VSBW Hax Tier List/Hax discussion

[Sparx_gaming]

Reflection is prolly fine somewhere in high, Adaption should be somewhere in Low, and Alt Future Display could reach Low Godly

Reflection can be broken asf if given context

Same with adaption

Alt future display isn't that broken characters can just show alt future of others not alter it or anything so high is ok for it

 

[Brogeefrong]

Reflection can be broken asf if given context

Judged in a vacuum so it stays around high

Same with adaption

Adaption is basically non combat applicable accelerated development

Alt future display isn't that broken characters can just show alt future of others not alter it or anything so high is ok for it

alt future is basically pre cognition

 

[Brogeefrong]

Putting NEP type 1/3 aspect 5 at bottom Low godly

 

[Fezzih_007]

What we do about plot Manipulation?

 

[Brogeefrong]

What we do about plot Manipulation?

Likely in High Godly, at least around regen

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

immersion, quantum manipulation, space-time manipulation and black hole creation.

Shouldn't CM1 be in High-Godly tier?

 

[Brogeefrong]

immersion, quantum manipulation, space-time manipulation and black hole creation.

They would all prolly be in Low Godly

Shouldn't CM1 be in High-Godly tier?

I dont think in a vacuum it stacks up to alot of the uninteractable degrees of the High Godly tiers

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

They would all prolly be in Low Godly

I dont think in a vacuum it stacks up to alot of the uninteractable degrees of the High Godly tiers

Immersion and CM potency depend on the verse.

Immersion can be used to enter other forms of reality(fiction, dreams, video games) or can be used to trap someone there.
sealing someone inside a cartoon sounds very OP to me.

CM1 can be something like an absolute idea by an omnipotent being that govern creation(ideas, laws of math and physics, forms of existence) so it varies.

(nice profile picture)

 

[Brogeefrong]

Immersion and CM potency depend on the verse.

Immersion can be used to enter other forms of reality(fiction, dreams, video games) or can be used to trap someone there.
sealing someone inside a cartoon sounds very OP to me.

Immersion is alot more specifc

CM1 can be something like an absolute idea by an omnipotent being that govern creation(ideas, laws of math and physics, forms of existence) so it varies.

then id prolly bump cm and info to the same level as plot manip but still lower

(nice profile picture)

thank you sir

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

Immersion is alot more specifc

you sure?

Immersion is an ability which allows one to cross the boundary between fiction and reality and enter the imaginary locations depicted in books, paintings, movies etc. The places and time periods accessed through this ability are conceptual, as in they do not exist in reality, but users of this ability can still interact with and explore them like they can any place in the real world.

Examples of Immersion would be jumping through paintings into the worlds displayed on them, entering a book and becoming part of the story, and so on. Users can use this ability to retrieve weapons or other useful tools from fiction, evade attacks by entering these other fictional worlds, or use them to BFR or seal opponents. In many cases, users often need a medium that displays their target location as a gateway.

It depend on the mechanism(varies?).

then id prolly bump cm and info to the same level as plot manip but still lower

CM2 is like info type 2 except CM2 change and the govern the world indirectly. CM1 us literally a god hax it is the manipulation of ideas that govern reality while being higher than reality and everything related like the plot or
duality: by being the complet opposite of another concept (life/death, existence/nonexistence)
and sometimes it has a R>F relation with everything below.
so it also varies.

 

[Brogeefrong]

you sure?

It depend on the mechanism(varies?).

Tbh with all the varying mechanics idk where it would go

CM2 is like info type 2 except CM2 change and the govern the world indirectly. CM1 us literally a god hax it is the manipulation of ideas that govern reality while being higher than reality and everything related like the plot or
duality: by being the complet opposite of another concept (life/death, existence/nonexistence)
and sometimes it has a R>F relation with everything below.
so it also varies.

Info type 2 is that it builds reality, meaning it is also independent like CM1 as both are not depended on reality itself,

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

Tbh with all the varying mechanics idk where it would go

High-Godly?
sometimes it transcend fiction.

Info type 2 is that it builds reality, meaning it is also independent like CM1 as both are not depended on reality itself,

No, info type 2 is the direct information of reality, it is reality itself as 1 and 0.
Concept type 2 is more abstract and it's indirectly governing reality.
Concept type 1 is completly independent from reality(laws, concepts type 2, info type 2).
CM1>Laws and CM2≥Info type 2≥reality warping

 

[Brogeefrong]

High-Godly?
sometimes it transcend fiction.

