Will Android 17 get an upgrade?

[Dark649]

Krillin isn't 3-A. This was discussed and debunked before.

I wonder how you will react when Krillin will fight in the Battle Royal foes that can seriously damage Super Saiyan Blue Goku.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Krillin is weaker than base Gohan who is weaker than base Goku. He isn't 3-A.

 

[Dark649]

Krillin is weaker than base Gohan who is weaker than base Goku. He isn't 3-A.

For now, but the Battle Royal will change this.

 

[LordGriffin1000]

You make no sense what dose 17 being unable to beat Goku back in the Cell saga half to do with Super he is now much stronger, Killin has nothing to do with this he has been stated he never kept up with his training so obviously him fighting SSB Goku was plot and He only went Blue to see how Krillin would react he wasn't using anywhere near his full power while 17 on the other hand kept training and forced Goku into SSB so please stop.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Krillin is weaker than base Gohan who is weaker than base Goku. He isn't 3-A.

For now, but the Battle Royal will change this.

Only if he has 100% legit feats and a decent reasoning. 17 has the explanation that he has training behind him, though his ranking could change. 18 and Krillin have yet to show anything substantial, tho the later could become Universal if she gets the feats.

The show wouldn't establish Krillin as weaker than Base Gohan to make him SSB-Tier later. Not everyone on the tournament will be that strong.

 

[Dark649]

Ok i'll stop but remember that like you i extremely disagree with the idea of a 3-A Krillin by basing for his growths in series, i have the sensation that the series will show him fighting with a Universal being.

 

[AidenBrooks999]

But, if we can agree with 3-A 17 out of nowhere (Because IMO this is bull****) why not upgrade Krillin to 4-B or something?

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

@Aiden

Because he has no 4-B feats. He says to Gohan "You are holding back, aren't you, why don't you fight at full power?" To which Gohan responds by kicking the shit out of him. Krillin only wins through strategy + holding-back Gohan.

 

[AidenBrooks999]

Yeah, and that's why Goku needed go SSJ to evade getting out of the ring by Krillin.


Also, considering how big is 4-B as tier, Krillin should still being 4-B from being somewhat close to them.


(Also seriously, 3-A 17?)

 

[Dark649]

(Also seriously, 3-A 17?)

And in the Dragon Ball Page Tier List, he is higher than Hit.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Vegeta is comparable to Goku. He should be updated on the Tier list. They are treating Vegeta based on a few arcs back.

 

[Dark649]

Vegeta is comparable to Goku. He should be updated on the Tier list. They are treating Vegeta based on a few arcs back.

Vegeta tries to be comparable to Goku, but currently like always he is not. He was never showing to be training after the Zamasu arc, as he was worried about Bulma.

 

[AidenBrooks999]

(Also seriously, 3-A 17?)

And in the Dragon Ball Page Tier List, he is higher than Hit.

How much did the wanker paid this time?


Because I don't see any other logical explanation for this. Except of course accept that Goku indeed absorbed the SSG power and he can use always in Base/SSJ (Which believe it or not, would explain lots of things. And even be more logical that all this c***)

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

If we accept that Goku's Base = Super Saiyan God, then this would mean that everyone who scales from Base Goku is 3-B.

 

[Dark649]

If we accept that Goku's Base = Super Saiyan God, then this would mean that everyone who scales from Base Goku is 3-B.

I think 3-A is more reasonable to the writers standpoint.

 

[AidenBrooks999]

If we accept that Goku's Base = Super Saiyan God, then this would mean that everyone who scales from Base Goku is 3-B.

3-A* SSG is 3-A.


And yes, but think about it. Fights like Trunks vs Black, Krillin vs Goku, Toppo vs Goku and even now 17 vs Goku would make more sense, since regular SSJ can put somewhat of a fight with them and then fight them more with SSB

 

[AidenBrooks999]

I think 3-A is more reasonable to the writers standpoint.

Since Vegeta reached god's level by training, they thought "anyone can"

 

[RadicalMrR]

I think the main reason all of Goky's forms arent 3-A is because of Piccolo, he kept with Frost so he would of had to have a giant power boost in a short amount of time.

 

[AidenBrooks999]

Yeah, but at the same time writers are trying to put Krillin somewhat close to 3-A characters despite he not training from a long time


But I insist, 3-A Base Goku makes more sense than you think

 

[AidenBrooks999]

Also, except for Piccolo Gohan (maybe) and Krillin, 3-A Base Goku is actually very supported by other fights

 

[Ssr4vegito]

Why is 17 higher than vegito in Tier list and also why is Goku black lower than bergamo and toppo and vegita too

 

[Antvasima]

Well, I agree that this does technically not make much sense, but there isn't much that we can do about it. Also, given that the upgrade has been performed, should we close this thread?

 

[AidenBrooks999]

@Ant what are your thoughts from what we talk about Base Goku = SSG Goku

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Well, I agree that this does technically not make much sense, but there isn't much that we can do about it. Also, given that the upgrade has been performed, should we close this thread?

