V Revision

[RadicalMrR]

Attack Potency and Durability

During the 4th corporate war Adam Smasher and Morgan Blackhand fought on top of Arasaka Tower while a pocket nuke went off.

A nuclear explosion of this level is at bare minimum 10 tons of tnt (High 8-C) and 1 kiloton at maximum (8-A).

In CP 2077, despite Smasher having a new and improved body, V can cut through him even on the highest difficulties by himself.

Speed

Tech Weapons implement railgun technology, which makes their bullets be fired at about mach 6.

V and some enemies can dodge these normally. V also has a cyberware called Sandevistan. While its active V can perceive both the tech weapons shots and the the enemies who can dodge them in slow motion all the while his movements r perceived in the same speed.



Proposed Changes

The bomb looks like its on the lower end plus Smasher and Morgan survived the top of the explosion so i think 8-C, Likely Higher is a decent middle ground.

V's Speed should be Hypersonic, Higher with with Sandevistan.

The AP rating should have its own Key. If V tries to fight Smasher at the beginning of the game hell get killed within seconds. V can still survive grenades and stuff so the 9-B rating is fine.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Um, did I read the numerals correctly? You said 1000 tons of tnt and said that was High 8-C (Which is more like 2 to 11 tons of TNT) and that 1 Kiloton is 8-A (100 tons to 1 kiloton). 1000 tons or 1 Kiloton is actually the baseline for Low 7-C. Otherwise, there's some guess work here and there. Were those actually calculated?

 

[RadicalMrR]

Um, did I read the numerals correctly? You said 1000 tons of tnt and said that was High 8-C (Which is more like 2 to 11 tons of TNT) and that 1 Kiloton is 8-A (100 tons to 1 kiloton). 1000 tons or 1 Kiloton is actually the baseline for Low 7-C. Otherwise, there's some guess work here and there. Were those actually calculated?

I used the W54 as a base. Its about the same size as the nuke Johnny used.

 

[RadicalMrR]

I ****** up the 0s lol

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Oh yeah, then it should have said varies from High 8-C+ to baseline Low 7-C. But fair enough.

 

[RadicalMrR]

Yea. The explosion looks kinda small but 2 of these were enough to total the entire corpo district so i just went with the lowest possible interpretation since everything was hella vague.

 

[RadicalMrR]

Bump

 

[Armorchompy]

You should factor surface area in the nuke stuff, and put the calculations in a blog. Pretty impressive upgrade anyway.

 

[KLOL506]

You should factor surface area in the nuke stuff, and put the calculations in a blog. Pretty impressive upgrade anyway.

We use cross-sectional area with explosions, not surface area, as cross-sectional area includes the amount by which the explosive yield decreases the farther you are from the explosion's epicenter, surface area doesn't count in the distance. Clearly says so on the Explosion Radius Page where for inverse-square law we use cross-sectional area (Otherwise you can't calc the feat at all).

AKA you'd have to find the distance the characters were away from the epicenter first. If the explosion happens smack-dab in their face or right under their legs or under their ass, then it'd scale in full.

 

[RadicalMrR]

You should factor surface area in the nuke stuff, and put the calculations in a blog. Pretty impressive upgrade anyway.

I could do that but id need a second opinion.

After looking at it again, it wasnt 2 nukes. Just the one obliterated the corpo district. So wanna know if people think i should use the low or high end.

 

[KLOL506]

I could do that but id need a second opinion.

After looking at it again, it wasnt 2 nukes. Just the one obliterated the corpo district. So wanna know if people think i should use the low or high end.

Can you tell us how far away the characters were from the explosion's epicenter? And if they have any other feats on this level?

 

[Armorchompy]

We use cross-sectional area with explosions, not surface area, as cross-sectional area includes the amount by which the explosive yield decreases the farther you are from the explosion, surface area doesn't. Clearly says so on the Explosion Radius Page where for inverse-square law we use cross-sectional area.

