Or was Yhwach never aware of Gremmy's creation?
No, I asked for evidence of the Almighty seeing invisible powers in the future, not interacting with them. The examples you gave were powers that Yhwach himself once had but later.
>Is the vanishing point now the real counter to Almighty?
Isnt Lee a member of Yhwach's quincy group? Or was Yhwach never aware of Gremmy's creation?
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He is the creation of gremmy for the war.
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- #53
I know but did Gremmy create him to be a member of Yhwach's group of sternritter or was Lee just a random creation meant to fight Yachiru and Issane without Yhwach ever knowing Lee even existed?
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It's just a random creation, not like it matters anyway.
Your question has been answered by everyone here.
Your question has been answered by everyone here.
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Wait could Yhwach nullify BFR?
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- #57
It actually would matter because if he was, then that would mean Yhwach would know of his abilities and how they work, meaning he wouldnt need to see Vanishing Point being used in order to understand and negate it.Sigurd Snake in The Eye said:
Since he isnt as you say he is, then I would say yes Vanishing Point would be a counter against the Almighty but it wouldnt matter since Lee would never be able to scratch someone as strong as Yhwach.
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- #58
Well take your examples for...example lol. They are powers that Yhwach grants the Sternitter (besides Lee) because they were his powers to begin with.Xulrev said:
How can Yhwach not understand how his own powers work, invisiible or not? Its less about Yhwach needing to interact with them and more about him knowing powers that were once in his possession. If that makes sense?
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Vanishing Point > Almighty
Alright got it, Vanishing Point is above The Almighty.
That's enough for me honestly.
Alright got it, Vanishing Point is above The Almighty.
That's enough for me honestly.
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Except there are sternritter that he never granted an ability to. Gerard, Pernida, and Shazz (Shazz is still alive) are primary examples.
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- #61
You know very well that isnt what im saying....Sigurd Snake in The Eye said:
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That is what you're saying it.
You literally just said it can bypass Almighty even though Almighty is stated to be quite literally the greatest power in the verse.
You literally just said it can bypass Almighty even though Almighty is stated to be quite literally the greatest power in the verse.
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- #63
So because its the greatest power in the verse, it can't have one aspect of itself be countered by something that wouldnt even be relevant? You act like the Almighty cant have any counters or flaws just because its a god tier ability.
And like I already said, the Vanishing Point being a counter wouldnt mean Yhwach suddenly cant one shot a fodder creation of Gremmy's. It would be ultimately useless.
And like I already said, the Vanishing Point being a counter wouldnt mean Yhwach suddenly cant one shot a fodder creation of Gremmy's. It would be ultimately useless.
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That's exactly what i'm saying. Your argument is ridiculous. You're ignoring lore for irrelevant vs battles that mean nothing.
I said nothing about if Yhwach 1 shot him or not. As a matter of fact according to you Lee would stalemate him since Vanishing Point bypasses The Almighty and Yhwach would be incapable of knowing what's going on.
I said nothing about if Yhwach 1 shot him or not. As a matter of fact according to you Lee would stalemate him since Vanishing Point bypasses The Almighty and Yhwach would be incapable of knowing what's going on.
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- #65
And that in itself is a ridiculous stance to take to try and avoid doubt being given on the ability and vs battles that mean nothing? It means everything here as we have to make sure abilities arent potentially wanked in vs debates, the Almighty isnt exempt from this just because of its status as a god tier ability. Stop using the "god tier" shield to act like the Almighty cannot have any flaws based on vague evidence that can be taken out of context.
>As a matter of fact according to you Lee would stalemate him since Vanishing Point bypasses The Almighty and Yhwach would be incapable of knowing what's going on.
Or the other option. The option that Yhwach can't nullify it for being unable to forsee it, so he uses the other plethora of abilities the Almighty has to beat the shit out of Lee, which would happen even if the Vanishing Point bypasses the Almighty's precog.
But clearly the Almightly losing just one option against an opponent means it can be stalemated...
