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xeno goku tier and speed upgrade

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i can understand the doubt regarding the tiering (but there is also some clear statement) but i cant really understand how is possible debunking infinity speed tbh
 
https://imgur.com/a/FGpAo https://imgur.com/L7dJ6V2

its stated multiple time that they moved on place without time and outside the regular flow of time. how can you debunk something like that?

why there is so much hating on that topic by the moderators and admin... you didnt understand you are losing people's trust? there are a lot of pg on this wiki that are high 2A with inifity speed just because the presence of one statement that isnt fair.
 
Lesser known Universes get a free pass cause they are lesser known. They only need one vague statement and get an infinity upgrade. Look at Simon from Guran Lagan, Umineko, Higher Tier novels.


DB need statements, multiple statement, then multiple statements backed by feats, and needs to showcase properties of the science behind the statements. And specific wording for those statements even though Japanese is a high context language where there is like outright 5 different meanings for infinity and many more for similar word type.


And even when all the above are provided. And nothing has been debunked

A mod comes in a claims that it has been rejected by all the mods even though majority agree with the thread and quickly closes the thread before the discussion gets "heated".

It's just fair for DB to have such massive requirements, cause their fandom is the worst.
 
The problem with the infinite speed rating is the consistency outside of the Dark Demon Realm area, and lack of supporting feats.

Although the whole 2-A thing. I want to agree with it just to see what people will do for those vsbattles lol

Goku vs (other 2-A tier characters) i want to see that.
 
That would not bode well. Only Demigra, Fu, Mechikabura and a few non Goku characters would be able to cope if they were 2-A lol.
 
Quantu said:
That would not bode well.
Only Demigra, Fu, Chronoa, Mechikabura and a few non Goku characters would be able to cope if they were 2-A lol.
Click to expand...
Which is why i want to see them upgraded because it would be funny imo. Lel :V
 
i read all the thread... and no one debunked the infinity speed in a proper way... there are multiple situation in whic they moved in a space with the absence of time, and the speed is based on the time... no time=infinity speed, or better they exist outside the regural flow of time as the scan that i posted said. if xeno goku is MFTL+, how could you explain the fact that he moved in a space with the absence of time? or better, how you could explain the statement "they exist outside the regular flow of time" if they are under the law of speed as his profile said?? that make no sense lol, a lot of wiki put him with an infinity speed. i posted the scans, that say the exactly those things.
 
I personally dislike infinite speed rating based off timeless voids tbh... But looking past that..

They move, and originated in a timeless void, but yet, they get tagged by beings with finite speed, and beings with a finte reaction are still capable of sensing their presence, and at least reacting with a surprised face before getting trashed.
 
thats a no sense statement... superboy prime too, get tagged by being with finite speed, but his profile said he has infinity speed xD and is not the only one... also silver age superman, just for saying
 
Immeasurable (Is a sentient timeline and exists outside of the flow of linear time)

thats the motivation of superboy infinite speed. ^^^^^ (u can chek it if u didnt trust me)

https://imgur.com/L7dJ6V2

its the same statement lmao XD

and also xeno goku has more feats xD
 
ShadowWarrior1999 said:
Also this exists.
Click to expand...


A standard which was created specifically to bring down Dragon Ball Heros infinite speed feats. These "standards" did not exist before the infinite speed feats of Heros was noticed.


Even with the change in "standards" it still has both statements and properties showing that is it a true void.


The fact the standards had to be changed to downplay Heros is very telling of the bias of some mods. Standards which are than selectively used against some verses and then completely ignored against other verses.
 
They should qualify for both as far as im concerned, and many people feel this way including multiple staff. Certain staff just won't accept it is all and its a hot button topic so it gets swept under the rug. As more proof surfaces though the argument for it just becomes strogner and stronger, and more people agree, so eventually it will likely get passed. Maybe after DLC 8 for xenoverse, and the Broly movie, there will be even more proof, and i'll put together a in depth argument again then.
 
@Infiniteblack

Actually, no. Void feats and infinite speeds were an issue before the Infinite Speed DBH propositions happened. I brought them up in a thread over 7 months ago and they were fine tuned after that.

And even if it was made in the wake of DBH, it isn't to downplay or undermine DBH's speed, but rather was brought to a head by issues from a popular verse. And big/popular verses naturally undergo more scrutiny. Dragon Ball is the quintessential "VS" universe that many people argue and debate about. Because of this, not only are there more and interesting interpretations, but we also need to rate the verse very conservatively as to not wank the characters. When multiple viable interpretations exist, it is safer to go with the less powerful one.

