Vecna vs Kevin

[ThanatosX]

You’re half right.

NEP Type 1 means you can’t be effected because your mind doesn’t exist in the normal sense.

However, if you are fighting an opponent who can affect NEP Type 1, mind manipulation will affect you no problem. Just because he can affect robots and NEP doesn’t make his mind Manip more potent.

Not a deciding factor though like you mentioned.

Thanks for the explanation, now it's more clear to me how this works. With this information, I think that Vecna shouldn't have problems resisting Kevin's Fear Manipulation.

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

Tecnically speaking, BFR doesn't have dimensional potency, it's EE the thing that has it and since in Honkai those two work simultaneosly that's why many says that Honkai's characters has 11D BFR when in reality is the EE that has that.

If in Honkai the BFR work simultaneosly with EE, that mean that to get BFR one first need to be erased, so their resistance to BFR should be a unconventional one in the case they resist the BFR after be erased, or just resistance to EE because they resist be erased and thus can't be BFR.

 

[Vietthai96]

Honkai EE have 11D because Sea of Quanta is 11D structure, but again only the place have that 11D stuff, so if you get throw into that place have 11D hax to your face.

 

[ThanatosX]

If in Honkai the BFR work simultaneosly with EE, that mean that to get BFR one first need to be erased, so their resistance to BFR should be a unconventional one in the case they resist the BFR after be erased, or just resistance to EE because they resist be erased and thus can't be BFR.

The thing is a bit more complicated. The BFR/EE that many talks about is a specific type of BFR, that turns the person that is subjected to it into a Quantic State. In this state, everything gets erased and transported to the Sea of Quanta. One can go into a Quantic State in many ways, and one of the means is by entiring the Sea of Quanta which passively erase everything that enters it and turn it into a Quantic State. Another way for turning in that state is through Quantum Fluctations, and in this case if you are in a "normal Universe" you will get erased and transported to the Sea of Quanta, and here is the BFR/EE thing.

I agree that this specific BFR is more of a EE thing, but in Honkai there are many other ways to BFR someone, with one of the most common/used being the one that Vietthai96 is telling, which simply trows you into the Sea of Quanta and is more BFR.

I think BFR is the most used ability after Corruption, many characters use it in many different occasions. Kevin resistence, specifically, comes from the fact that he was completely immune from the BFR of the Star of Eden, a weapon which main thing is BFR.

 

[ThanatosX]

This match seems mainly based on how the BFR works, how it's activated, how likely Vecna start with it and other factors. Does anyone have more informations about it? Because I can't find the BFR ability in Vecna's profile, so I don't know where to take the informations needed.

Bump

 

[Lapsad]

Bump.

 

[Vietthai96]

Should have called D&D supporter to debate this, i know nothing about that verse to sure the result of the battle aside from R1 with unequal speed

 

[Mr. Bambu]

an*me

disgusting

Anyways yeah if Kevin doesn't have resistances on the level of Vecna casting him into the Far Realm then this really is a pointless debate. I should also note that while Dragonstitch is correct regarding the whole layers of resistance thing (resistances of D&D characters improves as you go up, progressively adding on more "layers"), Vecna has this in regards to 4-D, not 3-D hax. Everyone above 6-C possesses this. So even disregarding the whole "Vecna feeds you to Cthulhu" argument, unless this guy is packing smurf resistances (I do recall this particular weeb verse having Tier 1s?) then literally there is no debate here whatsoever.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

also for speed unequalized I really should go do those calcs that give anyone above 9-A Rel+ speed, huh?

 

[Tllmbrg]

also for speed unequalized I really should go do those calcs that give anyone above 9-A Rel+ speed, huh?

Yes

 

[ThanatosX]

Most, or at least some, of Kevin's resistences are High 1-C in potency, coming from the fact that he is able to resist all of the various effects of the Sea of Quanta. He also possess many powerful offensive smurf haxes, most notably Spatial Manipulation, Quantum Manipulation and probably many others that we still don't know for sure since he seems pretty casual most of the times he fight.

And I'm not really sure about this, but does characters that possess an high amount of Honkai Energy also emanates Honkai Radiation from their body? This would give him passive Corruption, but I'm not sure if Kevin specifically has it. The only characters that I know has this passive are the Herrschers like Sirin, not sure about the others.

Though, I'm not really sure if all of this is enough to put a fight against Vecna since I know very little about the character and he seems powerful.

 

[Jackof_noTrades068]

Most, or at least some, of Kevin's resistences are High 1-C in potency, coming from the fact that he is able to resist all of the various effects of the Sea of Quanta. He also possess many powerful offensive smurf haxes, most notably Spatial Manipulation, Quantum Manipulation and probably many others that we still don't know for sure since he seems pretty casual most of the times he fight.