>As a matter of fact according to you Lee would stalemate him since Vanishing Point bypasses The Almighty and Yhwach would be incapable of knowing what's going on.
Or the other option. The option that Yhwach can't nullify it for being unable to forsee it, so he uses the other plethora of abilities the Almighty has to beat the shit out of Lee, which would happen even if the Vanishing Point bypasses the Almighty's precog.
But clearly the Almightly losing just one option against an opponent means it can be stalemated...
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I'm not using the god tier shield, it's just you not understanding the actual ability and attempting to find some ridiculous hole in it that isn't there. Nothing is wanked here, the ability is explained as clear as day for anyone to understand. You're going against character statements and lore itself.
Except Lee makes himself nonexistent both mentally and physically, so yes according to you it's a stalemate since Yhwach would have no way of knowing what's going on.
Except Lee makes himself nonexistent both mentally and physically, so yes according to you it's a stalemate since Yhwach would have no way of knowing what's going on.
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- #67
You very much are hiding behind it, especially with your "strongest power in the verse" statement. But anyway, "Character statements" can, again, be taken out of context via wording alone. Yhwach can very easily be referring to things that he only physically sees in the future, not things that are invisible and cannot be seen. And you act like what a character says is absolute when feats trump statements. And what lore? You have nothing beyond a single panel of words, which you yourself even admitted to.
Also, your only furthering my point with Lee making himself non-existent since you kinda cant see something that doesnt exist. Doesnt mean Lee will be able to even scratch Yhwach, whos far stronger.
Also, your only furthering my point with Lee making himself non-existent since you kinda cant see something that doesnt exist. Doesnt mean Lee will be able to even scratch Yhwach, whos far stronger.
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Did you stretch before this reach?
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I'd advise you not to, Ant said it's against wiki rules to do so as it's considered harassment.M3X said:
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> taken out of context.
prove it.
> Yhwach can very easily be referring to things that he only physically sees in the future.
This doesn't help you at all, you think he needs to see the power. He just needs to see the event itself.
> not things that are invisible and cannot be seen.
invisibility is childs play in the verse.
> nd you act like what a character says is absolute when feats trump statements. And what lore?
Go read the novel and manga again.
> You have nothing beyond a single panel of words, which you yourself even admitted to.
Wht exactly do you have here? nothing. Not even an anti-feat. just a random question for vs battles.
The entire basis of your argument stems from personal conjecture because you don't understand how the ability works and vs battles. Not actual canon information or anything that would change anything on his profile.
prove it.
> Yhwach can very easily be referring to things that he only physically sees in the future.
This doesn't help you at all, you think he needs to see the power. He just needs to see the event itself.
> not things that are invisible and cannot be seen.
invisibility is childs play in the verse.
> nd you act like what a character says is absolute when feats trump statements. And what lore?
Go read the novel and manga again.
> You have nothing beyond a single panel of words, which you yourself even admitted to.
Wht exactly do you have here? nothing. Not even an anti-feat. just a random question for vs battles.
The entire basis of your argument stems from personal conjecture because you don't understand how the ability works and vs battles. Not actual canon information or anything that would change anything on his profile.
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gg
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It has nothing to with being physically visible, but more so being present in the future he sees it in. He "Knows" that power because it was in one of his futures. Invisibility does not matter, it's the power being present in a future he "sees'. Thus something like the balance would not work. This is more simple than it was made out to be.
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I never said that - I said that the person would need to be immune to Yhwach's vision - that they would have to be beyond his vision (or invisible to it) like Mimihagi was. Not that being invisible is beyond his power to see and understand.ProfessorKukui4Life said:
There are plenty of invisible powers in Bleach and they are all beneath the Almighty. Just because a power isn't visible doesn't mean Yhwach can't affect it.
And people already responded to this point, so I won't respond.
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>prove it.
Ever heard of Burden of Proof? Because thats what you have right now.