You may see such standards or evaluations as disproportionate in regard to Dragon Ball, and you may be right, but that isn't because anyone here hates Dragon Ball, but rather because scrutiny is natural and interpretations abound the larger the verse is.
 
The statement "Dragonball is the quintessential "VS" universe that many people argue and debate about" its not a valid reason to debunk and don't consider the scans that I posted... No one since I opened the thread debunked my scans and proofs...
 
there are multiple situation in whic they moved in a space with the absence of time, and the speed is based on the time... no time=infinity speed, or better they exist outside the regural flow of time as the scan that i posted said. if xeno goku is MFTL+, how could you explain the fact that he moved in a space with the absence of time? or better, how you could explain the statement "they exist outside the regular flow of time" if they are under the law of speed as his profile said?? that make no sense lol, a lot of wiki put him with an infinity speed. i posted the scans, that say the exactly those things.
 
Udlmaster said:
To be honest, all these only show Type 1 Acausality, not 2-A/High 2-A
Click to expand...

Elaborate please.

How is Xeno Goku is type 1 instead of type 2. The only way you can is if you consider the real world, where the player character resides in DB heros to be a Outer Versal world, and Demigra destroying it to be a Outerversal feat.


Which would make sense as that world is the same world that views all of Dragon Ball as fiction.
 
InfiniteBlack123 said:
Elaborate please.

How is Xeno Goku is type 1 instead of type 2. The only way you can is if you consider the real world, where the player character resides in DB heros to be a Outer Versal world, and Demigra destroying it to be a Outerversal feat.

Which would make sense as that world is the same world that views all of Dragon Ball as fiction.
Click to expand...
Okay, firstly...

NO. The Player Character is not living in an Outerversal world:

"Firstly, no matter what the author's intentions are, fiction and reality can never fully interact. The real world, and real people can be simulated within fiction, but they will still be fictional representations and characters. As such, no fictional character can be responsible for the creation of "The real world"."

Reality - Fiction interaction has that covered.

And even if we did consider them as worthy of a Profile and existing in a Higher plane, then they'd be High 2-A at best, not Outerversal.

Viewing all Dragon Ball as fiction is just a Dimensional jump:

"In most cases, these meta-layers have a reality-fiction difference, meaning, the difference between each layer (not the dimensions of the layer) is like the difference between reality and fiction. Basically, to a higher layer entity, the lower entity is so insignificant that it can hardly be called real."

Demigra destroying the DBZ verse is NOT Outerversal in anyway:

  • DBZ doesn't have Infinite Dimensions, as well as there isn't a realm tha transcends said dimension for Demigra to destroy and become Outerversal.
  • It even states that Demigra didn't destroy the whole verse anyway, the Crack in time still existed, anything outside of Time still existed, which was a lot apparently.
And the reason why It's Type 1 and not Type 2 is because Goku is still affected by the past in some sense, we still need to go into the past and solve issues pertaining to Goku.
 
Melis125 said:
also why wouldn't xeno goku be 1-a when he has beaten demigra in base form ?
Click to expand...
Are you reading?

Demigra isn't 1-A.

Goku isn't 1-A.

No one in Dragon Ball is 1-A
 
Its not false information. You were among one of the ones spreading around out of context scans, and misinformation on the previous threads, and its common knowledge that they get tagged a lot outside of the dark demon realm. I could provide proof, yes, but considering that how abruptly threads like this get shut down, by the time i come back. This thread will probably be locked. On top of that, it is the holiday season, and i do have a life outside of the vsbw forums.
 
TheUpgradeManHaHaxD said:
I personally dislike infinite speed rating based off timeless voids tbh... But looking past that..
They move, and originated in a timeless void, but yet, they get tagged by beings with finite speed, and beings with a finte reaction are still capable of sensing their presence, and at least reacting with a surprised face before getting trashed.
Click to expand...
https://imgur.com/a/bi3BnBV repeating the same mistake as before
 
Melis125 said:
TheUpgradeManHaHaxD said:
I personally dislike infinite speed rating based off timeless voids tbh... But looking past that..
They move, and originated in a timeless void, but yet, they get tagged by beings with finite speed, and beings with a finte reaction are still capable of sensing their presence, and at least reacting with a surprised face before getting trashed.
Click to expand...
https://imgur.com/a/bi3BnBV repeating the same mistake as before
Click to expand...
Again out of context scans being used deliberately for an upgrade. Mira never escaped with his speed. He escaped by resisting time stop hax with his ki.

I am not denying it has functionalities of a void. It does have timeless void supporting evidence, but what i am denying is the infinite speed being consistent.
 
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