My final take on it: If the character gets a 3-A feat and there's actually a reason for it (I.e, training), then I accept it.

If they get 3-A feats but there's 0 reason for it (Like Kuririn, a character who does 0 training and is established as weaker than Goten and base Gohan), then it should be treated as an outlier.

 

[Dark649]

Why is 17 higher than vegito in Tier list and also why is Goku black lower than bergamo and toppo and vegita too

Current episode and because Bergamo beam clashed with Super Saiyan Blue Kaioken Goku, which is superior to Toppo and Vegeta, which defeated Goku Black.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

17 didn't clash with SSB Kaioken.

 

[AidenBrooks999]

Krillin is training

Even 18 says that the training machines weren't a waste while watching him fight


I don't Krillin is 3-A currently, but not far beyond.


Also, Piccolo and Gohan had some training (Yeah, not much) and that's they fought the likes of Goku

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Yeah, but the Tournament is going to happen in like, 24 hours, and Kuririn is established as weaker than base Gohan. At best he'll be 4-B. 3-A feats will be treated as an outlier.

Tien, Kuririn and Roshi are being grabbed for the tournament due to versatility. 18 and 17 were selected because Goku considered them decently powerful, but he was surprised at the level of strength 17 got due to 13 years of training.

18 hasn't trained in ever. 4-B at best for her too.

 

[AidenBrooks999]

Well, but didn't Goku and Gohan put Krillin on a similar level to Basil (He held his own and took hits from him) in they mental training.


I know it wasn't Krillin himself, but it's how Goku (Who saw Krillin's powers) see Krillin in power. So 4-B shouldn't be wrong for him.


Now, about if 3-A Base Goku is accepted, who should scale then?

 

[Dark649]

Now, about if 3-A Base Goku is accepted, who should scale then?

Base to Strongest Forms Goku, Vegeta, Copy Vegeta, Trunks, Gohan, Cabba and Zamasu. Universe 6 Saga and Onwards Piccolo and Gohan, Botamo, Frost, Watagash, Basil, Lavender, Magetta. Krillin, Roshi, Android 17 and 18, Tien and Innocent/Slim Buu.

 

[AidenBrooks999]

Oh, and the mental training was before they saw what Krillin can do

 

[AidenBrooks999]

Base to Strongest Forms Goku, Vegeta, Copy Vegeta, Trunks, Gohan, Cabba and Zamasu. Universe 6 Saga and Onwards Piccolo and Gohan, Botamo, Frost, Watagash, Basil, Lavender, Magetta. Krillin, Roshi, Android 17 and 18, Tien and Innocent/Slim Buu.

So, if Basil should 3-A (Reasonable, since he shouldn't be much weaker than his brothers, that Fought Gohan and Goku) then Krillin should scale then. The image training put him at a similar level to Basil and then he fought Gohan and Goku.

 

[Byakuya_"Senbonzakura"_Kuchiki]

Even if it wasn't SSB KK, SSB is still 3-A so I'm guessing 17 is around a low-end 3-A.

 

[Dark649]

Aiden, there are also Tagoma and Super Base Frieza, but Tagoma (Who was stated by Gohan to be comparable to him at his strongest) was overpowered by Gotenks, who is inferior to Buu Saga Mystic Gohan and was stomped by Base Copy Vegeta.

 

[AidenBrooks999]

Well, SSG was baseline 3-A, so no, is not "low end"

 

[The_Everlasting]

"And yes, but think about it. Fights like Trunks vs Black, Krillin vs Goku, Toppo vs Goku and even now 17 vs Goku would make more sense, since regular SSJ can put somewhat of a fight with them and then fight them more with SSB"

Future Trunks was demolished by SSJB Vegeta literally last episode, him fighting evenly with Black and Zamasu can't be anything more than PIS.

Goku was explicitly holding back against Krillin.

Why does Toppo vs. Goku have scaling issues? Toppo was stomping SSJ Goku and was roughly equal to SSJB/SSJB KK Goku.

Android 17 can justifiably scale to SSJB, don't know why you're bringing that up.

 

[AidenBrooks999]

Justifiably?


Well, at least the likes should still being 4-B, again, Goku himself said that krillin would be fine against the likes of Basil.


Also, Goku needed SSJ to evade getting threw by Krillin, I'm saying Krillin > Base Goku. But you can't tell me that Goku held back so much that his SSJ form < Serious base Form, at least Krillin should be Likely 4-B (Not even High 4-C considering how in is Goku in the tier)

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Krillin isn't stronger than Base Goku. This is three weeks ago all over again.

 

[AidenBrooks999]

@Matt did you even read my comment, or you just want to excise yourself out of the discussion?


I cleary said "he is not stronger than Base Goku", I'm just saying that he somewhat comparable (And since Goku is not low end 4-B, Krillin should be Likely 4-B)

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

"I'm saying Krillin > Base Goku"