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Welcome to Pagemageddon! Bill Cipher Rework.

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ShionAH

ShionAH

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Level 6-B is only for his Energy Projection, as he needed to increase his fist size and exert himself significantly to perform his Low 7-C feat, while he just happened to perform feat 6-B with his Energy Projection. The 6-B feat should also be listed as "possibly 6-B" since saying it weighs 9 billion tons might just be a mere insult.

For now I won't say anything regarding 2-A and Low 1-C, but I remember that the "threat to the multiverse" claims were debunked years ago. Also, the destruction of the "fabric of existence" that Time Baby mentions is supposed to be just the destruction of the universe, since that's what Blendin is saying here.
 
TheShape03 said:
Level 6-B is only for his Energy Projection, as he needed to increase his fist size and exert himself significantly to perform his Low 7-C feat, while he just happened to perform feat 6-B with his Energy Projection.
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Thats stupid, Bill clearly has the power to do that just because his big form has a weaker feat. We already know Bill has "infinite power" and has shown to stomp everyone expect Shacktron (Which had a barrier that Bill couldnt damage)

He literally shows he can be the size of the town and is only stopped by the barrier.
TheShape03 said:
The 6-B feat should also be listed as "possibly 6-B" since saying it weighs 9 billion tons might just be a mere insult.
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I disagree with this as we never really saw Bill insult Time Baby in a meaningless way. Idk why this would be an insult siince we already know Bill barely lies
TheShape03 said:
For now I won't say anything regarding 2-A and Low 1-C, but I remember that the "threat to the multiverse" claims were debunked years ago. Also, the destruction of the "fabric of existence" that Time Baby mentions is supposed to be just the destruction of the universe, since that's what Blendin is saying here.
Click to expand...
We see the rip was affecting the entire multiverse which is why Time Baby likely didnt mean only one universe.
 
ShionAH said:
Thats stupid, Bill clearly has the power to do that just because his big form has a weaker feat. We already know Bill has "infinite power" and has shown to stomp everyone expect Shacktron which is inv
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If Bill can deliver punches with the same power as his energy beams, why did he need to increase his size and massively increase the size of his fist to perform a LOW 7-C feat? :v No, it doesn't make sense for Bill to be 6-B physically if he, even if he tries hard, can't do even the shadow of damage that he does with an energy beam.
ShionAH said:
I disagree with this as we never really saw Bill insult Time Baby in a meaningless way. Idk why this would be an insult siince we already know Bill barely lies
Click to expand...
Well, "Low 7-C physically, 6-B with Energy Projection" should do the trick.
ShionAH said:
We see the rip was affecting the entire multiverse which is why Time Baby likely didnt mean only one universe.
Click to expand...
I'll remain neutral on this topic, but I'll just say this for the record: there is a direct statement that Bill only destroyed the universe + it didn't affect the timeline, since Blendin could still travel to that point in time. Additionally, Bill and other characters implied that it was only going to affect the universe/dimension.

There is literally a note on the current profile that says so.

Note: Bill being a threat to the multiverse doesn't indicate that he is able to destroy all of it. It simply means that he isn't a localized threat, as he has the ability to travel to other universes.

Blendin knowing that the universe was destroyed means his best feat explicitly can't be Low 2-C, as the timeline isn't destroyed by it. That knowledge could have come from the Time Police in the future, or when Blendin fled he could have travelled to another point in time to know that the universe would be destroyed, since he mentioned it as something that already happened.

Stanford Pines was worried that Bill might destroy the universe despite how Bill only told him his delusional plan of chaotically ruling it over, while causing notably less damage around in the universe but without destroying it all, meaning that Ford likely knew what Bill could cause. "The very fabric of" something and mentioning "existence" don't necessarily mean the entirety of something and all the realities in a verse respectively, unless proven, and Time Baby clearly referred to the universe as that was what Blendin said was destroyed and what Ford was repeatedly worried that Bill might destroy.
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TheShape03 said:
there is a direct statement that Bill only destroyed the universe
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he was still affecting the multiverse, we have him shake the entire nightmare realm and the multiverse because of the rift which seems a bit more than universa LOL
TheShape03 said:
If Bill can deliver punches with the same power as his energy beams, why did he need to increase his size and massively increase the size of his fist to perform a LOW 7-C feat? :v No, it doesn't make sense for Bill to be 6-B physically if he, even if he tries hard, can't do even the shadow of damage that he does with an energy beam.
Click to expand...