AKA you'd have to find the distance the characters were away from the epicenter first. If the explosion happens smack-dab in their face or right under their legs or under their ass, then it'd scale in full.

I'm pretty sure a recent revision was made that means a point-blank explosion is still affected by cross-sectional or whatever it was.

I could do that but id need a second opinion.

After looking at it again, it wasnt 2 nukes. Just the one obliterated the corpo district. So wanna know if people think i should use the low or high end.

I'm not too knowledgeable on CP2077 but I think it's very justified to have an "At least X, possibly/likely X" rating.

 

[KLOL506]

I'm pretty sure a recent revision was made that means a point-blank explosion is still affected by cross-sectional or whatever it was.

Nope, there hasn't been any thread like that about surface area at all (If anything, it was rejected on the DC Superman Apokolips revision thread it was being talked about, I was on that thread. The only time we accepted its use was exclusively for massive planetary-sized impacts where planets impact into you and other acts of god like massive meteor impacts but DT says that surface area is the least of your problems with feats like that as there are other factors to take into account, but which ones exactly I completely forgot, but that if the planets don't get destroyed in the process of colliding with each other into you or the meteor hitting you remains mostly intact, you'd scale to the full yield, that's what DT said). You can ask DontTalk and Spinosaurus75DinosaurFan if you wish. Hopefully this fixes the confusion.

Also no, cross-sectional area and surface area are not the same thing. Cross-sectional area is usually less than half of the human surface area and is usually 0.68 m^2 for the average 1.75m tall 62 kg heavy human (Can vary heavily if your height and weight are different), plus you'll need a specific distance from the epicenter to properly calc explosions tanked from a distance, whatever distance it may be. You really can't use surface area in those cases at all.

 

[RadicalMrR]

Can you tell us how far away the characters were from the explosion's epicenter? And if they have any other feats on this level?

They were the building of the explosion. About 80ish meters away

 

[KLOL506]

They were the building of the explosion. About 80ish meters away

That would knock down the results of the actual yield tanked severely.

The farther you are from the epicenter, the lower the durability needed to tank the explosion as the energy dissipates over the distance.

 

[RadicalMrR]

As far as feats go, this is the best one and it was done by the god tiers of the verse. Not even Johnny could stand up to Smasher.

 

[RadicalMrR]

That would knock down the results of the actual yield tanked severely.

Better than Wall level lmao

 

[KLOL506]

OK so, using the inverse-square law formula from the Explosion Radius page...

I= P/A where P equals to the yield in tons of TNT and A is the area is in m^2 with the radius being the distance the person was away from the epicenter.

I= (10 Tons of TNT) / (4π((80m)^2))= 0.00012433979 tons of TNT or 520237.68136 J (Wall level)

Using average cross-sectional area of 0.68 m^2 since I don't know the height or weight of the characters tanking it, the result is knocked down to 353761.5932 J or 0.00008455105 tons of TNT (Still Wall level)

SEVERELY DISAPPOINTING.

But this is a low-end.

For the high-end, you really should pixel-scale to find the radius of the explosion and put it in the nuke calculator for the yield.

But in any case, let's just assume 1 kiloton.

I= (1000 Tons of TNT) / (4π((80m)^2))= 0.01243397992 tons of TNT or 52023771.98528 J (9-A)

Multiply it with 0.68 m^2 and it gets us 0.00845510634 tons of TNT or 35376164.92656001 (9-A)

 

[RadicalMrR]

For the high-end, you really should pixel-scale to find the radius of the explosion and put it in the nuke calculator for the yield.

The thing is that im not sure thats the explosion. Like i said, the nuke destroyed the entire corpo district.

 

[KLOL506]

The thing is that im not sure thats the explosion. Like i said, the nuke destroyed the entire corpo district.

OOF. Then it might be more powerful than I estimated.

And the characters were 80 meters away from the epicenter of the explosion, yes?

