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What tier is this? and also possible God (Seekers into the Mystery) upgrade

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Antvasima said:
Also, for clarification , can somebody show some proof of that all tier 1-A genuinely transdual characters are just tiny figments within his dream?
Click to expand...
The truest self, or the souls of humans are beyond Maya, The dream of God, which contains the non-existence that preceded the concept of duality, the love-man, that man that created the concept of duality isnt even the real God, he's the Magician and as the Magician said to Viola, he is merely just visiting the dream (The Magician turned into a "human" and he's already dead as shown at the end of the series)

1

2

3

"To be infinite oneness....to swim in an eternal ocean of love...if that love and oneness cant find expression. And its here, in this dream he's dreaming---in you Maya. That we find his love...we find him "

The reason why God projected Maya

The truest self of humans exists beyond Maya

1

When Maya erased (forgot her name) from the Dream, she was still able to come back and that the humans arent meant to remember the true nature of things so that they can continue being human

@Aeyu

Yeah, "At least 1-A, possibly 0" sounds good, or maybe just at least 1-A or a solid 1-A
 
Well, I would prefer to see what Azathoth and Ryukama think before proceeding, and preferably DarkLK as well. Personally, I think that a being for whom all degrees of 1-A's are merely figments of his imagination sounds like tier 0, but it is best if all three of them are asked to give input here first.
 
Antvasima said:
Well, I would prefer to see what Azathoth and Ryukama think before proceeding
Click to expand...
If you want my opinion on if this character should be Tier 0 or not, I'm fully willing to read the entire series so that I'm not going off of incomplete information. It's only 15 issues long and I'm already on "Chapter Four".
 
Okay. Thank you for the help. Assigning a tier 0 should be a pretty big deal for us.
 
@Azathoth

Ok, thanks, also, most of the stuff about God is on chap 13 upwards
 
Also, that comics didnt make sense the first time I read it, but after reading and re reading other comics by DeMatteis (The Spectre, Strange Tales, Swamp thing etc) and researching about some basic concept in Hinduism (Brahman, Atman, Maya). It makes a lot more sense.

Also, right now I dont care much about the tier he's in, so yeah do your thing

 
@Sandman

Yeah, currently on chapter 11. Wanted to take my time with it. The story is very well done.

The Magician/God in the story is based on a real life figure (Meher Baba) that influenced a lot of DeMatteis' worldview and works. IIRC, part of Baba's view was that all major religions are, in their own ways, equally valid, which ties into the perspective theme of Seekers. Interesting stuff, and makes stuff like the whole "aliens are angels are faeries" part a lot more clear.
 
I guess that's the reason why the angel has all the blood of multiple prophets from different religions?
 
Finished the story. Really pleased with how it all wrapped up, even if the ending originally wasn't intentional and was forced upon DeMatteis via outside interference from the publisher.

I don't know if I should post my thoughts now or wait until I get some sleep, because I'm just now realizing it's 4:35 AM.
 
Azathoth the Abyssal Idiot said:
Also, on a much less philosophical note, "Faced with the abyss, I did the only logical thing a man can do: I masturbated." may be one of the greatest things I've read in a while.
Click to expand...
one of the best lines i will remember for the rest of my ******* life
 
Out of curiousity, what was changed in the ending due to editorial interference?
 
@Ant

I'm not sure, exactly. In the letters section of the final issue, it was mentioned the series was planned to go on for another few years, but DeMatteis was told it had to wrap up.

"SEEKERS INTO THE MYSTERY was supposed to go on for several more years at least. When the Powers That Be informed us that we had to end the series -- and quickly, at that -- I found myself in the uneviable position of having to write a concluding chapter that I knew wasn't conclusive, at all. My apologies for the many dangling plot threads and hovering mysteries. And my sincere thanks to all the readers who were so devoted to SEEKERS, who opened their minds and hearts every month and joined me on this unique journey."
 
So, a few things:

God and the Magicia

The Nature of Maya

Humans

TL;DR

  • God and the Magician are the same being.
  • Humans are not 1-A, nor are they transdual.
  • Maya differs notably from philosophical ideas of Maya in some ways, but is very alike in others.
  • I believe Tier 0 is too speculative for God. It's not contradicted, but I don't think there's enough to go off of. However, from the context of the story, I believe just having him as 1-A and removing the "Possibly" is perfectly acceptable, now. He's treated as a genuinely transdual entity of infinite oneness who is beyond time, existed fully before creation , and who created the limitations of existence. This is sort of a CliffsNotes version, but I believe just "1-A" is perfectly acceptable. I don't believe he's "lol 1-A fodder" or something, either. He meets more requirements than just the basics in terms of abilities and his nature.
 
Sure thing. Thanks for the analysis.
 
No problem. If anything needs to be clarified, let me know. The story definitely isn't super clear cut if you're not reading through the whole thing and paying relatively close attention.
 
Also, I'd like to propose a potential image change, as there are some really excellent full-body pieces of God/the Magician throughout the series. Maybe something like this?

Raining Grace
 
I am also fine with Azathoth's proposed changes. Thank you for the analysis.
 
I'm sure there was a statement from the author about the overvoid being merely apart of this god
 
I don't know if that was ever claimed?

Seekers isn't part of main DC. It's just published by Vertigo, but is effectively its own story. The Overvoid never appears in Seekers, and is not a concept ever mentioned.
 
@Hykuu

He was referring to the ocean of nothingness from which everything originated, not the Overvoid


Little off topic but The Void in the Spectre vol 4 written also by DeMatteis was implied to be part of the Presence. The Spectre's concious limitations disappeared and he merged with "The Void beyond voids", the angels being completely transcendent beings because they came directly from the thoughts of the Presence etc
 
@Azathoth

That seems fine.
 
Maybe somebody could upload the relevant scans to this wiki instead?

This site might help with finding them:

http://***************.to/
 
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