He holds back even in his giant form. He can get bigger
 
I will say, I disagree with physically 6B bill, I think low 7c physical bill is fine and the rest go to his energy attacks

though didn't weirdmaggedon have holes in alternate realities in that mabel comic? That should be enough evidence for interdimensional range
 
Lord_Farquaad69420 said:
I will say, I disagree with physically 6B bill, I think low 7c physical bill is fine and the rest go to his energy attacks
Click to expand...
It seems weird to say Bill cannot tank his own energy attacks with him showing his powers are galactic at the very least
 
ShionAH said:
He holds back even in his giant form. He can get bigger
Click to expand...
So what you're trying to tell me is that Bill was holding back here? I know he can become giant, and when he does, his physical capabilities increase, Bill needed to massively increase the size of his fist (and therefore increase his strength a bit) to do this, and I'm supposed to think that at his normal size he can casually perform 6-B physical feats?
AParticularInduvidial said:
I'm pretty sure the reason Bill grew in size at all was so he had the large size to completely eradicate the Mystery Shack all at once, but that's just what I gathered from the scene.
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It makes sense, but what need did he have to increase the size of his fist like that if not to try to hit harder? Furthermore, taking into account his subsequent frustrated reaction upon seeing that he did nothing to them, it was obvious that he wanted to destroy them with that blow.
 
TheShape03 said:
It makes sense, but what need did he have to increase the size of his fist like that if not to try to hit harder? Furthermore, taking into account his subsequent frustrated reaction upon seeing that he did nothing to them, it was obvious that he wanted to destroy them with that blow.
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I rewatched the scene, he was already at a large size when talking to Ford, he just grew his hand, then he proceed to muda muda the shack with his regular hands.
 
It's probably better to just list him as "Up to 2-A, likely Low 1-C" or an Unknown since his normal stats are, well, unknown
Still find his "Infinite Perception Speed" pretty iffy, but ehhh
Also both it and his "Galaxy level via Size Manipulation" lack justifications
 
TheShape03 said:
So what you're trying to tell me is that Bill was holding back here? I know he can become giant, and when he does, his physical capabilities increase, Bill needed to massively increase the size of his fist (and therefore increase his strength a bit) to do this, and I'm supposed to think that at his normal size he can casually perform 6-B physical feats?

It makes sense, but what need did he have to increase the size of his fist like that if not to try to hit harder? Furthermore, taking into account his subsequent frustrated reaction upon seeing that he did nothing to them, it was obvious that he wanted to destroy them with that blow.
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He literally shows that he can big enough to fill the entire town. So to say that he is using his full power there is just arrogant just like bill himself

I dont see how Big Bill gets one shotted by his own energy beams when he has shown the capacity to affect galaxies at worst and multiverses at best.
 
Lord_Farquaad69420 said:
I rewatched the scene, he was already at a large size when talking to Ford, he just grew his hand, then he proceed to muda muda the shack with his regular hands.
Click to expand...
However, it grew even more when leaving the pyramid. Furthermore, I repeat that he needed to increase the size of his fist with the obvious need to increase his strength and only managed to deal damage calculated at Low 7-C. Doesn't anyone really find it strange that Bill is 6-B physically but he has to put in considerable effort to perform a feat thousands of times weaker? xd...

Anyway, I don't agree with Bill 6-B physically for obvious reasons, but I do agree with the majority of the rest of the things, the Infinite perception speed seems dubious to me but I would prefer that someone with more experience address that topic. And I already said what I had to say about 2-A/Low 1-C.
 
TheShape03 said:
However, it grew even more when leaving the pyramid. Furthermore, I repeat that he needed to increase the size of his fist with the obvious need to increase his strength and only managed to deal damage calculated at Low 7-C. Doesn't anyone really find it strange that Bill is 6-B physically but he has to put in considerable effort to perform a feat thousands of times weaker? xd...
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Tbf dc =/= a/p, also why would he then think a barrage of smallers hands be better in a fight that repeatedly smashing the mystery shack unless the gap in power isn't that different and merely just increases his range
 
Wanted to put this here for the funni
https://media.**********.net/attachments/1151206132312973372/1151645850104246323/SHACKTRON_1.gif
 
I already told to you to slow down... this thing feels rushed.

I originally planned to revise the verse myself once I get back on it, so I can misremember some stuff.

To be fair, I think that Bill should simply be "3-C, possibly 2-A to Low 1-C".

He has promised to give to Stanley his own galaxy, and to Stanford he's shown to him that he can enlarge himself to galaxy size, meaning that should be a minimum (no idea how coul Efi get 4-A lmao, by calc this is 3-B minimum anyway), so him being a galaxy level should definitely be a thing at least, given that by his powers he has to be at least on that level of power.

"But he has problems with the Shackle!"

Well, first of all, Bill was never truly serious as the only real reason why the Shacktron was able to fight back was because of the unicorn dust protecting him, as it's literally the anti-weirdness thing of the verse, and the only real damage Bill received from the Shacktron was to the eye, which we all know it being his weak spot.

Plus he finds the end of the reality from the Weirdmageddon to be just a game, so...

The 2-A to Low 1-C explain by themselves on the profile tbh. But I think is more due to Bill sustaining the Weirdmageddon, so it being more a side effect of his hax can still be argued, but at the same time it can still be argued to scale to his physicals given that is still a stabilization feat, only that instead of a structure is stabilizing an event which was gonna destroy existence itself, so anything goes here.