And im going directly off of whats given. Yhwach negates powers by understanding them and he understands them by seeing them used on him in the future. Nothing specifies him being able to see powers that are not visibly viewable besides him saying "everything". And hyperbole is something that exists for a reason too and can be the case here if nothing actually backs this up.
>This doesn't help you at all, you think he needs to see the power. He just needs to see the event itself.
And what actually proves he only needs to see the event itself? Because nothing I have ever seen in the manga proves this to be true. If he sees someone use time hax in the future and only sees things to be frozen in motion, how will he know that its a time stop since you cant "see" time? Or if he sees someone in the future vanish from his sight, how can he know that they are either turning invisible, being erased from existing, or just teleporting somewhere else?
There is nothing that has been brought here that suggests Yhwach doesnt need to see a power being visibly used in the future in order for him to understand and then negate it.
>invisibility is childs play in the verse.
In like one world yeah. Where Yhwach has never used Almighty in ironically enough.
>Go read the novel and manga again.
And i'll say the exact same thing since you yourself even admitted no where else is this power null's ability explained besides this one panel against Ichibe.
>Wht exactly do you have here? nothing. Not even an anti-feat. just a random question for vs battles.
Once again, remind yourself what Burden of Proof is. Because thats exactly whats on you. It's not on me to disprove Yhwach seeing invisible powers from opponents. The Burden of Proof is on you however to prove Yhwach can see them in the first place and not just abilities that can be visibly seen by anyone.
Ever heard of Burden of Proof? Because thats what you have right now.
And im going directly off of whats given. Yhwach negates powers by understanding them and he understands them by seeing them used on him in the future. Nothing specifies him being able to see powers that are not visibly viewable besides him saying "everything". And hyperbole is something that exists for a reason too and can be the case here if nothing actually backs this up.
>This doesn't help you at all, you think he needs to see the power. He just needs to see the event itself.
And what actually proves he only needs to see the event itself? Because nothing I have ever seen in the manga proves this to be true. If he sees someone use time hax in the future and only sees things to be frozen in motion, how will he know that its a time stop since you cant "see" time? Or if he sees someone in the future vanish from his sight, how can he know that they are either turning invisible, being erased from existing, or just teleporting somewhere else?
There is nothing that has been brought here that suggests Yhwach doesnt need to see a power being visibly used in the future in order for him to understand and then negate it.
>invisibility is childs play in the verse.
In like one world yeah. Where Yhwach has never used Almighty in ironically enough.
>Go read the novel and manga again.
And i'll say the exact same thing since you yourself even admitted no where else is this power null's ability explained besides this one panel against Ichibe.
>Wht exactly do you have here? nothing. Not even an anti-feat. just a random question for vs battles.
Once again, remind yourself what Burden of Proof is. Because thats exactly whats on you. It's not on me to disprove Yhwach seeing invisible powers from opponents. The Burden of Proof is on you however to prove Yhwach can see them in the first place and not just abilities that can be visibly seen by anyone.
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Im sorry, but no. Until I see something that actually supports this, im calling complete bullshit on this.Ariandelle said:
It has everything to do with being physically visible since the only logical way you can understand something is by seeing it. There is not one shred of evidence that supports Yhwacn nulling powers just because they are present in the futures he sees. He nulls them by seeing the powers in those futures to then understand and then negate by turning them over to his side.
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That sounds like a YOU problem. I explained it how it is, i don't care about what you think of the answer, but that's how it is. But it's not uncommon for people to make up weaknesses for yhwach.
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The hell, that's enough for me honestly.
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"That sounds like a YOU problem."
Nice rebuttal when the Burden of Proof cant be fulfilled.
Nice rebuttal when the Burden of Proof cant be fulfilled.
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Wtf. That's my cue. Good luck
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Ariandelle said:
That seems to be an issue with Kukui in general. Going by a general observation he seems to think that his arguments are always right despite nobody ever agreeing to them. Which is never a good mindset to have.