And I'm not really sure about this, but does characters that possess an high amount of Honkai Energy also emanates Honkai Radiation from their body? This would give him passive Corruption, but I'm not sure if Kevin specifically has it. The only characters that I know has this passive are the Herrschers like Sirin, not sure about the others.

Though, I'm not really sure if all of this is enough to put a fight against Vecna since I know very little about the character and he seems powerful.

Herrschers and Honkai beasts have it passively
However for Mantis’s like Kevin or Valks it’s not passive however their attacks powered by Honkai energy or simply choosing to radiate Honkai energy would logically have that corruption after effect if they hit someone with no Honkai resistance

 

[Lapsad]

What was all need in this fight is he incon with vecna by speed unequal like nanashi.

 

[Zencha9]

nanashi

oh no no

 

[Vietthai96]

Herrschers and Honkai beasts have it passively
However for Mantis’s like Kevin or Valks it’s not passive however their attacks powered by Honkai energy or simply choosing to radiate Honkai energy would logically have that corruption after effect if they hit someone with no Honkai resistance

No, herrscher and honkai user isn't only honkai beasts, if Mei is passive she will everyone around her, same with Kiana

 

[Jackof_noTrades068]

No, herrscher and honkai user isn't only honkai beasts, if Mei is passive she will everyone around her, same with Kiana

Please rephrase that as I don’t think I understood what you truly meant

But assuming I do understand what you mean its very clear that Herrschers passively corrupt as shown with Mei in Nagazora and I already specified it’s not passive for Honkai users in general
Just their attacks would corrupt due to being made out of/powered by Honkai
Since Kevin falls into the category of just a Honkai user the specifics of Herrschers don’t matter to this thread

 

[ThanatosX]

To make it clear, it's Mei's Herrscher Persona that have passive Corruption, not Mei herself. This is why the moment her Herrscher Persona awekened she turned the entire Nagazora population into zombies and Honkai Beasts. After fusing with her Herrscher Persona, she also has passive Corruption, but only in her Herrscher Form.

Only Herrscher Personas and Herrscher Forms emanates Honkai Radiations from their bodies, not the normal hosts like Kiana or Mei.

 

[Vietthai96]

Write to rush, sorry, but when HoT first time appear she burst out a wave of honkai energy, so that is passive. But full-fledged herrscher that have control over Honkai Energy can restrain it so it don't release to enviroment to corrupt everything

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Most, or at least some, of Kevin's resistences are High 1-C in potency, coming from the fact that he is able to resist all of the various effects of the Sea of Quanta. He also possess many powerful offensive smurf haxes, most notably Spatial Manipulation, Quantum Manipulation and probably many others that we still don't know for sure since he seems pretty casual most of the times he fight.

And I'm not really sure about this, but does characters that possess an high amount of Honkai Energy also emanates Honkai Radiation from their body? This would give him passive Corruption, but I'm not sure if Kevin specifically has it. The only characters that I know has this passive are the Herrschers like Sirin, not sure about the others.

Though, I'm not really sure if all of this is enough to put a fight against Vecna since I know very little about the character and he seems powerful.

Which ones aren't based on the Sea of Quanta, then, I guess.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

What was all need in this fight is he incon with vecna by speed unequal like nanashi.

Actually, probably not, interestingly enough. Vecna has the intelligence for precog based on analysis- so Vecna can just... read the guy, and act accordingly.

If this truly isn't enough, again, I can literally go do the Rel+-ish speed feats lol

 

[ThanatosX]

Actually, probably not, interestingly enough. Vecna has the intelligence for precog based on analysis- so Vecna can just... read the guy, and act accordingly.

If this truly isn't enough, again, I can literally go do the Rel+-ish speed feats lol

Doesn't he have Precog only on his second key? And what types of advantage this will give him if he have it on his first key? Would he know the resistances Kevin has or the haxes he can use?

Sorry if I ask a lot of questions but before giving my opinion on this fight I prefer to know everything about both fighters, because both of them are really powerful and a single ability might change the match.

 

[Tllmbrg]

Doesn't he have Precog only on his second key? And what types of advantage this will give him if he have it on his first key? Would he know the resistances Kevin has or the haxes he can use?

Nah, anyone with intelligence score of 21 and above should have it
As for the latter, eh I'd imagine yes since something like a Beholder which is vastly inferior in intelligence and lacks the precog already has counter plans to almost any scenario out there so I'd imagine someone who dwarfs beings like that can figure that much

 

[Lapsad]

Even if jacky can precog what he will do ? , His thinking is fast enough to catch up with sup-rel ?

 

[Jackof_noTrades068]

Even if jacky can precog what he will do ? , His thinking is fast enough to catch up with sup-rel ?