I don't see how his durability shouldn't scale to his AP, as is basically an Arceus thing here, where he has some inconsistencies which can be explained from just him playing with his food too much (given that he only was serious against the TB, but he ****** around all the time with the Pines), both Ford and himself essentially imply that the destruction of existence wouldn't affect him much. Bill also described as having infinite power, so I don't see why would he downplay himself from saying his durability is infinities below his AP.
Adem_Warlock69 said:
Wanted to put this here for the funni
https://media.**********.net/attachments/1151206132312973372/1151645850104246323/SHACKTRON_1.gif
Click to expand...
I dunno man, the same Shaktron needed max power output to overpower all the Hencemaniacs at once, and they're afraid of a serious Bill. So saying that Bill is on the same tier as his minions who are all scared of him to the point of not daring to question him or running away the second he gets mad is just... dishonest.
DarkDragonMedeus said:
Will check later, I have work today and neutral for now.
Click to expand...
Now done my essay.
ShionAH said:
I am uncertain on this one since I frankly dont know which hax it is
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I'd say just Resistance to Quantum Manipulation and nothing else, I guess.
 
ShionAH said:
He literally shows that he can big enough to fill the entire town. So to say that he is using his full power there is just arrogant just like bill himself
Click to expand...
I was talking about separating his physical strength level from his power level by using his powers as his energy projection, but if it's labeled "up to 2-A, likely Low 1-C" (or 3-C, possibly 2-A to Low 1-C. Whatever is decided here) I think that wouldn't make much sense, since at that point his energy beam would produce a power infinitely less than what Bill has on his own. Placing him as a 6-B with Energy Projection would be a little ridiculous.

Well, I changed my mind, I agree. Although I still have my doubts regarding infinite perception speed and tier 2-A/Low 1-C, but I'll let more experienced users talk about that, anyway, good job.

I guess something like "Varies. 6-B, up to 3-C, possibly 2-A to Low 1-C" or "Varies. 6-B up to 2-A, possibly Low 1-C" would make sense.

Could it be that a future... Bill is High 1-C again...?
 
Following. Will go through this later!

Spoilers for now: I agree with 2-A AP! I disagree with durability and striking strength scaling completely! And I disagree with Low 1-C!

:d
 
TheShape03 said:
I guess something like "Varies. 6-B, up to 3-C, possibly 2-A to Low 1-C" or "Varies. 6-B up to 2-A, possibly Low 1-C" would make sense.
Click to expand...
I totally disagree with 6-B being his base tier tbh, seems a bit too much of a downplay given his stuff.
 
StrymULTRA said:
I dunno man, the same Shaktron needed max power output to overpower all the Hencemaniacs at once, and they're afraid of a serious Bill. So saying that Bill is on the same tier as his minions who are all scared of him to the point of not daring to question him or running away the second he gets mad is just... dishonest.
Click to expand...
Bill has 2-A, likely Low 1-C powers and Low-Godly Regen, while the Hencemaniacs mostly get their powers from Bill making them bigger and have no hax that I am aware of, one of them could be 2-C and it wouldn't change much.

The gif above has Shacktron pushing Bill around and him grunting with every hit, to the point that lad was knocked to the ground, so I personally wouldn't consider the eye attack as the only real damage it dealt, plus the anti-weirdness bubble would only really protect them from Bill's attacks.
If he really had 3-C durability, both Shacktron and Bill wouldn't be able to flinch, let alone move each other
 
Phoenks said:
Following. Will go through this later!

Spoilers for now: I agree with 2-A AP! I disagree with durability and striking strength scaling completely! And I disagree with Low 1-C!

:d
Click to expand...
I think possibly low 1-C is fine since the evidence for the nightmare realm being a higher realm is there with a statement about 5th dimensional calculus being there, but thats the highest I'd place it
 
Adem_Warlock69 said:
The gif above has Shacktron pushing Bill around and him grunting with every hit, to the point that he was knocked to the ground, so I wouldn't consider the eye attack as the only real damage it dealt, plus the anti-weirdness bubble would only really protect them from Bill's attacks.
If he really had 3-C durability, both Shacktron and Bill wouldn't be able to flinch, let alone move each other
Click to expand...
I forgot to put the fact that Bill is the same guy who finds pain to be hilarious.

Besides, it still fits with Bill being not serious at all against the humans, given that he logically would find something on par with his man entertaining enough (and if you argue Bill being on same tier with the Hencemaniacs physically it makes 0 sense and you know it).
 
Lord_Farquaad69420 said:
I think possibly low 1-C is fine since the evidence for the nightmare realm being a higher realm is there with a statement about 5th dimensional calculus being there, but thats the highest I'd place it
Click to expand...
Ye, this website is known to be waaaaaaay too nitpicky for my taste, so completely disgreading it is dishonest as hell.
 
StrymULTRA said:
I forgot to put the fact that Bill is the same guy who finds pain to be hilarious.

Besides, it still fits with Bill being not serious at all against the humans, given that he logically would find something on par with his man entertaining enough (and if you argue Bill being on same tier with the Hencemaniacs physically it makes 0 sense and you know it).
Click to expand...
Bill was like super peeved before fighting da Shack and even tried to one-shot em before he realized it had the bubble, so ehhh
Bill never throws hands in his normal size or ever or gets hit, so I think Unknown works best as his baseline
 
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