Do we have any reasonable estimates as to how big the corpo district is? That might buff the results significantly even with the inverse-square law being in effect.

So ye, figure out the exact size of the corpo district. Otherwise I don't think we can use this nuke feat. The rest of the feats seem legit tho.

 

[RadicalMrR]

And the characters were 80 meters away from the epicenter of the explosion, yes?

The explosion was on the 120th storey, the characters were on the 150th storey.

Do we have any reasonable estimates as to how big the corpo district is? That might buff the results significantly even with the inverse-square law being in effect?

The tabletop game has some rough drawings of it. The game has the whole thing.

 

[KLOL506]

So, 30 storeys away, with each storey being 3.5 meters as a low-ball, they'd be around 105 meters away from the explosion, lowers the results a bit but eh. Like I said, you still have to find the total area of the Corpo District anyway, something as big as that that can't be blown up so easily by a 1 kiloton nuke anyway.

 

[ThisThingisReallyBroken]

A central plot point of the story was V dying because he was shot in the head. Irrc 8-C’s aren’t exactly affected by normal piercing damage.

He was also pinned down by that Muscular girl in the Pacifica District,who should be much weaker than 8-C.


thanks for the revision tho

 

[RadicalMrR]

Ill figure out the AP later then.

How does everyone feel about the speed??

 

[ThisThingisReallyBroken]

Seems legit to me

 

[RadicalMrR]

A central plot point of the story was V dying because he was shot in the head. Irrc 8-C’s aren’t exactly affected by normal piercing damage.

He was also pinned down by that Muscular girl in the Pacifica District,who should be much weaker than 8-C.


thanks for the revision tho

All of that was before the fight with Smasher.

 

[KLOL506]

A central plot point of the story was V dying because he was shot in the head. Irrc 8-C’s aren’t exactly affected by normal piercing damage.

He was also pinned down by that Muscular girl in the Pacifica District,who should be much weaker than 8-C.


thanks for the revision tho

Bullets in fiction can't be trusted LOL (Unless you want 10-C Thor or 10-C DBS characters or High 1-B bullets), plus, them being 105 meters away from the epicenter means the value of the explosion tanked dips greatly due to cross-sectional area AKA inverse square law. And like Radical said, all this happens before the fight with Smasher.

But for the most part, bullets in CP2077 are 9-B even with the weakest shit.

Also AP =/= LS

 

[ThisThingisReallyBroken]

Yeah sure, sounds familiar to Geralt nearly dying by getting stabbed by a pitchfork. So might be PIS.

Also he did get a robotic body, maybe it implies he took some heavy damage after the explosion?

 

[KLOL506]

Yeah sure, sounds familiar to Geralt nearly dying by getting stabbed by a pitchfork. So might be PIS.

Also he did get a robotic body, maybe it implies he took some heavy damage after the explosion?

9-A fodder humans with a pitchfork in Witcher 3 mind you

Some screenshots show 2023 Adam being almost fully cyborgized so IDK. In any case, even with the inverse-square law and the cross sectional area stuff once we figure out the size of Corpo Tower, the results might be a bit too high for the usual 9-B tier stuff.

 

[RadicalMrR]

Yeah sure, sounds familiar to Geralt nearly dying by getting stabbed by a pitchfork. So might be PIS.

Also he did get a robotic body, maybe it implies he took some heavy damage after the explosion?

Probably. Aside from the exploaion he also survived the building collapsing.

Hopefully Morgan shows up in the dlc. His whole thing is that he doesnt use cyberwear so him surviving is way more impressive then Smasher.

 

[ThisThingisReallyBroken]

High 8-C V tho,damn.

we can pin him against Geralt

 

[KLOL506]

High 8-C V tho,damn.

we can pin him against Geralt

Too bad Adam was 105 meters away from the epicenter so kiss V being High 8-C goodbye

 

[Armorchompy]

Yeah, getting hurt by bullets is... barely an anti-feat in fiction, unless coupled with different anti-feats.