Kevin is well over a hundred times faster than him
No level of precog can compensate for such a speed gap even if he can see the attacks coming

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Y'all really gonna make me stop being lazy, huh

alright, give me a few

 

[ThanatosX]

Weren't we talking about the Speed Equalized round? Did I missed something?

By the way, if Vecna has Precog in his first key too the profile should be edited.

And would the Precog be able to actually predict something that has an higher dimensional potency? If yes than I believe Vecna has a good chance of winning this.

Honestly, I think that Sirin would be a better opponent against Vecna. Her passives would give him more than a problem. Maybe I'll do the match in the future (if I remember to lol)

 

[Mr. Bambu]

D&D Calc: Dodging Actual Light

vsbattles.fandom.com

alright you guys got me to work on it

if that was the point then you win smh

only took me one year from Point A (someone pointing the feat out to me) and Point B (actually calc'ing it since a random match didn't have speed equalized overall for once)

 

[Tllmbrg]

And would the Precog be able to actually predict something that has an higher dimensional potency? If yes than I believe Vecna has a good chance of winning this.

How is the higher D making it harder to precog?
But even if you argue that there's other smurf hax flying around in verse he should be able to precog so

 

[Jackof_noTrades068]

D&D Calc: Dodging Actual Light

vsbattles.fandom.com

alright you guys got me to work on it

if that was the point then you win smh

only took me one year from Point A (someone pointing the feat out to me) and Point B (actually calc'ing it since a random match didn't have speed equalized overall for once)

Wow, the guy actually went out of his way to Calc it to avoid Vecna getting blitzed in non equalized.
Lmfao
Well when that gets evaluated, I guess Kevin will be out paced until we have that Honkai Gamma ray revision?
Never expected a vs thread to go like this

 

[Lapsad]

**** , @Jackof_noTrades068 we need FTL+ speed.

 

[Jackof_noTrades068]

**** @Jackof_noTrades068 we need FTL+ speed.

Even if the light gets approved the most that would allow in terms of general combat speed is Sub relativistic+ upscaling and technically an AP upgrade indirectly. FTL reactions would still be there tho

 

[Zencha9]

bambu did what we call
"a bro gamer move"

 

[ThanatosX]

How is the higher D making it harder to precog?
But even if you argue that there's other smurf hax flying around in verse he should be able to precog so

If his Precog is based on intelligence, he actually need to understand an higher dimensional ability to predict it. He shouldn't be able to predict something that he can't understand.

Thinking in higher dimensional ways is something that actually plays an important role in one of Honkai Impact's manga.

Btw, I am debating about the Speed Equalized match. I really dislike the Speed Unequalized matches because they always end in a speed blitz.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

If his Precog is based on intelligence, he actually need to understand an higher dimensional ability to predict it. He shouldn't be able to predict something that he can't understand.

Thinking in higher dimensional ways is something that actually plays an important role in one of Honkai Impact's manga.

Btw, I am debating about the Speed Equalized match. I really dislike the Speed Unequalized matches because they always end in a speed blitz.

Vecna does understand higher dimensional stuff though. We have evidence of even mortals managing to seal away Tier 1 creatures (see: Pandorym) and Vecna himself is capable of analyzing aberrations and Elder Evils, such as Father Llymic, the Uvuudaum, and civilizations like the Mind Flayers.

 

[ThanatosX]

Vecna does understand higher dimensional stuff though. We have evidence of even mortals managing to seal away Tier 1 creatures (see: Pandorym) and Vecna himself is capable of analyzing aberrations and Elder Evils, such as Father Llymic, the Uvuudaum, and civilizations like the Mind Flayers.

So he understands 1-A beings. Than yes, he most likely wins this match.

Interesting battle nontheless, it was fun to debate it. Maybe I will do more Honkai Impact - DnD fights in the future since they are both strong verses that rarely gets interesting fights.

 

[Jackof_noTrades068]

Vecna does understand higher dimensional stuff though. We have evidence of even mortals managing to seal away Tier 1 creatures (see: Pandorym) and Vecna himself is capable of analyzing aberrations and Elder Evils, such as Father Llymic, the Uvuudaum, and civilizations like the Mind Flayers.

Then I’m giving my vote to vecna
Guess Kevin couldn’t brick wall his way through this situation could he

 

[Lapsad]

What venca will do after his precog ?

 

[Schnee_One]

Whatever makes him win

 

[Mr. Bambu]

What venca will do after his precog ?

Act accordingly, I suppose. Vecna knows quite unironically millions of spells, fed to him directly by the Serpent himself. If he can foresee one that works, all he really needs to do is think.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Then I’m giving my vote to vecna
Guess Kevin couldn’t brick wall his way through this situation could he

Well hold on now, does Kevin have a means of victory? Like does he have High 1-C hax to match his resistances? If he can't incap or kill Vecna then this would be a stomp.