Sometimes but i'm not putting everything at its highest level unless there are different types or stuff like NPI or Dura Negation would also be High Godly

No, info type 2 is the direct information of reality, it is reality itself as 1 and 0.
Concept type 2 is more abstract and it's indirectly governing reality.
Concept type 1 is completly independent from reality(laws, concepts type 2, info type 2).
CM1>Laws and CM2≥Info type 2≥reality warping

Fundamental: These characters can manipulate information, which serves as fundamental building block of reality.
Type 2 manipulates what builds reality, building reality means it is not depended on reality

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

Fundamental: These characters can manipulate information, which serves as fundamental building block of reality.
Type 2 manipulates what builds reality, building reality means it is not depended on reality

It is not dependent or independent but reality itself as information.
People who precieve or manipulate the reality as 1 and 0, like Neo from The Matrix.

This can allow characters to rewrite the world to their whims, often by programming it much like they would a virtual reality. These manipulation can come on many levels. For some it might just be the mechanism behind mundane magical abilities, while others can rewrite information to change reality, causality or the laws of nature.

think of it as a reality hacker.

while CM is:

However, through this power, one can change the universe's fundamental principles on the highest level.

Each concept is linked with its respective "object". In this way, altering the concept will change every object linked to it in the same way the concept itself was changed.

even CM type 2 is higher:

This type of conceptual manipulation can only be obtained if the abstract concept itself is changed directly, and not by indirect methods. For example, destroying humanity and thus "ending the concept of humanity" would not qualify, while directly "ending the concept of humanity" and thus destroying humanity would qualify.

It work by changing a concept directly and reality will be affected by this. Like a "domino effect".

 

[Brogeefrong]

It is not dependent or independent but reality itself as information.
People who precieve or manipulate the reality as 1 and 0, like Neo from The Matrix.

think of it as a reality hacker.

while CM is:

Information can also change the fundamental principle's of reality, as if lets say the information color red was turned into blue, all things red would become blue as the information that makes up red has been changed

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

Information can also change the fundamental principle's of reality, as if lets say the information color red was turned into blue, all things red would become blue as the information that makes up red has been changed

Here you're talking about concept of red and blue, that would be CM type 2.

info type 2 will be by changing everything red manually instead of just targetting the concept itself.

 

[Brogeefrong]

Here you're talking about concept of red and blue, that would be CM type 2.

Loose example, things that are fundamental/independent can also be changed by their information

info type 2 will be by changing everything red manually instead of just targetting the concept itself.

What I mean by this is the information of X, which Y is dependent on X, when X is changed Y is also changed

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

Loose example, things that are fundamental can also be changed by their information

info type 2 itself is what fundamental and what make up reality, but not a concept.

What I mean by this is the information of X, which Y is dependent on X, when X is changed Y is also changed

yeah, this is CM2.

Look

2. Dependent Concepts: Such concepts are abstract and govern all reality within their area of influence. These concepts shape everything, and changing them would either require the alteration of every object of the concept or, if manipulated directly, change all objects of the concept alongside the concept itself. These concepts, however, exist simultaneously with and are bound by the object of the concept. In this way, an abstract dependent concept can be destroyed by destroying all objects of the concept, restored by re-making an object of a previously existent concept, or changed by changing all objects of the concept across reality. This, however, does not qualify for this form of conceptual manipulation, and is rather treated as a by-product of another action akin to a "domino effect". This type of conceptual manipulation can only be obtained if the abstract concept itself is changed directly, and not by indirect methods. For example, destroying humanity and thus "ending the concept of humanity" would not qualify, while directly "ending the concept of humanity" and thus destroying humanity would qualify.

you got it?
Concept type 2 is like info type 2 but more abstract.

 

[Westcoast5005]

Adaptation/re evolution should be high godly cause at it’s peak it can counter anything if it’s unrestricted

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

Adaptation/re evolution should be high godly cause at it’s peak it can counter anything if it’s unrestricted

like scp 682

 

[Brogeefrong]

info type 2 itself is what fundamental and what make up reality, but not a concept.

Concepts make up reality, as they are fundamental in a reality's creation, and Information can change them

 

[Brogeefrong]

Adaptation/re evolution should be high godly cause at it’s peak it can counter anything if it’s unrestricted

Too varied

 

[Westcoast5005]

Too varied

Isn’t the list about the hax at its peak?