 

[ThisThingisReallyBroken]

Too bad Adam was 105 meters away from the epicenter so kiss V being High 8-C goodbye

reee,he still might be 8-C. Geralt has his nonbuffed 8-C key.

 

[KLOL506]

reee,he still might be 8-C. Geralt has his nonbuffed 8-C key.

Assuming the Corpo District is large enough, prolly might hit that value, yes.

And it would exclusively apply to endgame characters.

But these dudes look way bigger than average height or weight and thus their cross sectional area is also likely much larger than the average man's, so finding their real height and weight might give us the real values for their surface area (And then to find their cross-sectional area, multiply surface area with 0.5 as cross sectional area is 40-50% that of surface area but the 40% is only for the average sized human and assuming half the surface area might be a slight overestimation but it should work for characters with stated heights and such, maybe assume everyone to be as tall as Silverhand AKA Keanu Reeves, larger the cross sectional area, the higher the amount of the yield they take, you get the drift)

 

[RadicalMrR]

So ive got some numbers.

Corpo district is 750 M in diameter.

From Arasaka tower, itd need a blast radius of 500 M to take out Corpo Plaza.

Wuts the current formula for nukes?

 

[RadicalMrR]

Half a million were fatally injured.

Another quarter million people died from the blast within the following months

I played with Nuke Map a bit. Used New York a basis since its the closest to Night City with about 2.5 million more inhabitants.

An airborne Nuke would need to be about 5-10 kilotons to match the mortality rate from tge NC nuke.

 

[RadicalMrR]

5 kiloton nuke means the 2 were in the fire ball range

 

[KLOL506]

Try the stardestroyer nuke calculator and use it from there to figure out how much yield is required to hit your specific radius for near-total fatalities, that's how we figure out out the yield.

And assuming it exploded on top of the building at the 150th storey, each storey being at least 3.5 meters tall according to most normal building schematics as a lowball from google search, 150*3.5= 525 meters.

That's just the radius to get through the building, we'll also need to add the Corpo district's radius to that 525m value as well.

750/2= 375m

So, 525+375= 900 meters. 0.9 km radius

This is the current formula for nukes-

Air blast radius (near-total fatalities) Yield: Y = ((x/0.28)^3)/1000 with Y in megatons of TNT and x the radius in km

((0.9/0.28)^3)/1000= 0.03320881924 megatons of TNT. 33.209 kilotons of TNT. (7-C, Town Level). Since it's an actual nuke, no need to divide the result.

But Stardestroyer tells me to hit a 900 meter near-fatalities radius, the yield needs to be higher than 0.03434696 megatons or well above 34.34696 kilotons. I'd say this is the more accurate value honestly.

Now, inverse-square law ft. Cross-Sectional Area
I= P/A where P is the yield in tons of TNT and A is the area of the diameter covered by the explosion with the radius being in meters (Radius is the distance the person is away from the explosion)

I= P / (4π((R)^2)) where P is, well, the yield in tons and R is the radius in meters AKA your distance from the epicenter of the big boom

I= (34346.96) / (4π((105)^2))= 0.24791330903 tons of TNT (9-A+). Multiply the yield tanked with average cross-sectional area of 0.68 m^2 and you get 0.16858105014 tons of TNT, still 9-A+ (I really don't think we should be using this specific cross-sectional area when we can just plainly assume everyone in CP2077 to be the same size as Silverhand AKA Keanu Reeves, AKA larger cross-sectional area AKA they take more of the big boom AKA higher dura yield)

Now I'm not sure if we can treat this is an air-blast radius since we don't know if the bomb was situated on the ground or it was tossed into mid-air and exploded in that moment during the fighting. If it is the former (Which it definitely looks like it to me), use the ground-based explosion radius formula, in which case, the yield could be a lot higher, KEK.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Oh yeah, KLOL is right.