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

Concepts make up reality, as they are fundamental in a reality's creation, and Information can change them

info manipulation can change the world but not the concept.
but this also depend on the verse.

You can just ask someone here.

 

[Brogeefrong]

Isn’t the list about the hax at its peak?

Nah only around their baseline or whatever is listed on the page itself

 

[Brogeefrong]

info manipulation can change the world but not the concept.
but this also depend on the verse.

Concepts can be considered as information, as they are fundamental building blocks of reality

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

Concepts can be considered as information, as they are fundamental building blocks of reality

That's 1 and 0 I mentioned before and not concepts

concept are fundamental to reality but they are abstract and not made from it(1and0).

Conceptual Manipulation involves the manipulation of concepts, and not the universe directly. However, through this power, one can change the universe's fundamental principles on the highest level.

CM 2: manipulate reality indirectly.
info type 2: manipulate reality directly.

 

[Brogeefrong]

Ill lower info type 2 lower into High Godly or around top Mid Godly along side CM2 then

 

[Brogeefrong]

But couldnt Information still interact with something abstract, or does it need proof that a character could interact with something abstract first

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

Ill lower info type 2 lower into High Godly or around top Mid Godly along side CM2 then

Godly: CM1(high), CM2(mid), Info type 2(mid or low)

Note: some haxes are in the wrong tier.

But couldnt Information still interact with something abstract, or does it need proof that a character could interact with something abstract first

It depend on the verse but mostly it can't go higher than reality.

CM1>CM2≥info type 2

 

[Brogeefrong]

Godly: CM1(high), CM2(mid), Info type 2(mid or low)

Note: some haxes are in the wrong tier.

Alot of them are based on the opinion i got here

It depend on the verse but mostly it can't go higher than reality.

CM1>CM2≥info type 2

If you mean by higher D, Concepts by default they aren't higher dimensional
If you mean by being on a higher order, Info Type 2 would be above, as Cm2 are still bounded by their reality and Information would be above the reality as it builds it

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

If you mean by higher D, Concepts by default they aren't higher dimensional
If you mean by being on a higher order, Info Type 2 would be above.

No, I mean higher as deeper and more fundamental to reality, a character can have a concept without info type 2 .
Info type 2 is reality itself, any reality warper can get this as long he see the world as information.

as Cm2 are still bounded by their reality and Information would be above the reality as it builds it

reality doesn't include concepts, otherwise any reality warper will get CM, you can check for youself.

Ex: if atoms are info type 2 then CM will be quantum string.

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

acausality type4>type 3

while type 3 can be dealt with by having 2-B or 2-A range, type 4 sometimes transcend the system(CM, Laws, info, reality...) making it unaffected by any hax, it's like a limited version of type 5.

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

About CM type 2 and info type 2: I have been looking and it appear that it depend on the verse, so just put them in the same spot.

 

[Brogeefrong]

acausality type4>type 3

while type 3 can be dealt with by having 2-B or 2-A range, type 4 sometimes transcend the system(CM, Laws, info, reality...) making it unaffected by any hax, it's like a limited version of type 5.

The Type 3 example is tier dependent, and the example for Type 4 is Type 5

 

[FentyBeauty]

probability manipulation, fate manipulation, law manipulation, chaos manipulation, causality manipulation, void manipulation, quantum manipulation, physics manipulation, death manipulation should be somewhere on this list (idk exactly where tho)

 

[Brogeefrong]

probability manipulation, fate manipulation, law manipulation, chaos manipulation, causality manipulation, void manipulation, quantum manipulation, physics manipulation, death manipulation should be somewhere on this list (idk exactly where tho)

Most if not all would be godly

 

[Brogeefrong]

Biology Manipulation/Transmutation and stuff similar would be where?

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

Biology Manipulation/Transmutation and stuff similar would be where?

Biology could be use to mimic powers like Ben 10 or works as a form of reactive evolution like Kars(Jojo).

transmutation just below low godly

 

[Brogeefrong]

Biology could be use to mimic powers like Ben 10 or works as a form of reactive evolution like Kars(Jojo).

RE and Power Mimicry vary a lot, also it can be used on others, maybe it should go near transmutation

transmutation just below low godly

you mean in low godly or in high tier